Coober Pedy - "Cessna takes off without pilot"
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Originally Posted by D-J
520's hand start surprisingly easily when cold...
Fecked the aircraft and the skipper of the boat had a few choice words to say about the damage to his boat too. That operator didn't last long on floats, strangely...
Another private stuffup?
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
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Am too tired to post the whole story here now and have previously related the story elsewhere on another thread, but have successfully hand started 260hp and 235hp Lycomings with no-one else around on several occasions.
Secret to doing so without tears and/or drama is to do so with throttle fully closed. Of course, whether this technique works with fuel injected engines is unknown to me.
Others more knowledgable than I will post, I'm sure.
Secret to doing so without tears and/or drama is to do so with throttle fully closed. Of course, whether this technique works with fuel injected engines is unknown to me.
Others more knowledgable than I will post, I'm sure.
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Owen,
Certainly looks like JNW doesn't it. Wasn't that new charter outfit at PF using it a bit? Have seen it parked outside their joint on Kings Road as of late.
Either way.. ouch!
Certainly looks like JNW doesn't it. Wasn't that new charter outfit at PF using it a bit? Have seen it parked outside their joint on Kings Road as of late.
Either way.. ouch!
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How To:
video of correct procedure???? 
Fun Games and Other Fun Stuff Blog Archive Hand Starting an Airplane - Don’t try this :-)
Fun Games and Other Fun Stuff Blog Archive Hand Starting an Airplane - Don’t try this :-)
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How many times has this happened. Is there anybody out there who still doesn't understand the concept?
Digressing slightly, they reckon Gough Whitlam's missus could kick start a 747 back in the 70's.
Digressing slightly, they reckon Gough Whitlam's missus could kick start a 747 back in the 70's.
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Perhaps it's time to shut down some rumours (although I don't blame anybody for speculating). As with a few of these incidents the PIC wasn't actually attempting to start the engine from what I understand. It sounds like a sad case of a grounded mag and some unfortunate throttle settings (which might explain the lack of chocks or tie-downs which permitted the thing to get away).
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Dead cut checks certainly have some merit but many a LAME have advised otherwise. I'm no engineer so I'll leave it at this: I'll always do what the checklist/AFM and the owner (his/her aeroplane) say. But yes, a dead cut check may have saved this hull.
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OOps
VH-JNW, I flew for a drop zone in VIC early last year. They owner thought the skydivers wern't treating it well...... How wrong he was to ship it up into the hands of that silly silly pilot.
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Originally Posted by Captain Peabody
Dead cut checks certainly have some merit but many a LAME have advised otherwise.
I always conduct a dead-cut check immediately after engine-start on the 1st start of the day and again every time prior to shutting the engine down. How else are you to know whether or not you have a hot P-lead??? I couldn't tell you how many times I've discovered hot mags and other minor ignition issues doing this simple check. Conducted properly, it poses no threat at all to your engine(s). Mine are done at or very near to idle RPM.
The consequences of not doing a dead-cut and either yourself or someone else moving a propeller, deliberately or unintentionally, with a hot mag are horrifying.
No magneto is 'dead' until I have proven it dead. If I haven't personally proven a mag dead, then I will assume it to be live -and stay well away from the prop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Peabody
Dead cut checks certainly have some merit but many a LAME have advised otherwise.
Really??? I'd be very interested in their reasoning for offering that advice.
I always conduct a dead-cut check immediately after engine-start on the 1st start of the day and again every time prior to shutting the engine down. How else are you to know whether or not you have a hot P-lead??? I couldn't tell you how many times I've discovered hot mags and other minor ignition issues doing this simple check. Conducted properly, it poses no threat at all to your engine(s). Mine are done at or very near to idle RPM.
The consequences of not doing a dead-cut and either yourself or someone else moving a propeller, deliberately or unintentionally, with a hot mag are horrifying.
No magneto is 'dead' until I have proven it dead. If I haven't personally proven a mag dead, then I will assume it to be live -and stay well away from the prop
Originally Posted by Captain Peabody
Dead cut checks certainly have some merit but many a LAME have advised otherwise.
Really??? I'd be very interested in their reasoning for offering that advice.
I always conduct a dead-cut check immediately after engine-start on the 1st start of the day and again every time prior to shutting the engine down. How else are you to know whether or not you have a hot P-lead??? I couldn't tell you how many times I've discovered hot mags and other minor ignition issues doing this simple check. Conducted properly, it poses no threat at all to your engine(s). Mine are done at or very near to idle RPM.
The consequences of not doing a dead-cut and either yourself or someone else moving a propeller, deliberately or unintentionally, with a hot mag are horrifying.
No magneto is 'dead' until I have proven it dead. If I haven't personally proven a mag dead, then I will assume it to be live -and stay well away from the prop
Yep I only ever did it at idle RPM just before I pulled the mixture on shutdown. I would also did it during my morning runup on the first flight of the day and I would always check the mags L/R just before takeoff with a quick TIMPFISH as I lined up to make sure I had everything working.
I discovered hot mags many times to which I would whack a post it note on the control column with "Live Mags" and also one on the propeller. I would then notify the CP/owner and write it up as a squawk or the MR if it were to be fixed immediately. Those post it notes also come in handy when you have VAC pump failures to put over the AI. You will get a few every thousand hours of driving pistons.
GG
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
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I learned to Prop start on the DH82 and a sweet little 85 hp float plane. Since then I have had to start a whole myriad of aircraft by hand and have a procedure that works quite well. I have even taught a couple of guys to do it properly with very little risk involved. I did have a bit of a problem on my last ship though........... you can hand swing that PT6 all day and nothing happens. 
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Whoa whoa whoa, as I said they "certainly have some merit" and "a dead cut check may have saved this hull". Whilst we are talking about a C206 dead cut checks are just not required or advantageous in every scenario and they must be done with care (i.e. to protect the exhaust system, after ignition backfire I think it's called). The C206 has a rotary ignition so you can't check grounding using the normal mag check (think of systems like on the Navajo or Piper Cub) so yes a dead cut is the only way.
I probably made a bit of a blanket statement and I should not have said "many a LAME" but certainly I have had discussions with LAMEs about the risks to the exhaust vs the benefits gained.
I do conduct dead cuts on the Bonanza I fly as it's the only rotary style ignition plane in our particular fleet.
I probably made a bit of a blanket statement and I should not have said "many a LAME" but certainly I have had discussions with LAMEs about the risks to the exhaust vs the benefits gained.
I do conduct dead cuts on the Bonanza I fly as it's the only rotary style ignition plane in our particular fleet.
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When I did my initial Grade 3 we were taught how to hand start the 152
It was only a couple of years ago a instructor with no sense and no experience attempted to hand start a 172 at Point Cook. Why? the battery was flat and in fact had been like that for several days. So the CFI "authorised" hand starting to save money and to keep the schedule running on time. The new instructor was struck by the propellor as he tried to hand start and was severely injured. If ever there was a instance where Flight Safety Australia journos could have made a valuable contribution to flight safety in general aviation, then this story of sheer risk taking idiocy was the perfect venue. But it was hushed up,.
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The aircraft is designed with a starter motor. If the starter motor is inoperative or the battery is too weak to turn the prop over enough to get a start then defect it in the maintenance release (battery or starter or both depending).
get a grip buddy........... or even loosen it a little.there are no instructions in the DH82 handbook either...... or several of the other aircraft I have flown without an electrical system. Hand starting aircraft has been around since the start of aviation, and if done correctly is no more dangerous than flying the aircraft.
Quote:
The aircraft is designed with a starter motor. If the starter motor is inoperative or the battery is too weak to turn the prop over enough to get a start then defect it in the maintenance release (battery or starter or both depending).
Yup........... then sit around in the middle of the GAFA and wait for your local LAME to pop in and fix it. get a grip buddy........... or even loosen it a little.
there are no instructions in the DH82 handbook either...... or several of the other aircraft I have flown without an electrical system. Hand starting aircraft has been around since the start of aviation, and if done correctly is no more dangerous than flying the aircraft.
The aircraft is designed with a starter motor. If the starter motor is inoperative or the battery is too weak to turn the prop over enough to get a start then defect it in the maintenance release (battery or starter or both depending).
Yup........... then sit around in the middle of the GAFA and wait for your local LAME to pop in and fix it. get a grip buddy........... or even loosen it a little.
there are no instructions in the DH82 handbook either...... or several of the other aircraft I have flown without an electrical system. Hand starting aircraft has been around since the start of aviation, and if done correctly is no more dangerous than flying the aircraft.
Defecting the MR in the middle of bum **** no where with a flat battery is really the most stupid response I have heard in a while.
No phone reception, no food, limited water, 40 degree+ heat, I'm sure the boss and the punters are going to be reeeeeeal happy when you tell 'em (after SAR have been looking for you) that you can't fly because you endorsed the MR with a flat battery and need a jump.
Might work at a GAAP at a flying school, doesn't work in commercial aviation!