Beware of the copper flying at night with the lights off....
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Mel-burn
Posts: 4,875
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Dauphine or whatever that big thing is is NOT their only chopper in Melbourne you know! Not only do they cross-hire/use aircraft but they also have an AS350 at their disposal in Police colours. The big bang bus they fly most of the time can be heard from 5 kms away agreed!
They can hide from no one on the ground unless they are deaf and blind. A blacked out copper chopper is still visible against the sky.
My sentiments entirely - what's the point? Unless they can knock out the wocka wocka sound, they're pretty much stuffed I reckon.
Plus I can always request they turn on their lights if I need to identify them
.This whole damn security thang has just gotten way out of hand
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Outback
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WA Police have been using "polair black" for years, whats the big deal.
It obvisiously works as it has taken this long for it to get out.
Used on ATC approval and as Fratmate says, if your at the level they are - you have more to worry about than hitting a helicopter.
Unless your doing something wrong, you have nothing to worry about.
It obvisiously works as it has taken this long for it to get out.
Used on ATC approval and as Fratmate says, if your at the level they are - you have more to worry about than hitting a helicopter.
Unless your doing something wrong, you have nothing to worry about.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: BackofBourke
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
mickk
There appears to be some unfounded hostility towards Airwing here.
Lets get the following facts straight.
(i) the helicopters do get shot at
(ii) you don't hear about it so some other idiot doesn't try it
(ii) the crews are experienced, professional and some are ex military Blackhawk drivers
(iii) they should decide tactical procedures not anyone here.
(iv) the SOG do significantly more than farm visits
(v) four of my friends were shot dead in safe Victoria, one has a slug in the brain and is waiting for a bump to the head to kill him, and the other has one in the spine, and he no longer walks. All police.
(vi) if they wake you at 3 am or make your television fuzzy then they are probably stopping some **** bag stealing your stuff so harden up.
They are the good guys remember that! Have a nice day.
There appears to be some unfounded hostility towards Airwing here.
Lets get the following facts straight.
(i) the helicopters do get shot at
(ii) you don't hear about it so some other idiot doesn't try it
(ii) the crews are experienced, professional and some are ex military Blackhawk drivers
(iii) they should decide tactical procedures not anyone here.
(iv) the SOG do significantly more than farm visits
(v) four of my friends were shot dead in safe Victoria, one has a slug in the brain and is waiting for a bump to the head to kill him, and the other has one in the spine, and he no longer walks. All police.
(vi) if they wake you at 3 am or make your television fuzzy then they are probably stopping some **** bag stealing your stuff so harden up.
They are the good guys remember that! Have a nice day.
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Abeam Alice Springs
Posts: 1,109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No lights!
A few years back I lived in a large country city close to the airport and one night about 1am I heard a fixed wing aircraft operating in the area, so I went for a wander outside and sure enough I could see the aircraft against the background sky, but he showed no lights whatsoever... I checked to see if the runway lights were on and they were off. I got the handheld and gave a bcast on the local MBZ (as it was then) without reply. I activated the runway lights and made a call to centre as I thought the aircraft may have had an electrical failure. They new nothing of any operations in the area (no plan VFR or IFR) (no radar coverage) but followed it up. Seems it was the local Air Wing doing some night detective work. Our friendly FOI called me a day later to 'brief' me on what was going on etc. Fine I said, but if they are going to do that sort of stuff then at least someone in centre should know about it (to handle any calls etc) - he did not think so and said I had comprised their mission. Tough!! Given the same circumstances I would do the same again. No lights if the circumstances so demand, but someone has to know so that do-gooders like me on the night can go back to bed!!!
A blacked out copper chopper is still visible against the sky
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: melb
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I will bite because they are big boys.
I dont want to hear about ex blackhawk drivers and night vision goggles, roaming around the skies of melbourne. Not a good record in that area.
Police get shot at and a tiny % get shot and even less die. Its part of the job. Firemen get burnt, parking oficers get spat at and abused. These things are to be expected. Cops are in the job because they expect to get shot at one day. If they didnt, then they wouldnt live long. So they accept the risk.
Do you really think that if the TV reports a chopper was shot, people would flee to their backyards and do the same thing, go off like an Iraqi wedding party?
The SOG do very litle in choppers other than farms. Theres no fast roping into Malvern. Its pertty hard to land a team of the Sons of God in a suburban street.
Polair tracks cars and crims. It also does rescue work and looks for dope plantations and missing persons, boats etc. It does a few other things too. None of the above or anything else requires the necessity for running without lights.
Training sure, but as SOP its BS and is just an ego trip.
I dont want to hear about ex blackhawk drivers and night vision goggles, roaming around the skies of melbourne. Not a good record in that area.
Police get shot at and a tiny % get shot and even less die. Its part of the job. Firemen get burnt, parking oficers get spat at and abused. These things are to be expected. Cops are in the job because they expect to get shot at one day. If they didnt, then they wouldnt live long. So they accept the risk.
Do you really think that if the TV reports a chopper was shot, people would flee to their backyards and do the same thing, go off like an Iraqi wedding party?
The SOG do very litle in choppers other than farms. Theres no fast roping into Malvern. Its pertty hard to land a team of the Sons of God in a suburban street.
Polair tracks cars and crims. It also does rescue work and looks for dope plantations and missing persons, boats etc. It does a few other things too. None of the above or anything else requires the necessity for running without lights.
Training sure, but as SOP its BS and is just an ego trip.
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I find it interesting that the Police Integrity Commission is the organisation granted the exemption.In other words the air wing won't be tracking car hoons or your friendly neighbourhood pharmeceutical supplier on these ops but instead watching suspected bent cops..........
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: BackofBourke
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
mickk
I won't go through my list again. However.
In response I would like to mention that in the 90's one person jumped off the West Gate Bridge each week. This was not made public, for the reasons I have already mentioned. When the media finally got hold of it and reported same there was one attempt per day. Police were then forced to negotiate with more nuckle heads putting them at risk. Have I made my point?
There is a modern phenomon called 'cocooning' where the subject hides in their home, makes themselves comfortable, and ignores the nasty stuff around them. These people would probably agree with you.
I won't go through my list again. However.
Do you really think that if the TV reports a chopper was shot, people would flee to their backyards and do the same thing, go off like an Iraqi wedding party?
There is a modern phenomon called 'cocooning' where the subject hides in their home, makes themselves comfortable, and ignores the nasty stuff around them. These people would probably agree with you.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Outback
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mickk,
I'm not sure which leafy, gated Melbourne Community you live in.
Your ignorance doesn't really deserve a response but...
If turning the lights out on the helicopter gives the Police a tactical advantage then isn't it a good thing ? I really don't understand the reasoning of some people.
We fly in cloud and can't see other aircraft, relying on radio calls for separation. What's the difference.
This has been in effect prior to 9/11 (in WA not sure about Vic) so it not a security thing, it is a Police trying to catch crims thing. The crims that break into your house, sell dope to your kids, rape and bash the elderly.
I'm not sure which leafy, gated Melbourne Community you live in.
Your ignorance doesn't really deserve a response but...
If turning the lights out on the helicopter gives the Police a tactical advantage then isn't it a good thing ? I really don't understand the reasoning of some people.
We fly in cloud and can't see other aircraft, relying on radio calls for separation. What's the difference.
This has been in effect prior to 9/11 (in WA not sure about Vic) so it not a security thing, it is a Police trying to catch crims thing. The crims that break into your house, sell dope to your kids, rape and bash the elderly.
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Victoria
Age: 62
Posts: 984
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some agree with the tinfoil hat wearing brigade, and some don't - who'da thunk it!
Is the reference to "Tuppence" from recent events? Maybe the "black choppers" were looking for the bad guys, but more importantly the hidden Moran millions!
But while I'm here.....
(My bolding)
That's my nomination for the Oscar!
Because the police had the temerity not to inform you of their every move you compromised their mission by being a nosy busy-body. Unbelievable Did it occur to you that maybe the police were actually doing their jobs, i.e. catching bad guys? And you actually seem proud of your actions! I'll bet you are first person to squeal when you want the police.
I hope that FOI gave the cops your address.
Is the reference to "Tuppence" from recent events? Maybe the "black choppers" were looking for the bad guys, but more importantly the hidden Moran millions!
But while I'm here.....
few years back I lived in a large country city close to the airport and one night about 1am I heard a fixed wing aircraft operating in the area, so I went for a wander outside and sure enough I could see the aircraft against the background sky, but he showed no lights whatsoever... I checked to see if the runway lights were on and they were off. I got the handheld and gave a bcast on the local MBZ (as it was then) without reply. I activated the runway lights and made a call to centre as I thought the aircraft may have had an electrical failure. They new nothing of any operations in the area (no plan VFR or IFR) (no radar coverage) but followed it up. Seems it was the local Air Wing doing some night detective work. Our friendly FOI called me a day later to 'brief' me on what was going on etc. Fine I said, but if they are going to do that sort of stuff then at least someone in centre should know about it (to handle any calls etc) - he did not think so and said I had comprised their mission. Tough!! Given the same circumstances I would do the same again. No lights if the circumstances so demand, but someone has to know so that do-gooders like me on the night can go back to bed!!!
That's my nomination for the Oscar!
Because the police had the temerity not to inform you of their every move you compromised their mission by being a nosy busy-body. Unbelievable Did it occur to you that maybe the police were actually doing their jobs, i.e. catching bad guys? And you actually seem proud of your actions! I'll bet you are first person to squeal when you want the police. I hope that FOI gave the cops your address.
Seasonally Adjusted
When pulled over and issued with a traffic infringement notice, this type of person will often say...."Why aren't you out there catching real criminals?" or "I pay your wages!".
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Mel-burn
Posts: 4,875
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can understand ever so slightly the need for black-ops.
I was once called in in my fixed wing to do the job of PolAir who were unavailable at the time.
It was daytime and there was a gunman on the run who was evading police right on the edge of suburbia. We did a couple of low level runs to flush him out but didn't find him so we went away well into the distance, repositioned, then came back from another direction attempting to gain the element of surprise. It must have worked, I'm led to believe that he capped himself as we approached. Never heard anything back from the boys in blue other than a wave as we departed. Based on what the offender had done previous to him running, I don't think they were concerned at the outcome.
Question, if the Police requisition your aircraft, do you inherit the callsign of PolAir like any aircraft with the President of the USA becomes AirForce1 ?
(PS: This is a true story).
I was once called in in my fixed wing to do the job of PolAir who were unavailable at the time.
It was daytime and there was a gunman on the run who was evading police right on the edge of suburbia. We did a couple of low level runs to flush him out but didn't find him so we went away well into the distance, repositioned, then came back from another direction attempting to gain the element of surprise. It must have worked, I'm led to believe that he capped himself as we approached. Never heard anything back from the boys in blue other than a wave as we departed. Based on what the offender had done previous to him running, I don't think they were concerned at the outcome.
Question, if the Police requisition your aircraft, do you inherit the callsign of PolAir like any aircraft with the President of the USA becomes AirForce1 ?
(PS: This is a true story).
Is the reference to "Tuppence" from recent events? Maybe the "black choppers" were looking for the bad guys, but more importantly the hidden Moran millions!
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Victoria
Age: 62
Posts: 984
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I also harbor some hope the Vic Muppets were sufficiently situationally aware and did not even contemplate flying blackout or try to use NVG's over the built up areas in the middle of the day.
OK....I'll go quietly........
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Australia
Posts: 77
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Capt Sand Dune
I don't believe the comments are anything to do with police not making notification. The writer clearly acted with the concern of the safety of the aircraft. How is he to know if it is a police a/c... it just may have been some poor pilot with an electrics failure??? He is just trying to say there should be a Circuit Breaker in the system somewhere... To me he did the right thing!
(My bolding)
That's my nomination for the Oscar! Because the police had the temerity not to inform you of their every move you compromised their mission by being a nosy busy-body. Unbelievable Did it occur to you that maybe the police were actually doing their jobs, i.e. catching bad guys? And you actually seem proud of your actions! I'll bet you are first person to squeal when you want the police. I hope that FOI gave the cops your address.
That's my nomination for the Oscar! Because the police had the temerity not to inform you of their every move you compromised their mission by being a nosy busy-body. Unbelievable Did it occur to you that maybe the police were actually doing their jobs, i.e. catching bad guys? And you actually seem proud of your actions! I'll bet you are first person to squeal when you want the police. I hope that FOI gave the cops your address.