police PC12

[pc12togo]

The Police operation is a far different op to general carter. I have done both. You are on 24/7 call out and hardly know were you are going and what type of work you are doing till the phone rings. The type of operations are

Low level search
Droping of supplies
Transport of prisioners
Transport of evadance,chain of evadance
ELT search and tracking
Search of missing persons
Transport of dangerers goods, Star operations
Police change over crews to remote arears
Transport of bodys
transporting the teams from Major Crash and fire investergaters, and Major crime.

The great thing about it all is that you never know what is going to happen.

[Towering Q]

The main reason that you have a police pilot, is that when you land you have a Police Officer who can be usefull

....and make great cucumber sandwiches for the Commish!!

[FourBalls]

waste cucumber on sandwich?

i bet the cucumber comes in handy for those nights sharing a room at the tower

[neville_nobody]

I think you will find that the pilots have many 1000's of hours and vast experience.

Yeah but that is gained in the airwing. The risk for the pax is when these guys are starting out. Very very few if any would join the Police Airwing with thousands of hours charter and turbine experience, which is what you would get if you opened it up to the general population, and that is the point made in the accident report.

End of the day the WA police own the train set and they can do what they like with it.

[Towering Q]

The problem with opening it up to the "general population" is that you attract those who would simply use the position as a stepping stone to an airline job.

The current group of pilots are career cops who plan to see out their time in the Airwing, a useful return of service in any ones terms.

[Black Maria]

The problem with opening it up to the "general population" is that you attract those who would simply use the position as a stepping stone to an airline job

There are four "general population" pilots in the Queensland Police Air Wing with a combined service of around 80 + years. Tends to shoot that aruguement down.

Recuiting soley from within the service narrows the selection pool too greatly to be outweighed by any benefit gained from being able to use the pilot for policing duties.

[Towering Q]

Compare apples with apples. I'm sure if the WA Police Airwing was operating a Citation and Beech 1900 there would be no problem retaining "general population" pilots.

[bushy]

Whatever aeroplanes you have, you will attract the "junior skygods" who believe the flying school hype and believe every operator is there to train them for the front seat of a boeing.

[Black Maria]

Towering Q,

I don't see your arugument about airline stepping stone as being valid. I know guys that have been sworn Police Officers (Air Wing) and have left for the airlines.

They are no different to to your so called "general population pilots" in that regard.

I would say that, sworn or not, it comes down to a variety of reasons as to whether the guys remain or move on. Lifestyle, job security, job satisfaction, and salary come to mind, much more so than the types. (Sounds like any job doesn't it).

[Jetpipe2]

Whys this different to charter

PC12togo what is so special about the list you presented.

Low level search - used to be done by CAA trained SAR Units
Droping of supplies -used to be done by CAA trained SAR Units
Transport of prisioners - Charter with pax escort
Transport of evadance,chain of evadance - Freight charter
ELT search and tracking -used to be done by CAA trained SAR Units
Search of missing persons - used to be done by CAA trained SAR Units
Transport of dangerers goods, Star operations - Charter with a DG manual
Police change over crews to remote arears -Charter
Transport of bodys - Done regularly for local undertakers covering the regions.
transporting the teams from Major Crash and fire investergaters, and Major crime. - Thats a charter flight

Everything was or is already done by regional charter operators on a daily basis. The old CAA SAR work has moved to the airwings , mainly due to getting extra funding for it from the Commonwealth.

So whilst different to routine charter I dont se why any "competent" charter pilot couldnt' do any of these tasks.

[Jamair]

In my personal experience as a Police pilot I found it much easier than charter or RPT.

I also consider that it is better to have a professional aircrew, who have no other priority than the safety of the flight, and no chain of command that compels them in any manner, outside their aviation manager.

The main reason that you have a police pilot, is that when you land you have a Police Officer who can be usefull.. Not a charter pilot who disappears to his rest area and is of no use.

I consider it much more desirable (and 'useful') to have a well rested pilot who can subsequently manage their primary task of flying the aircraft with a high degree of safety, rather than a copper who is stuffed from flying to the site, spending all day working, then having to fly home again. That sentiment was also reflected by the police passengers.

And no-one has asked what a BN2B-3 is.......

[Black Maria]

Jamair

the BN-2B is the Defender with 300hp IO-540-K1B5 engines.

In the perfect world the -3 would stand for inbuilt noise suppressant.

Be very frightening for all involved if yours out of the box was the other -3 (-III)

[Towering Q]

Search of missing persons

Does that involve 'patting down' the missing person after they have been found?

[blade root]

Jamair

I think you may find that the Police airwing work to the same Flight and Duty standards as every other operator, hence if they need a rest they will have one.

Jetpipe and pc12togo

What is "evadance", is it like the Tango.

If you mean evidence, I wouldn't be putting my primary piece of evidence on freight charter.

[Jamair]

Qld Police ops is PVT, so commercial flt & duties do not apply.

The new Bongo for Qld Police is brand new from the factory and has a 3-blade prop (ergo -3)

[neville_nobody]

The problem with opening it up to the "general population" is that you attract those who would simply use the position as a stepping stone to an airline job.

Given that Government jobs are usually heavily competitive and have attractive compensation any recruiter worth their salt should weed out people who want to use government jobs as so called 'stepping stone'. If the deal was good they should be able to get one or two guys with the right fit and experience for small operations. For someone to come in and 'burn' a government operator would be a failure of the recruiting system.

[pc12togo]

evidence, Sorry blade root, my spelling, and yes you could not give this to a charter, as you may have to go to court to back up the chain of evidance.

neville_nobody you are correct, the job does have attractive compensation, far better than GA and that is as you say, to keep them.

I am an ex RPT / charter pilot, and now fly for an airwing.I have with some 15000 hours, so when they do look for pilots, it is heavily competitive and and will look for high time pilots with a vast experience.

[Wally Mk2]

'pc12' 15000 hrs & yr right back where youy started from, in a single engined plane, me takes me hat off to ya mate

'jamair' yr right about the pvt ops bit not having to live by the '48' rules, crazy that is, could never understand that one
What I wanna really know is the police pilot allowed to carry a 44 like Clint?


Wmk2

[Hasherucf]

Would be a perfect job for you ToweringQ . Back into the job and no further training needed ;-)

[blade root]

Jamair,

Re: flight and duty times, I was again refering to the WA police as the thread was asking about Police PC12's and it's operators.