Jaa Atpl conversion to Nz CPL question

[ZK-IWI]

Thanks guys, I can confirm that I will be looking at the initial NZ MEIR issue since it's done via a JAA MEIR conversion process. The ideal examiner would be both CAA and TRE qualified... !

27/09 you made a very valid point and with no job waiting for me at the end yet, it will be a tough call to decide which way is best (single or multicrew). Not too sure what you mean by 'cutting corners' though.
As naive as it may sound, I did not realize that holding an IR multi-crew would somehow disqualify you from applying for a single pilot job.

[27/09]

I'm not suggesting you were cutting corners, just that some prospective employers may wonder why you went about the conversion process the way you suggested you might, as it may be considered an unusual way to do it.

So far as the multi crew IR is concerned wrt to a single pilot job. A multi crew IR doesn't qualify you to fly single pilot IFR, not in NZ anyway. A prospective employer for a single pilot role would most probably want you to have the single pilot endorsement prior to considering you for the job, and almost definitely would make it a requirement that you obtain one prior to commencement of employment if the job was given to you.

[DeltaT]

@IWI, there isn't an actual 'conversion' from a EU licence to the NZ one because NZ does not recognise any other licence directly other than an Australian one, unless you have 1000hrs post issue etc as described earlier.
Its all about protecting the country's own qualification and making money out of you, just as it is for many other qualifications. Though $300 for a NZ medical admin fee is another story...
You are doing a MEIR initial because you do not have a NZ one (from what you say) or its been more than 5yrs from when you had one here? (not sure on that one)
Australia however does recognise the European licence directly so its easier to get like for like, though you still end up having to do a IR test anyway, unless you go the way as discussed at the start of the thread.
As for the IR's, view it this way, a Multi Crew IR is actually a step down from a Single Pilot IR and not the other way! All those pilots in Mutli Crew jobs, unless they have specifically done otherwise, all have lapsed Single Pilot IRs.

[ZK-IWI]

Good to know! I really do appreciate your opinions, in the end it may be wiser to select the single pilot route... will need to seriously weigh up pros and cons before starting the IR training.

DeltaT there is unfortunately no previously-acquired NZ licence I can use, the MEIR will be an initial issue (theory + flight test).

Something I still cannot quite process is the endorsement attached to the IR. Take the example of flying a King Air: please correct me if I'm wrong but this aircraft can be operated both single pilot and multicrew. Now assuming for a moment you've got a valid Type Rating and a fresh MEIR Single Pilot, can't you fly 'multicrew' with a rated co-pilot ? Workload aside, not much would change...right?

[27/09]

Something I still cannot quite process is the endorsement attached to the IR. Take the example of flying a King Air: please correct me if I'm wrong but this aircraft can be operated both single pilot and multicrew. Now assuming for a moment you've got a valid Type Rating and a fresh MEIR Single Pilot, can't you fly 'multicrew' with a rated co-pilot ? Workload aside, not much would change...right?

Re your question "Workload aside not much would change right?" Yes and No. I'm guessing you've not done any or much single pilot IFR, otherwise you'd know the cockpit dynamics are quite different between single pilot and two pilot IFR.

WRT to two pilot ops in a single pilot aircraft you are getting to into another can of worms. If the aircraft's flight manual doesn't require two pilot ops then it can be operated single pilot, however due to CAA rules for IFR ATO's it must have an operative autopilot for single pilot ops otherwise it must be a two pilot operation.

If the aircraft has an operative autopilot then there is no requirement for a two pilot operation and while it can be flown two pilot there has been debate as to whether or not the "second" pilot is allowed to log co-pilot time. However if the Captain was only two pilot rated then there would be a need for a co-pilot.

[ZK-IWI]

27/09

Got it! It all makes more sense now.

[DeltaT]

Also, if said Single Pilot certified aircraft is set down in the Company Ops Manual to only be operated 2 crew, then that logged 'multi crew time' is acceptable. eg B200, B1900, and some PA31s I've heard of. And for your own ass saving, best to keep a photocopy of that page from the company manual.

[captbod]

NZ ATPL Air Law

Hi Folks
I've just been assessed by ASL for converting my UK JAA ATPL to a NZ ATPL and I am required to sit the Air Law exam and complete an LPC for licence issue. Could anyone offer advice regarding Air Law study material and where I could find a 757/767 sim and a willing NZ TRE. I'm currently working in Auckland on a temporary contract so it would make sense to get as much done whilst I'm down here.

Thanks in advance

Cb

[DeltaT]

Only full motion ZFT sims in NZ are owned by Air NZ in Auckland. (they do have a 767 sim). I don't think even the RNZAF have one for their 757s.
Make contact with Air NZ and I am sure they can supply an obliging TRE.

[captbod]

Thanks for the info DT, I've been in touch with Air New Zealand who are going to email me available dates and prices for the use of their 767 sim. Just need to know which study material to get in order to pass the NZ Air law exam.

[DeltaT]

Try ATTO, airline training and tourism or search around on pprune.
A lot do the Aussie exams and convert back because NZ doesn't have standalone course providers unless you are doing the flying also.

[27/09]

DeltaT Try ATTO, airline training and tourism or search around on pprune.

I don't think ATTTO will be of much use for ATPL law as they are or were the PPSC provider and PPSC don't do ATPL law.

Have a look at these they both provide ATPL law courses and or study material. Pete Sumner used to run courses to don't know if he still does or he may be part of one of the two outfits below.

ATPLOnline.co.nz

Pilot Books for PPL, CPL, IR, BTK & ATPL & ground courses - Waypoints Aviation

DeltaT A lot do the Aussie exams and convert back because NZ doesn't have standalone course providers unless you are doing the flying also.

Not quite correct, see above.

Most do the Aussie courses to get the Aussie ATPL on their licence so they can TTRMA a New Zealand ATPL without having to do a flight test. Also I've got the impression that some think the Aussie ATPL exams are easier, not sure they are though.

[DeltaT]

Yeah I am a bit out of touch with that stuff, such a long time ago I went through all that. No one else was supplying the poor chap with any info!

[redbull21]

FAA ATPL

Gentlemen,

I've read the above posts and have a slight twist to the conversion for my own circumstances.

I have a UK issues JAA CPL (fATPL), with current single pilot MEIR & instructor ratings with 4000+ TT.

I also have an FAA ATP (though no FAA instructor qualifications).

I am NZ bound soon and have a letter of assessment from ASL, although when I had my assessment they were not aware of my FAA ATP.

ASL have said the following:-

I need to sit the NZ CPL Air Law exam and then pass a CPL flight exam conducted by an ASL Flight examiner at which time they will then issue me a NZ CPL.

With that, I then need to sit the NZ Instrument rating law exam and then pass an IR flight exam and an instructor flight exam to then have those ratings added to my NZ CPL.

The question is this, Can I go for a NZ ATPL based on my FAA ATP? I cannot get a UK ATPL until I have 500 hrs Multi Crew but as I have a FAA ATP does that allow me to go for a NZ ATP?

I will contact ASL and ask that question too, however figured someone out there may have already gone through something similar.

Thanks

[27/09]

Redbull

Have you used your FAA ATP, how many hours on the FAA ATP? They probably won't convert a "green" or unused FAA ATP.

[redbull21]

Yes

Hi,

Yes I have passed the FAA ATP written exams & FAA ATP flight test with 4000+ TT, though that is mostly operating in the UK and flight examining under JAA in the USA.

I have not actually used the FAA ATP as I was working for a JAA FTO in the US.

[WhyByFlier]

For people that have done this did you need to send your log books or were copies of the last pages sufficient? Surely they can't expect a pilot in full time employment to send their logbooks, can they?

[Bornfreee]

Yes they do!

I had to send my 3 logbooks to ASL (FeDex), they would not take copies!

Also in the letter of assessment is the requirement to have police criminal checks done for any countries you have lived in for more than 6 months over the last five years. Still waiting for my FBI checks to come through.

[DeltaT]

OK. If you go directly to the NZ licence, you need 1000hrs post ATPL issue flown in that country (EU/UK) before NZ will recognise it.

Remove EU/UK and insert the ICAO country as required.

Yes send the logbooks in and Insure the parcel to the hilt.

[27/09]

I have not actually used the FAA ATP as I was working for a JAA FTO in the US.

Then it's my guess they won't recognise your FAA ATP. No harm in trying though.