Conditions in the Pacific
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Conditions in the Pacific
(quote) from a previous thread
"
Flying the Pacific?
The pacific is probably one of the most benign environs in the world. "
Not so benign lately , for the people living there affected by tsunami, earthquakes, and typhoons.
And B.B., have we reached October yet?
"
Flying the Pacific?
The pacific is probably one of the most benign environs in the world. "
Not so benign lately , for the people living there affected by tsunami, earthquakes, and typhoons.
And B.B., have we reached October yet?
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What a load of rubbish! 
And right in the Pacific is a country which is known to be one of the most challenging places to fly on the planet due to its weather and terrain! On top of that, the Pacific encompasses a vast amount of water with few and far between landing options creating interesting challenges for ETOPS and airline environments let alone smaller stuff. The ITCZ and associated weather is not to be sneezed at. On top of that there are volcanoes and ash from the Pacific 'rim of fire' which frequently dictate some jet ops schedules and routes.
Beware of sweeping statements...
And right in the Pacific is a country which is known to be one of the most challenging places to fly on the planet due to its weather and terrain! On top of that, the Pacific encompasses a vast amount of water with few and far between landing options creating interesting challenges for ETOPS and airline environments let alone smaller stuff. The ITCZ and associated weather is not to be sneezed at. On top of that there are volcanoes and ash from the Pacific 'rim of fire' which frequently dictate some jet ops schedules and routes. Beware of sweeping statements...
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What R U ON Frig bird:
Benign!
Matey try the ITCZ around 15-8 degs Sth, November to April?
Should have tried it before GPS, NDB's that relied on Solar & the Sun!, backed up by Lister generators, that the locals would routinely steel the batteries from so that when you needed the NDB's, they were rendered useless? yes stooging around burning up fuel, arse around your ears?
Not to mention the steeling of the copper wire from the rotor armatures?
Poor to rudimentary Met reporting, getting caught out over the middle of the big blue wet thing on the wrong side of your PNR! creating your own NDB approaches, due to un reported & non forecast met conditions, or in complete contrary to reported? and having to fly into a head wind to align with the strip! Tuvalu & Rotuma for instance?
**** mate, in NZ the air is different and they fly differently, you have to be good to fly in NZ????? yeah right, nothing in this place, compares to my experiences to up in the pacific, will willingly take, Icing, wind, rain, and engine fires at night,any day/ night and twice on Sundays!
Tooooommmmany VB's frigate bird, get a grip mate.
H/Snort.
Matey try the ITCZ around 15-8 degs Sth, November to April?
Should have tried it before GPS, NDB's that relied on Solar & the Sun!, backed up by Lister generators, that the locals would routinely steel the batteries from so that when you needed the NDB's, they were rendered useless? yes stooging around burning up fuel, arse around your ears?
Not to mention the steeling of the copper wire from the rotor armatures?
Poor to rudimentary Met reporting, getting caught out over the middle of the big blue wet thing on the wrong side of your PNR! creating your own NDB approaches, due to un reported & non forecast met conditions, or in complete contrary to reported? and having to fly into a head wind to align with the strip! Tuvalu & Rotuma for instance?
**** mate, in NZ the air is different and they fly differently, you have to be good to fly in NZ????? yeah right, nothing in this place, compares to my experiences to up in the pacific, will willingly take, Icing, wind, rain, and engine fires at night,any day/ night and twice on Sundays!
Tooooommmmany VB's frigate bird, get a grip mate.
H/Snort.
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I suspect that frigatebird was trying to make the same point fellers...
That's on top of all the things to which you correctly refer. The only difference is that the quoted events affect many more people than pilots. 
Not so benign lately , for the people living there affected by tsunami, earthquakes, and typhoons.
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The quote in inverted comma's was not mine. It was made about 6 months ago by someone without real exposure and real time experience of the difficulties faced day to day in this vast area. Pretending things don't happen doesn't make them go away. Anybody with the exposure, can only feel the pain and loss and the tragedy involved with copeing with the natural disasters, and those caused by greed diverting funds from facilities that would make life easier for all. It was 'quoted' here again to remind the person concerned how wrong they were then, and are still, -if they still hold that view !! For my part, I have nothing but admiration for the people of the Pacific with good hearts, who endure, in spite of the elements and the bad circumstance outside their control, and the corruption.
frigate
frigate
Hoggsnortrupert, I think you will find that frigatebird has been there and done that, in fact many times over the past 30 years.
He has considerable experience in the Pacific and Indian oceans, in a wide variety of aircraft types.
In the original post, you may have noticed that he was quoting another thread. I would suggest your comments are a little harsh.
He has considerable experience in the Pacific and Indian oceans, in a wide variety of aircraft types.
In the original post, you may have noticed that he was quoting another thread. I would suggest your comments are a little harsh.
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The only difference is that the quoted events affect many more people than pilots.
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hoggs, if frigatebird is who i think he is, then he has done all that before... 'that' being what you have described, pre-GPS etc.
just a misunderstanding of the quote methinks.
but yes, about "October"...............
just a misunderstanding of the quote methinks.
but yes, about "October"...............
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Frigatebird:
My sincerest APOLOGIES old chap:
Can I buy you a "VB" sometime?
AND YES I AGREE RE THE CORRUPT PACIFIC PEDDLERS & SELF SERVING INDIVIDUALS, AND I WILL ADD "ORGANIZATIONS".
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
H/Snort
Can I buy you a "VB" sometime?
AND YES I AGREE RE THE CORRUPT PACIFIC PEDDLERS & SELF SERVING INDIVIDUALS, AND I WILL ADD "ORGANIZATIONS".
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
H/Snort
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Accepted, and thanks.. I'm just a humble pilot - and I admit I wanted to see if anyone agreed with me - or if I was too.. is 'strange' the word here, given what I've said about the less fortunate. 
'Pacific' is a misnomer, as any sailor who has been out there will tell you.
As for the Pacific countries that I found challenging: Domestic operations in Fiji in a single-pilot-no-autopilot Heron. Do that for a coupla thousand hours and you learn a lot about low level turbulence, wet, slippery runways, crosswinds and generally piss-poor visibility. Fiji is not all like Nadi which is truly 'benign' about 11 months of the year.
THE most difficult place in the South Pacific can be Norfolk Island.
I have had pilots come out from the U.K. - where you would think they could handle weather - and positively wet themselves at the first few night approaches into Norfolk when it's blowing 30 gusting 45 knots and pisssing pickhandles.
I don't have any personal experience of Lord Howe Island but just looking at it in passing, I reckon it would have its moments, too. But there are also some equally bad or worse places north of the equator.
Problem with 'benign' (and this relates particularly to flying here in Oz) is when it does occasionally go bad, everyone is a bit rusty and possibly complacent, so it sneaks up on you. For that reason I almost prefer it when it's crappy the whole time.
As for the Pacific countries that I found challenging: Domestic operations in Fiji in a single-pilot-no-autopilot Heron. Do that for a coupla thousand hours and you learn a lot about low level turbulence, wet, slippery runways, crosswinds and generally piss-poor visibility. Fiji is not all like Nadi which is truly 'benign' about 11 months of the year.
THE most difficult place in the South Pacific can be Norfolk Island.
I have had pilots come out from the U.K. - where you would think they could handle weather - and positively wet themselves at the first few night approaches into Norfolk when it's blowing 30 gusting 45 knots and pisssing pickhandles.
I don't have any personal experience of Lord Howe Island but just looking at it in passing, I reckon it would have its moments, too. But there are also some equally bad or worse places north of the equator.
Problem with 'benign' (and this relates particularly to flying here in Oz) is when it does occasionally go bad, everyone is a bit rusty and possibly complacent, so it sneaks up on you. For that reason I almost prefer it when it's crappy the whole time.
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So, I'm still waiting for an answer?...
where are these islands in the Pacific that are so hard to fly into?
We are talking RPT, aren't we?
where are these islands in the Pacific that are so hard to fly into?
We are talking RPT, aren't we?
Last edited by Captain Nomad; 11th Oct 2009 at 05:01. Reason: spelling
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The steepest I'm aware of in PNG is at Kaintiba, with a minimum slope of 13.3% and maximum of 17%. But there's lots of other tricks. Places like Kanabea (mostly pronounced can o'beer, for reasons known to those who've been there!).
This place has a published slope of just 2.8%, but the strip bends around about the middle. One therefore lands 02 but takes off on 19!
The other place with a bit of a trick is Gonaili, where you land on a 2% downslope and take-off up the slope. Oh yeah, you need to get your numbers right for takeoff because you need to turn before you hit the big hill on the extended centreline!
All these places were served by charter operations - usually in Islanders - but they were pretty regular and, in the old days, played a bit fast and loose with the definition of charter versus that of RPT. These days, some of these places are still served on a pretty regular basis by DHC-6.
As for those who want to think in terms of real RPT, a place like Chimbu - yet another one-way strip - should be enough of a challenge, with a high tension cable stretched across the final approach and take-off area. Sure, it's below the approach path but can be very inconvenient for the ensuing take-off! Oh and Chimbu is at 4900 feet AMSL.
Want more, try a loaded take-off on 12 at Mount Hagen (elev over 5,200 feet), where a fairly prompt left turn needs to be made after take-off, to avoid ground that rises pretty rapidly to 8,800 feet initially and over 13,000 feet beyond that.
I'm sure there's plenty of other places around the Pacific - including parts of South America - with similar problems.
This place has a published slope of just 2.8%, but the strip bends around about the middle. One therefore lands 02 but takes off on 19!
The other place with a bit of a trick is Gonaili, where you land on a 2% downslope and take-off up the slope. Oh yeah, you need to get your numbers right for takeoff because you need to turn before you hit the big hill on the extended centreline!
All these places were served by charter operations - usually in Islanders - but they were pretty regular and, in the old days, played a bit fast and loose with the definition of charter versus that of RPT.
These days, some of these places are still served on a pretty regular basis by DHC-6.As for those who want to think in terms of real RPT, a place like Chimbu - yet another one-way strip - should be enough of a challenge, with a high tension cable stretched across the final approach and take-off area. Sure, it's below the approach path but can be very inconvenient for the ensuing take-off! Oh and Chimbu is at 4900 feet AMSL.
Want more, try a loaded take-off on 12 at Mount Hagen (elev over 5,200 feet), where a fairly prompt left turn needs to be made after take-off, to avoid ground that rises pretty rapidly to 8,800 feet initially and over 13,000 feet beyond that.
I'm sure there's plenty of other places around the Pacific - including parts of South America - with similar problems.
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Other interesting places
Anyone remember Yasawa Island, Koro and Savusavu in the Fiji Islands, even kadavu during the south easterlies. Good fun when you think about it, not so funny during the actual approach.
Last edited by Pacificbird; 19th Oct 2009 at 17:05. Reason: typo
