Ferrying C320 CA - NZ, need ferry pilot etc
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Ferrying C320 CA - NZ, need ferry pilot etc
Like it says in the title - have a nice condition, mid time Cessna 320 to ferry down to NZ. Timing very flexible, and don't intend to cut any corners. I'd like to find a ferry pilot, experienced in both light twins and the transPac route, ideally but not necessarily with an instructor's rating, but definitely one that isn't horrified by the idea of newbie/owner coming along to learn. Will pay the going rate, whatever that might be. Any recommendations welcome.
Also, need to fit out the aircraft in CA - any recommendations for good places? Ferry tank, of course, HF radio, etc etc. Anyone know where I might find a S/HF radio available? Will have a satphone or two as backup...
Feel free to PM me...
Also, need to fit out the aircraft in CA - any recommendations for good places? Ferry tank, of course, HF radio, etc etc. Anyone know where I might find a S/HF radio available? Will have a satphone or two as backup...
Feel free to PM me...
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Talk to Clamback and Hennessy - They know the A to Z of importing and ferrying aircraft. You will certainly learn a lot if your going along for the ride, I'm sure they have contacts in the States for all the equipment you will require.
Clamback & Hennessy
Clamback & Hennessy
DBF Aviation
Don't want to jinx him - but Dave Friend hasn't dropped one yet. Has ferried everything from single-engine Cessnas to SAABs to ATRs all over the world.
Has his own approved tanking systems.
DBF Aviation: 0414 810 023
Has his own approved tanking systems.
DBF Aviation: 0414 810 023
I'd give Rob Leach a call. Google "Air Centre One", he's the CEO.
He's done many ferries from the US to New Zealand. If he can't do it personally I'm very sure he will point you in the right direction.
Rob will have all the contacts and info on HF radios, ferry permits, ferry tanks and any thing else you will need.
Disclaimer: I don't know Rob, I've never met him but I know he knows his stuff.
He's done many ferries from the US to New Zealand. If he can't do it personally I'm very sure he will point you in the right direction.
Rob will have all the contacts and info on HF radios, ferry permits, ferry tanks and any thing else you will need.
Disclaimer: I don't know Rob, I've never met him but I know he knows his stuff.
FTDK, how's the good old Beach purrin' along? (This is a Skyknight.)
Yrs . .. . . smarty pants
v
Twin fridges - SILENT NIGHTS - chocka with long necks after a
long day in yer SKYKNIGHT
Yrs . .. . . smarty pants
v
Twin fridges - SILENT NIGHTS - chocka with long necks after a
long day in yer SKYKNIGHT
Last edited by Fantome; 31st Aug 2009 at 00:08.
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I defiantly don't have anywhere near the requirements for something like this, but other members might be able to help me out... How does one get into the ferry flight game? Is it another one of the old, who you know things or do some company look to hire people at times? A PM with any companies would be great.
SO
SO
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Thx for responses & PMs
Just logged in after a few days away. Thx to all for the very extensive list of PMs...will respond individually over next couple of days.
Will follow up on all the leads kindly provided though.
Yep, FTDK...have gone rather circuitously from Aztec to 340 to 320. Bought the 340, which was well priced and in reasonable nick, for its speed....but as a dedicated taildragger/short strip dude, found myself unhappy with needing 22,000 feet of runway all the time
OK, I'm exaggerating. Slightly. The 340 seemed a tad underpowered to me, and I DO like to be able to land in most places. Found a lovely 320 with 300 low time hp a side and a STOL kit, so am trading up? down? across? to that. That'll do me - should keep me cruising happily up and down NZ for many, many years. Slow down low, fast up high, six seats. The 340 was OK - just didn't quite suit. Felt more like a passenger's aircraft, even a status symbol, which interests me not a bit, than a pilot's machine. What I'm trying to avoid admitting publically is...
...OK...
buying the 340 was dumb. Technically known as a mistake. Should have flown it first - loved the book performance, but there's no substitute for 'feel', and as we all know, real world performance is never quite 'book' You only get the 'feel' by flying the machine BEFORE you agree to buy it. Lesson learned.
Very happy with the 320 tho. Just gotta get it home. Unfortunately you can't crate twins, or I reckon I'd be all over that. Much less drama. Still. The flight across the Pacific would be fun, if I could find appropriately experienced & keen person to do it with. Out of my league, at this stage, to do it solo...
Will follow up on all the leads kindly provided though.
Yep, FTDK...have gone rather circuitously from Aztec to 340 to 320. Bought the 340, which was well priced and in reasonable nick, for its speed....but as a dedicated taildragger/short strip dude, found myself unhappy with needing 22,000 feet of runway all the time
OK, I'm exaggerating. Slightly. The 340 seemed a tad underpowered to me, and I DO like to be able to land in most places. Found a lovely 320 with 300 low time hp a side and a STOL kit, so am trading up? down? across? to that. That'll do me - should keep me cruising happily up and down NZ for many, many years. Slow down low, fast up high, six seats. The 340 was OK - just didn't quite suit. Felt more like a passenger's aircraft, even a status symbol, which interests me not a bit, than a pilot's machine. What I'm trying to avoid admitting publically is......OK...
buying the 340 was dumb. Technically known as a mistake. Should have flown it first - loved the book performance, but there's no substitute for 'feel', and as we all know, real world performance is never quite 'book' You only get the 'feel' by flying the machine BEFORE you agree to buy it. Lesson learned.
Very happy with the 320 tho. Just gotta get it home. Unfortunately you can't crate twins, or I reckon I'd be all over that. Much less drama. Still. The flight across the Pacific would be fun, if I could find appropriately experienced & keen person to do it with. Out of my league, at this stage, to do it solo...
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While it might be desirable to use a ferry pilot, it's not essential. In 2006 a Mooney 201 was flown solo from USA to AU by it's new owner, who, through a FBO in Las Vegas, had the aircraft tanked and fitted out etc, and all en-route, landing, accommodation and re-fueling arrangements were set up for him.
A second option, is you might be able to talk one of the ferry companies into tanking for you and allowing you to fly "in company" with one of their ferries.
If you want a safe, reliable and trustworthy ferry operator, I can recommend Darren Gibson at Australian Air Ferry who ferried for me in 2006.
A second option, is you might be able to talk one of the ferry companies into tanking for you and allowing you to fly "in company" with one of their ferries.
If you want a safe, reliable and trustworthy ferry operator, I can recommend Darren Gibson at Australian Air Ferry who ferried for me in 2006.
Ferry Pilots
Friendly Dave
...and he's the sort of person you CAN spend 47 hours with in a small aeroplane.
...no shortage of good stories.
...no shortage of good stories.
Last edited by Horatio Leafblower; 7th Sep 2009 at 23:56.
While it might be desirable to use a ferry pilot, it's not essential.
Without mentioning names, here are some interesting excerpts from Accident Databases of over-water ferries that ditched.
The NTSB report says the #2 seat was to be removed for the ferry, implying no pax to be carried, but refitted or never removed and a second pilot or passenger carried, while the ATSB report suggests the pilot did not operate the ferry fuel system in accordance with instructions.
and:
The NTSB report says the #2 seat was to be removed for the ferry, implying no pax to be carried, but refitted or never removed and a second pilot or passenger carried, while the ATSB report suggests the pilot did not operate the ferry fuel system in accordance with instructions.
Excerpt from NTSB Report LAX00LA039
The pilot was located and interviewed after he was rescued. He told investigators that he was ferrying the airplane to Hilo with another pilot who holds an Australian pilot's certificate. He stated that he considered the other pilot a "co-pilot" because at his age, he liked to have a second pilot along. A review of the FAA Form 337 indicates that the ferry weight and balance
computation for the ferry flight documented that the co-pilot's seat, and both rear passenger seats, had been subtracted from the basic empty weight. The pilot told investigators that the passenger sat in the No. 2 seat, which he had reinstalled in the aircraft. He stated that he did not have the Form 337 corrected to show that he had reinstalled the No. 2 seat. The pilot stated
that the airplane had undergone a 50-hour inspection, and that it had about 35-38 hours total timeon it when it sank.
The pilot did not return the Pilot/Operator Report after numerous attempts by the investigator to gather this information.
The pilot was located and interviewed after he was rescued. He told investigators that he was ferrying the airplane to Hilo with another pilot who holds an Australian pilot's certificate. He stated that he considered the other pilot a "co-pilot" because at his age, he liked to have a second pilot along. A review of the FAA Form 337 indicates that the ferry weight and balance
computation for the ferry flight documented that the co-pilot's seat, and both rear passenger seats, had been subtracted from the basic empty weight. The pilot told investigators that the passenger sat in the No. 2 seat, which he had reinstalled in the aircraft. He stated that he did not have the Form 337 corrected to show that he had reinstalled the No. 2 seat. The pilot stated
that the airplane had undergone a 50-hour inspection, and that it had about 35-38 hours total timeon it when it sank.
The pilot did not return the Pilot/Operator Report after numerous attempts by the investigator to gather this information.
Excerpt from ATSB Aviation Occurrence Report – 200603333
ANALYSIS
As the aircraft could not be recovered, the reason for the fuel loss cannot be conclusively established. However, from the available information, it is likely that the left aircraft fuel tank was being overfilled by the ferry fuel system and was venting fuel overboard. It is possible that an over-fuelling situation could have developed from one or more of the following factors:
• commencement of fuel transfer from the ferry fuel tank prior to the one hour of flight that would have been in accordance with the ferry fuel system operating instructions
• the aircraft fuel selector position not being in accordance with the aircraft manufacturer’s documentation
• a malfunction of the aircraft fuel selector
• a malfunction of the aircraft fuel cross-feed system
• in-flight management of the fuel transfer rate by not deselecting the ferry fuel tank when the left aircraft wing tank indicated being 95 percent full, in accordance with the ferry fuel system operating instructions.
The nature and significance of the scorch mark on the left inboard cowl could not be determined.
ANALYSIS
As the aircraft could not be recovered, the reason for the fuel loss cannot be conclusively established. However, from the available information, it is likely that the left aircraft fuel tank was being overfilled by the ferry fuel system and was venting fuel overboard. It is possible that an over-fuelling situation could have developed from one or more of the following factors:
• commencement of fuel transfer from the ferry fuel tank prior to the one hour of flight that would have been in accordance with the ferry fuel system operating instructions
• the aircraft fuel selector position not being in accordance with the aircraft manufacturer’s documentation
• a malfunction of the aircraft fuel selector
• a malfunction of the aircraft fuel cross-feed system
• in-flight management of the fuel transfer rate by not deselecting the ferry fuel tank when the left aircraft wing tank indicated being 95 percent full, in accordance with the ferry fuel system operating instructions.
The nature and significance of the scorch mark on the left inboard cowl could not be determined.
Last edited by PinkusDickus; 12th Sep 2009 at 11:20. Reason: clarity
In short she fell asleep at the wheel.
The fuel got vented overboard and the aircraft was ditched and lost as a result.
Perhaps more attention should have been paid to the ferry tank operations manual and keeping an eye on the left tank gauge getting ready for tapping into the ferry fuel.
Embarassing to talk to the insurance company. Now at a major flight school as a senior pilot.
The fuel got vented overboard and the aircraft was ditched and lost as a result.
Perhaps more attention should have been paid to the ferry tank operations manual and keeping an eye on the left tank gauge getting ready for tapping into the ferry fuel.
Embarassing to talk to the insurance company. Now at a major flight school as a senior pilot.
