Tiger Moth joy flights - chocks for starting?
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Aus
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The operator I worked for 99% of the time had some one else on to start me, or me to start some one else in the same manner as chumbo does.
However being a relatively small operator occasionally you had to start your-self and the boss had developed a procedure (over a decade or so flying Tigers) which worked quite well.
Chocks in front of both main wheels and rope that is attached to both chocks running back under the fuselarge and out behind left wing.
Tell passenger (who is already straped in) 3 times to keep hands away and not to touch throttle.
Prime and start as normal.
Turn other Magneto on and adjust throttle (via front seat throttle) if too high.
Hold firmly on to the centre struts and put one foot on wheel, next foot on wing-walk and climb over wing (safer than it sounds as with firm grip was very sturdy and easy to do).
Stand on ground right up against fuselarge and wing, with right hand on rear throttle grab pre-laid rope with left hand and give firm tug (some pilots are better practiced at this than others) and this will remove the chocks.
Stand on wing-walk and then climb in as normal (at this point we had our hand off the throttle for no more than 2-3 seconds).
Still not perfect but we did practice doing this a few times before we had to for real and in my opion as safe as any thing when done properly.
no one.
However being a relatively small operator occasionally you had to start your-self and the boss had developed a procedure (over a decade or so flying Tigers) which worked quite well.
Chocks in front of both main wheels and rope that is attached to both chocks running back under the fuselarge and out behind left wing.
Tell passenger (who is already straped in) 3 times to keep hands away and not to touch throttle.
Prime and start as normal.
Turn other Magneto on and adjust throttle (via front seat throttle) if too high.
Hold firmly on to the centre struts and put one foot on wheel, next foot on wing-walk and climb over wing (safer than it sounds as with firm grip was very sturdy and easy to do).
Stand on ground right up against fuselarge and wing, with right hand on rear throttle grab pre-laid rope with left hand and give firm tug (some pilots are better practiced at this than others) and this will remove the chocks.
Stand on wing-walk and then climb in as normal (at this point we had our hand off the throttle for no more than 2-3 seconds).
Still not perfect but we did practice doing this a few times before we had to for real and in my opion as safe as any thing when done properly.
no one.
Hi Chuck,
Just got my computer fixed this arvo - couldn't see your video before - but its all good now.
NICE Hoffman Prop. And LOOKS VERY NICE aeroplane.
Congrats on such a NICE machine.!!
Cheers
Just got my computer fixed this arvo - couldn't see your video before - but its all good now.
NICE Hoffman Prop. And LOOKS VERY NICE aeroplane.
Congrats on such a NICE machine.!!
Cheers
Auster Autocar J5G shot down?
Congrats on such a NICE machine.!!
Dr
Grandpa Aerotart
No not mine - but I am very lucky the owner is a mate and lets me fly it - a LOT
And just in case you haven't seen this vid either - any excuse for some Tiger Moth porn
Pretending to be a Pitts Special
And just in case you haven't seen this vid either - any excuse for some Tiger Moth porn
Pretending to be a Pitts Special
Speaking of 'ground handling' the Tiger sans brakes.....
In a strong wind when taxying downwind, down the runway at a country AD for T/O, and trying to gun the throttle to turn the 'old girl' around into the wind for the T/O, the best solution was to ...
Close the throttle so that the donk just 'ticks' over,
Drop the side 'gate',
Step out,
Pick it up by the tail strut and turn it around into wind,
Gently place tail back on ground,
Get back in and go...
Otherwise the wind would get under the up-wind wing and lift it - just as the turning motion, if any in a strong wind, would also cause the up-wind wheel to lift, thereby causing the 'old girl' to tip over onto the opposite wheel and the assoc. wingtip - thus wearing / causing abrasion to the fabric to the lower mainplane underside fabric.
Our 'clever' little LAME soon fixed that - with a nice little curved bamboo strip secured firmly under each lower wing-tip.
Worked a treat, but we still preferred to turn it around 'manually' when the morning Wheatbelt 'Easterlies'' were a'blowin'...
Good ole' days...
In a strong wind when taxying downwind, down the runway at a country AD for T/O, and trying to gun the throttle to turn the 'old girl' around into the wind for the T/O, the best solution was to ...
Close the throttle so that the donk just 'ticks' over,
Drop the side 'gate',
Step out,
Pick it up by the tail strut and turn it around into wind,
Gently place tail back on ground,
Get back in and go...
Otherwise the wind would get under the up-wind wing and lift it - just as the turning motion, if any in a strong wind, would also cause the up-wind wheel to lift, thereby causing the 'old girl' to tip over onto the opposite wheel and the assoc. wingtip - thus wearing / causing abrasion to the fabric to the lower mainplane underside fabric.
Our 'clever' little LAME soon fixed that - with a nice little curved bamboo strip secured firmly under each lower wing-tip.
Worked a treat, but we still preferred to turn it around 'manually' when the morning Wheatbelt 'Easterlies'' were a'blowin'...
Good ole' days...
Join Date: Dec 2004
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A37575 - just a quick point. I used to work for that operator.
Yes, training was provided.
Yes we had access to the throttle at all times via the front seat when starting.
Yes passengers were briefed on what not to touch.
Yes we didn't use chocks because on the grass the tiger needed about 1500 RPM to start moving.
And Yes we had a written exemption from CASA to start the aircraft in that fashion.
I don't fly for them any more, but from my 15 years in the industry, the operation was no more unsafe than anywhere else I've worked.
Yes, training was provided.
Yes we had access to the throttle at all times via the front seat when starting.
Yes passengers were briefed on what not to touch.
Yes we didn't use chocks because on the grass the tiger needed about 1500 RPM to start moving.
And Yes we had a written exemption from CASA to start the aircraft in that fashion.
I don't fly for them any more, but from my 15 years in the industry, the operation was no more unsafe than anywhere else I've worked.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NZ
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Finally, something interesting being discussed in this forum instead of (what school should I go to? or what headset do u use? or what is better, the glass panel warrior or the learjet type 545533 version a with unducted turbo fans). lol
Chimbu, awesome vids. Tell me that wasn't u doing the 8 point roll? HOW do you do that? I was tearing around in my mates tiger yesterday on a beautiful NZ winter's day as it turns out, and I am still trying to get my slow rolls right nevermind an 8 pointer!
Have you ever done an aerobatic competitions in the Tiger?
I also start them from behind, when doing joyrides (several in a row), when the eng is warm, I happily start them without chocks, I put my foot in front of the tyre however if it is just the one flight at a time I put the chocks in place and just take my time.
Here is one of Gav's pics from a shoot we did earlier in the year.
Chimbu, awesome vids. Tell me that wasn't u doing the 8 point roll? HOW do you do that? I was tearing around in my mates tiger yesterday on a beautiful NZ winter's day as it turns out, and I am still trying to get my slow rolls right nevermind an 8 pointer!
Have you ever done an aerobatic competitions in the Tiger?
I also start them from behind, when doing joyrides (several in a row), when the eng is warm, I happily start them without chocks, I put my foot in front of the tyre however if it is just the one flight at a time I put the chocks in place and just take my time.
Here is one of Gav's pics from a shoot we did earlier in the year.
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Just a quick one on removing chocks...yeh a mate of mine has a midget, what worries me about hand swinging from in front is being so far away from the throttle and mags....and in a really dodgy position should the brakes fail or chocks forget to be put in place....
I think that is what is so good about the Tiger, the prop has enormous ground clearance, and you can comfortably walk down the wing with your right hand touching the leading edge) to remove chocks. A mate of mine gave a chocks away signal for me to get down to take them away from the Triplane he was about to go flying in....oh boy, that was scary. I had no idea how close the prop was to the front wheels until I was down there carefully removing the chock without flinging it into the prop....freaky stuff.
I think that is what is so good about the Tiger, the prop has enormous ground clearance, and you can comfortably walk down the wing with your right hand touching the leading edge) to remove chocks. A mate of mine gave a chocks away signal for me to get down to take them away from the Triplane he was about to go flying in....oh boy, that was scary. I had no idea how close the prop was to the front wheels until I was down there carefully removing the chock without flinging it into the prop....freaky stuff.
Grandpa Aerotart
Tell me that wasn't u doing the 8 point roll? HOW do you do that? I was tearing around in my mates tiger yesterday on a beautiful NZ winter's day as it turns out, and I am still trying to get my slow rolls right nevermind an 8 pointer!
Have you ever done an aerobatic competitions in the Tiger?
Have you ever done an aerobatic competitions in the Tiger?
You need 120KIAS to start with. Think long and hard about what you need to do with the controls to achieve an 8 point roll - couch fly it - then go up and have a go - DO NOT think about what you need to do with the controls when you're actually doing it - its all about timing - rhythm if you like.
No - it has been suggested - I think I need more practice.
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.s. I've always found the C150 etc a difficult aircraft to swing, because the magneto impulse point is so low that you are literally bending down / over, and slightly out of balance in that swinging motion....ooops
If the operator cannot afford a battery then it smacks of cost-cutting/penny pinching. But of course - typical general aviation operation
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tiger start sequence, from the front.
You need to have a technique which is safe and more importantly, you have confidence in. It is the people whom are scared that often get bitten. I am not saying there is any one way to start a Tigermoth, just demonstrating the in front sequence.
A self start can be achieved, sure, but no pax on board. Simple instruction on removing chocks is fine and that leaves the pilot free to start and climb in, get settled, then call chocks away and have passenger climb in. albeit it is better to have a ground crew.
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"Hi Max.....I heard your weapon jammed?" We ALL knew the story.
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Chimbu I concur on Max Holdsworth, did an instrument rating test in the mid 1970's with this obnoxious,snarly,nasty old buzzard and experienced the worst
behaviour I have ever seen in my career. An example of creating a terrible cockpit atmosphere to bring out nothing but fear and loathing in
the candidate. A classic ex RAAF dicky wacker who obviously detested
his job and everyone who crossed his path.
behaviour I have ever seen in my career. An example of creating a terrible cockpit atmosphere to bring out nothing but fear and loathing in
the candidate. A classic ex RAAF dicky wacker who obviously detested
his job and everyone who crossed his path.
My x RAAF CFI in the early 80's steadfastly maintained the only correct and safe way to swing a Tiger was from the front. The swinging action naturally moved your Arm and body forward and away from the Prop.
He learned to fly in Tigers and also had considerable time instructing on them in the RAAF.
He actually hated the things, he said they should all be pushed in a ditch and burnt!!! cranky old bugger
He learned to fly in Tigers and also had considerable time instructing on them in the RAAF.
He actually hated the things, he said they should all be pushed in a ditch and burnt!!! cranky old bugger
Grandpa Aerotart
Yup that was Max.
No idea why but apparently his cannons fired about 1 round each before they all failed. He burnt his remaining fuel whistling past very close trying to tip the Auster over with wake turbulence.
No idea why but apparently his cannons fired about 1 round each before they all failed. He burnt his remaining fuel whistling past very close trying to tip the Auster over with wake turbulence.