SARTIME minus 5

[Dick N. Cider]

Jaba,

If you're at Brissie on the 5th you will be made most welcome. We do have a line to HF Flightwatch, after all they have to call us as well on occasion. Procedurally though we write it down, pass to the flight data guys who then send an ATFN message which (as I understand it) interacts automatically with the CENSAR database.

It's occasionally tedious but usually not too bad. Getting sh!tty about it with the pilot who is trying to do the right thing is pointless. It's part of what we do. My motto is just get on with it. The having to write it down bit is to ensure no senior moments and cover @rses when someone gets it wrong. Ideally an integrated function on TAAATS would be great but such enhancements are hideously expensive. You'll see what I mean on that Sunday.

DNC

[le Pingouin]

The problem with ATC handling VFR SARTIMES is it's not robust - easy for us to drop because it's not an integrated part of our system. Personally I'm more than happy to do it but dealing directly with CENSAR minimises handling, reducing the chance of error.

Peuce, a direct link would be great but would likely cost a shedload because it's new functionality (do you work for Thales? ). And stop it at once! You're being logical.

Jaba, IFR SAR is handled by TAAATS. It wasn't always as automated as it is now as it started off as a purely ATC system with no specific functionality for "G" operations. Hopefully you'll get a good show in BrisVegas.

[ravan]

Very enlightening and educational......thanks in particular to the ATCOs for their input.

[Aerodynamisist]

Thanks to our collages at ATC for filling us in on the internal process, will minus 5 given the possible delays be enough do you think ? or would minus 15 be better ?

[tmpffisch]

will minus 5 given the possible delays be enough do you think ? or would minus 15 be better ?

The name of the game isn't to rely on your phone reminding you to cancel your SAR...it's just as a last resort if you're a big enough **** to forget to cancel it in the first place. Just do whatever you need to remind yourself that your SAR needs to be cancelled, whether it's an alarm 1 minute before it expires, or if you need to, 10 alarms!

I find it annoying that AirServices has to fork out the cash to do a promotion for a relatively simple thing like this, when they could be spending it on something more important! Maybe they should encourage people to leave a flightnote or company SAR's, instead of a SAR with CENSAR

I wonder how many pilots forget to cancel their SARWATCH every year........

[multi_engined]

I think it's a great idea, but how many people have their phone readily avaiable to them when flying? Students especially should be concentrating on flying the aircraft rather than looking for the mobile phone at the end of a clearoff check

Our company operates to company sartime, How many GA operators do this? The only time we nominate with censar is for night ops when nobody is manning the office.

[Jabawocky]

Mr Cider

My mistake.......its the 7th of September if you are there

I'll have my eye out for Noel P and a few others I know.....so lookout!

Pity the VFR folk can't be processed the same way. When ever I have a VFR SARTIME lodged its only when I can't phone them on arrival that I would ask ATC.

Muli..... most likley not students and GA operators, I would guess its PVT ops....but I could be very wrong

[max1]

Jaba

Glad to see you visiting. To anyone else, don't be a stranger, come along if you can and visit.

[multi_engined]

As a commercial pilot I check my phone probably every five to ten minutes during flight, it is quite common to get a text message or phone call from the boss changing details of the flight. 208 has a small crevice behind the power lever where it fits in snug.

[Homesick-Angel]

Naips for Iphone works well for cancelling Sars...

Im going to an ATC info night in melbourne..looking forward to it.

[Phil Vabre]

I wonder how many pilots forget to cancel their SARWATCH every year........

About 12,000.

[Charlie Foxtrot India]

I just blame the student....

[Nautilus Blue]

About 12,000.

Phil, any idea how many sartimes are lodged each year. I'm curious as to what % that is.

NB

PS

I find it annoying that AirServices has to fork out the cash to do a promotion for a relatively simple thing like this, when they could be spending it on something more important! Maybe they should encourage people to leave a flightnote or company SAR's, instead of a SAR with CENSAR

Now if we were a bank, we'd charge $2 to hold the sartime, and $20 dishonoring fee if they weren't cancelled

[tmpffisch]

Good one Phil.

Now tell us the difference between SARTIME and SARWATCH.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Well Mr Nautilas - you may be closer than you think in your thinking................

Many years ago now, when the Flight Service services debate was raging - like - how do we get rid of them - a plan 'floated' by ASA management was to

'Introduce a pricing regime to discourage participation'.......

Self explanatory really.
Introduce a fee for SARTIMES and that would stop them DEAD!!

Then they could have deleted the SARTIME function and got rid of a few more staff.....

Also 'mooted' at the time was to charge those pilots who called on the radio for operational info when on the ground at a location at which a phone was avbl....less air/ground staff req'd. Call the Briefing Office for the info.

Briefing Officers were paid at a lower rate......

The plan never reached 'fruition' - not sure why....
Although they did introduce the 'pre paid phone card' system...

Cheers

[morno]

Yes they did Griffo, but I'm pretty sure most people now just have the direct phone number, which we don't have to pay for, .

morno

[peuce]

tmpffisch,

Now tell us the difference between SARTIME and SARWATCH.

If that's a serious question, I'll have a go ...

SARTIME ... Search And Rescue Time ... that is, a nominated time for arrival at a nominated place ... after which, they go looking for you.... before which, they dont.... unless they have a bad feeling in their stomach about you. Available to anyone.

SARWATCH ... Search And Rescue Watch ... that is, a continuous veil of love and care. If you don't answer me, at any time, I go looking for you immediately. So don't ignore me! Mandatory for all aircraft subject to 'continuous two way communication with ATC' ... for any reason.

[tmpffisch]

Thanks Peuce. (It wasn't a serious question). It was just that Phil Vabre can't read.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Too Troo Morno,

Never did get one of those pay-card-phone thingies - on a matter of principle....

Why should I have to pay for that which I am required to have......

Just another form of 'indirect taxation' really.....IMHO....

I feel the same about maps/charts/amendments...but some things I just have to purchase- although it really pppp's me orf.

See reason above.

[onezeroonethree]

Been doing this since the early days of my PPL after CENSAR called me up angrily telling me off

When I lodge my flight plan I set 3 alarms into my phone and put my phone on silent. (yeah I'm paranoid now). I always turn my phone on loud when I get out of a plane - habbit so it works for me. If I'm still in the air and my sartime is approaching my phone simply begins to vibrate 30mins early in my pocket. A quick vibration = sms/call which I ignore. If it continues for ages I take a look at it if possible and reminds me its sartime.

I remember my old nokias you could actually turn off with an alarm set and even with the phone turned off - the alarm would turn the phone on and start buzzing... have not come across a phone with that ability in years tho