Airlines - Time away from home
Thread Starter
Airlines - Time away from home
G'day,
I am approaching the end of my ROSO in the RAAF. I have always intended to go to the airlines (if they will take me). Now I have a home life and a wife that is not that keen on me spending extended periods away from home.
Can people give me rough time frames spent away from home. (ie. Trip length and total time away a year) I realise they will have to be general figures but it may help sell the idea on the home front.
Qantas - International
Jetstar
VB
Cheers
I am approaching the end of my ROSO in the RAAF. I have always intended to go to the airlines (if they will take me). Now I have a home life and a wife that is not that keen on me spending extended periods away from home.
Can people give me rough time frames spent away from home. (ie. Trip length and total time away a year) I realise they will have to be general figures but it may help sell the idea on the home front.
Qantas - International
Jetstar
VB
Cheers
Slezy,
As with all things.... it depends
With Q, depending on fleet 744, A330, A380, the time away from home will be different.
744 guys can do 'double shuttles' which means about 14 days away. You might do 2 or three of these every bid period (56 days).
On the mini-bus (A330) you will go to work about 5 or 6 times a bid period and trip lenghts very from 3-7 days away.
The Dugong... well as they only have three... that depends.
Add an extra night or two if you plan to commute.
Plan on about 20-30 days away in 56.
If you end up on a blank line (no planned trips) you might be home for 56 days!
PM me if you want more info
Good luck
As with all things.... it depends
With Q, depending on fleet 744, A330, A380, the time away from home will be different.
744 guys can do 'double shuttles' which means about 14 days away. You might do 2 or three of these every bid period (56 days).
On the mini-bus (A330) you will go to work about 5 or 6 times a bid period and trip lenghts very from 3-7 days away.
The Dugong... well as they only have three... that depends.
Add an extra night or two if you plan to commute.
Plan on about 20-30 days away in 56.
If you end up on a blank line (no planned trips) you might be home for 56 days!
PM me if you want more info
Good luck
Sprucegoose
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The guys at Jetstar seem to be home most nights, except for the back of the clocks to Perth!
Low cost will generally have you at home when not actually in the air, and no jet lag as it's mostly out and back. The overnighters aren't much fun and there will be many multi sector days, but you will have much more time at home with a better sleep pattern.
Pay and conditions are below full service airlines and expect max hours as the norm.
It depends how important your time at home is.
Pay and conditions are below full service airlines and expect max hours as the norm.
It depends how important your time at home is.
Thread Starter
Thanks Guys,
That was what I was after.
I think my wife would prefer the low cost home time with the Mainline paycheck!
Now if only there was some way......
That was what I was after.
I think my wife would prefer the low cost home time with the Mainline paycheck!
Now if only there was some way......
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Slezy9,
I would strongly advise you use means other than PPRuNE to find the information you seek. Your non de plume is not a foolproof disguise, and there are some rather vindictive personalities around that monitor this website.
Good luck mate!
I would strongly advise you use means other than PPRuNE to find the information you seek. Your non de plume is not a foolproof disguise, and there are some rather vindictive personalities around that monitor this website.
Good luck mate!
Slezy,
I suggest you talk to a few LCC and other pilots regarding this. As with all things, the devil is in the detail.
True, but what does that mean?? 5am sign-ons mean an early rise, which usually means an early night, both before and after. This is also the case with Q domestic and VB.
Late starts mean late finishes, home around midnight - yes in your own bed, but you have missed the evening with your wife/kids.
Home most nights is not 'Air Force' home most nights, genrally 9 - 5 depending on deployments etc.
Ask for some rosters and look at what it really means. Study the timings and figure out what it means to you in your situation.
A lot of pilots I know at Jstar are working much harder than at Q and are worried about burning out in a few years.
Although it sounds nice to be at home 'most nights' you are not necessarily 'there' if you are often tired etc.
There are other things to consider as well, as I'm sure you have thought about: is this the right time to leave a secure well paying job for the uncertainty of a 'fickle' airline job - particularly if you are at the bottom of the pile (last in first out??).
Hope this helps
Good Luck
I suggest you talk to a few LCC and other pilots regarding this. As with all things, the devil is in the detail.
The guys at Jetstar seem to be home most nights,
Late starts mean late finishes, home around midnight - yes in your own bed, but you have missed the evening with your wife/kids.
Home most nights is not 'Air Force' home most nights, genrally 9 - 5 depending on deployments etc.
Ask for some rosters and look at what it really means. Study the timings and figure out what it means to you in your situation.
A lot of pilots I know at Jstar are working much harder than at Q and are worried about burning out in a few years.
Although it sounds nice to be at home 'most nights' you are not necessarily 'there' if you are often tired etc.
There are other things to consider as well, as I'm sure you have thought about: is this the right time to leave a secure well paying job for the uncertainty of a 'fickle' airline job - particularly if you are at the bottom of the pile (last in first out??).
Hope this helps
Good Luck
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Airlines
Basically mate, you dont have a choice. Airlines change constantly. You will be entering at the bottom of the barrel. RAAF experience is not considered particularly good experience.
Basically take any job you can get, keep your mouth shut and do exactly as your told, after a few years you may have seniority to get you off the crap rosters. Even at QF the senior guys end up with the crap line at least every 12 months.
Good Luck, and remember, keep you mouth shut.(very difficult for guys out of the RAAF)
Basically take any job you can get, keep your mouth shut and do exactly as your told, after a few years you may have seniority to get you off the crap rosters. Even at QF the senior guys end up with the crap line at least every 12 months.
Good Luck, and remember, keep you mouth shut.(very difficult for guys out of the RAAF)
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You should consider staying at the air force as an option as well. As most have said:
QF Intl:12-14 days away
J*:No overnights but multi multi sector days 999.9999 hours per year
VB: Some over nights some four day trips some multi sector days
Mining charter companies: Home every weekend, very few overnights day trips, mainly early starts.
QF Intl:12-14 days away
J*:No overnights but multi multi sector days 999.9999 hours per year
VB: Some over nights some four day trips some multi sector days
Mining charter companies: Home every weekend, very few overnights day trips, mainly early starts.
Last edited by Mr. Hat; 1st Feb 2009 at 01:55. Reason: replaced "day" with "year"
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anyone biting?
RAAF experience is not considered particularly good experience.
Military flying may well be different and require some adjustment, however, ...
I think what he means is that they don't look at wether you have flown it in a 747, a C152 or a Hornet when they check your minimum hours, as long as you have the numbers and pass the tests your in, but you still end up at the bottom whether you just scraped those hours in a 152 or are a Wing Commander with decades under your belt.
Last year on Long Haul Operations, away from main base, 153 days and only managed to get home to Aus twice (not counting Aus layovers). Some people with kids hate it, but, it's just part of the job. It becomes a way of life and you get use to it. I have a mate who is a Ship Tanker Skipper who is away for months at a time. Took the poor devil 11 days to sail Singapore to Townsville! If home-time is a priority, maybe Airline Flying is not for you, what about applying to CASA or something similar?
For me (low cost) generally
1. 13 Days per month flying
2. 85-90 hours
3.1-3 All nighters
4.3-4 Four sector days
5.4 5am to 6am sign ons
6.4 or 5 Midnight+ sign offs
7.2 or 3 Min rest between duties
8.2-8 roster changes per month
9.1-2 call outs from reserve
All straight out and back no hotels.
About 16 days per month at home and awake during daylight, 3-4 sleep in till 2.00pm due to late finish.
Occasional tiredness but no jet lag fatigue. Sustainable long term ? Yes provided you manage your leisure time. Looking foward to new fatigue management rules
1. 13 Days per month flying
2. 85-90 hours
3.1-3 All nighters
4.3-4 Four sector days
5.4 5am to 6am sign ons
6.4 or 5 Midnight+ sign offs
7.2 or 3 Min rest between duties
8.2-8 roster changes per month
9.1-2 call outs from reserve
All straight out and back no hotels.
About 16 days per month at home and awake during daylight, 3-4 sleep in till 2.00pm due to late finish.
Occasional tiredness but no jet lag fatigue. Sustainable long term ? Yes provided you manage your leisure time. Looking foward to new fatigue management rules
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I've been sitting on 750-800 hours per 365 days for basically the whole time I've been at JQ - A320.
Although you are tired when you finish work most of the time, it doesn't take me long to recover. Early starts are good because you are home early (maybe lunch but definately dinner with the family). Sure, you are starting to fade around 8-9pm but thats ok, kids in bed, have an early night. Late starts are ok too. Around in the morning for breakfast - even if you've just finished a late shift, you're usually home around midnight-1am. 6 hours in the cot, no problem. Do what you have to do in the morning, have some lunch and go to work.
Back of the clock is another issue. Knock out 3-4 days out of you life. But they only usually happen once a month - sometime none for ages.
There are times when you feel wrecked after a series of shifts not being ideal (show me a job that pays 6 figures and doesn't leave you tired from time to time) but all in all, if you can't handle a JQ roster you are totally soft. Its just like a normal job but with more time off.
Although you are tired when you finish work most of the time, it doesn't take me long to recover. Early starts are good because you are home early (maybe lunch but definately dinner with the family). Sure, you are starting to fade around 8-9pm but thats ok, kids in bed, have an early night. Late starts are ok too. Around in the morning for breakfast - even if you've just finished a late shift, you're usually home around midnight-1am. 6 hours in the cot, no problem. Do what you have to do in the morning, have some lunch and go to work.
Back of the clock is another issue. Knock out 3-4 days out of you life. But they only usually happen once a month - sometime none for ages.
There are times when you feel wrecked after a series of shifts not being ideal (show me a job that pays 6 figures and doesn't leave you tired from time to time) but all in all, if you can't handle a JQ roster you are totally soft. Its just like a normal job but with more time off.
Many junior SOs on the B744 at Qantas are only doing two 12 or 13 day trips each roster at the moment.
25 days work in an 8 week period with up to 26 or so days off in between trips. Not bad if you ask me.
Better money than a JQ F/O flogging his guts out domestically too. Not to mention the fun to be had drinking beers and chasing girls all over the world, although the wife might not be happy about that bit!
25 days work in an 8 week period with up to 26 or so days off in between trips. Not bad if you ask me.
Better money than a JQ F/O flogging his guts out domestically too. Not to mention the fun to be had drinking beers and chasing girls all over the world, although the wife might not be happy about that bit!