National Jet T&C
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Wow
I don't even have words for this one. Hang on yes i do.
It sounds like a John W Howard wet dream.
What you need in these situations are balaclavas and baseball bats....
B717 F/O was $75K two years ago. Dropped to under $58K, for new recruits.
It sounds like a John W Howard wet dream.
What you need in these situations are balaclavas and baseball bats....
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Figures quoted are 2008 ECA.
Start at the lower rate increase to higher after 5 years!
QF interline for 717 pilots.
Time to command......how longs a piece of string?
717 contract only until 2012!
Start at the lower rate increase to higher after 5 years!
QF interline for 717 pilots.
Time to command......how longs a piece of string?
717 contract only until 2012!
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BAE146, Your right. I do know a bit about what happens at NJS. To listen to guys like claret is sickening. I recall on several occasions sitting down to dinner with the man and hearing his philosophy on how accepting the initial deal was the only option for him at his stage of life. Which happens to be so inconsistent of what he says on PPRUNE.
Beware anyone who wishes to join NJS there are a number of people who will throw you to the lions as soon as the going gets tough!!!!
Beware anyone who wishes to join NJS there are a number of people who will throw you to the lions as soon as the going gets tough!!!!
Bottums Up
Poor old Sanchez and his sidekick 146, knickers all in a twist and blood pressure going through the roof.
If you want to sling some ****, at least include a modicum of truth. The last job I recall applying for and not getting was the Kuwaiti national airline in the aftermath of Gulf War I, and haven't applied anywhere for 13 years or so.
As for crediting me with the introduction of all things bad, even I have to be a little humble and say that you credit me with far too much omnipotence.
I'd be quite interested to see evidence of a personal attack, credited to me, on these fora; that's what you're talking about Mr Black, sorry, 146, isn't it?
Did we really dine together on several occasions? I don't recall dining with such vitriol, ever.
If you want to sling some ****, at least include a modicum of truth. The last job I recall applying for and not getting was the Kuwaiti national airline in the aftermath of Gulf War I, and haven't applied anywhere for 13 years or so.
As for crediting me with the introduction of all things bad, even I have to be a little humble and say that you credit me with far too much omnipotence.
I'd be quite interested to see evidence of a personal attack, credited to me, on these fora; that's what you're talking about Mr Black, sorry, 146, isn't it?
Did we really dine together on several occasions? I don't recall dining with such vitriol, ever.
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Come on back when you know what you're talking about.
If you want to sling some ****..............
Poor old Sanchez and his sidekick 146, knickers all in a twist and blood pressure going through the roof.
I don't have my knickers in a knot, nor do I suffer from high blood pressure and I am not Sanchez's side kick. With your impeccable command of the English language you must concede that statement was personal.
I consider most of your posts to be reasonable and well balanced Claret but on this occasion you have got it wrong. The NJS culture, as I recall, was kiss as many CIA bottoms as you can to get up the ladder and f%#k anything and anybody else!
From reading the posts (re: NJS) on other threads, I can safely assume - NOTHING HAS CHANGED!
My apologies for the thread drift. I believe it was about NJS's T & C's.
Last edited by BAE146; 24th Apr 2008 at 01:51.
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717/146 F/O starts on $62.6k increasing every year to $78.2k after 5 years.
Capt start on $104.3k increasing yearly to $130.4k after 5 years.
Capt start on $104.3k increasing yearly to $130.4k after 5 years.
That must have taken some damn hard negotiation, I mean Gee whiz, where talking painters and dockers stuff here
QF interline for 717 pilots.
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Cunning, dont want the facts to get in the way of a good whinge!
20% less than Virgin and 50% less work particulary on the 146. Also no overnights, park at the door, no security, weekends off, most days single return etc etc.
If you are not climbing the ladder to suck cess its a good casual job in Perth that leaves you time to have a life, somthing most aviation jobs dont allow!
20% less than Virgin and 50% less work particulary on the 146. Also no overnights, park at the door, no security, weekends off, most days single return etc etc.
If you are not climbing the ladder to suck cess its a good casual job in Perth that leaves you time to have a life, somthing most aviation jobs dont allow!
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I have worked at number of airlines in my time. I am presently working for NJS for those who want to bag NJS and Capt Clarrie please take a look in your own backyard, I don’t believe you will find roses. Virgin way too many overnights I understand to have a home life, that’s great if single but not if family man/women. Jetstar I hear similar no over nights but plenty of long day’s minimum time off. NJS has my roster for may showing 15 days work 6 res 10 RDO's. Add to that in my many years here the number off days ive been called in on res has been very minimal. B scale I don’t think you would see any Captain or FO agreeing to it but for those of us who where here when it was introduced we had no option but to sit back and watch as per the previous work place laws. I do agree that the management has let the vast majority of us down but again im sure it’s no different to your back yard. Live life, enjoy the sunrise and sunset and just remember why YOU choose to fly if it was for the money then you are a full. I do it for the enjoyment. Well theirs my 2 cents.
Join Date: Nov 2001
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Get your facts right kavakid
Jetstar I hear similar no over nights but plenty of long day’s minimum time off. NJS has my roster for may showing 15 days work 6 res 10 RDO's.
I have been working average 13 days/month for the last 3 months at Jetstar.
My May (28 day block only) roster shows 12 days work (includes 2 26 hours stopovers in Singapore), 3 days res, 11 RDO's and 2 DFD's (duty free days).
This will end up being 12 days work (including 2 days off in Singapore) and 16 days off.
Longs day (@6 hrs/day) with min time off (working 20 days/month) would be impossible as that would work out to be 120 hours/month which we simply can't do.
So what were you saying about Jetstar min time off again and no home life ?
Last edited by Bagot_Community_Locator; 25th Apr 2008 at 00:04.
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Hey bagot sounds like your ready for a command, but i thought there where 31 days in May 16 Rdo + 12 days work + 2 overnights - ummmmm 30. That maybe why they arnt working you to hard
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notop
I am aware that 28 days does not equal a month but a 28 day roster is close enough to get a general idea of current rostering, which is what I was trying to do.
Even if I did work an extra 3 days (worse case scenario which won't happen anyway) to make it a 31 day month, it still would mean :
15 days work
16 days off
Yes NOTOP, even with working an 3 days to make a 31 day month, I don't think I would be working too hard (not as hard as some think we are).
Even this would still make me question about our min time off as some people say (which was the main purpose of my reply and not the exact number of days in a month)
Even if I did work an extra 3 days (worse case scenario which won't happen anyway) to make it a 31 day month, it still would mean :
15 days work
16 days off
Yes NOTOP, even with working an 3 days to make a 31 day month, I don't think I would be working too hard (not as hard as some think we are).
Even this would still make me question about our min time off as some people say (which was the main purpose of my reply and not the exact number of days in a month)
Last edited by Bagot_Community_Locator; 25th Apr 2008 at 00:28.
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Jetstar I hear similar no over nights but plenty of long day’s minimum time off
Bagot I don’t work there I herd from my friends who are there read the words that are written
You guys are clearly happy and proud to be the lowest paid jet jockeys in Oz, so be it.
Cunny you are an idiot. If it was all about the money then none of us would be flying. It must be hard being so uptight that you can’t enjoy your job. I believe the average wage for real people is about 50 to 60 k an F/O is on or above the average wage and as Captain It’s over double. There is a real world out and don’t think that you are so high and mighty that you can’t fall. Most NJS guys are happy the ones who arnt can leave Myself and most of my work mates enjoy our job and life style, Ok point taken we are not the best paid, but i dont need a 6 bedroom house on the beach with 4 cars or what ever you feel you need. I need time with my family and money to enjoy it. You are not a brain surgeon nor am I. I fly aeroplanes for love and get paid. Life is good.
Bagot I don’t work there I herd from my friends who are there read the words that are written
You guys are clearly happy and proud to be the lowest paid jet jockeys in Oz, so be it.
Cunny you are an idiot. If it was all about the money then none of us would be flying. It must be hard being so uptight that you can’t enjoy your job. I believe the average wage for real people is about 50 to 60 k an F/O is on or above the average wage and as Captain It’s over double. There is a real world out and don’t think that you are so high and mighty that you can’t fall. Most NJS guys are happy the ones who arnt can leave Myself and most of my work mates enjoy our job and life style, Ok point taken we are not the best paid, but i dont need a 6 bedroom house on the beach with 4 cars or what ever you feel you need. I need time with my family and money to enjoy it. You are not a brain surgeon nor am I. I fly aeroplanes for love and get paid. Life is good.
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Comparing Apples & Oranges!!
cunninglinguist said
That would probably be true if you were comparing VB B737 FO to NJS B717 FO however I think the B717 (115 seats 49895/54885kg MTOW) is closer to the EMB 190 (104 seats 51800kg MTOW). Unless VB have upped the EMB190 pay recently I think NJS might just be the better deal. Particuarly in light of the fact NJS are not charging for the endorsement.
Same can be said for trying to compare A320 (177 seats & 73500kg) to a B717. Bit of an unfair comparison don't you think?
Cheers Beta
Gee, so in 5 years time, a Nat Joke FO will only be 20% below what a VB Effo gets currently, ( 25% in a capt. case ).
That must have taken some damn hard negotiation, I mean Gee whiz, where talking painters and dockers stuff here
That must have taken some damn hard negotiation, I mean Gee whiz, where talking painters and dockers stuff here
Same can be said for trying to compare A320 (177 seats & 73500kg) to a B717. Bit of an unfair comparison don't you think?
Cheers Beta
A Pilot who starts with NJS on the 1st July 2008 will be on $91,744 on 1st July 2012 if still an F/O and based on a guess of 3% for CPI for the future years.
If he becomes a Captain he will be on $148,453 based on the same assumptions. (ammended from$151,ooo) my mistake.
Thats on both the 146 and 717.
Now based on the Skywest Airlines Pilot Agreement 2005, and that may not be the current document, its the latest I have available at present a F100 F/O starting the same day will be on $79,010 on 1st July 2012 if inb that time he becomes a Captain he will get $121,554
Now all the above is based on BASE WAGE.
SkyWest basic hours are lower, i.e. they get paid for hours in excess of 59. Hopw many hours do the do? Their productivity rate is $108/hr for a Capt NJS is $227/hr after 75 hrs. By my calculations if a Skywest Capt flies 75 hrs per month every month he will be $14,000 behind an NJS Capt. If they both fly in excess of 75 hrs the NJS Captain will be ahead $115 for every extra hr.
An NJS Pilot will have acrued, assuming they use the same amount, an extra 22 sick days.
I don't hear the SkyWest Pilots complaing so they must be happy. The whinges seen to come from other companies. Go figure??
I suspect Alliance is behind SkyWest, SkyAirWorld are around the same.
AirNorth are a couple of lengths behind the lot.
QF do better than Virgin who do better than Jetstar.
Thats about Pilot pay in Australia in a nutshell.
If he becomes a Captain he will be on $148,453 based on the same assumptions. (ammended from$151,ooo) my mistake.
Thats on both the 146 and 717.
Now based on the Skywest Airlines Pilot Agreement 2005, and that may not be the current document, its the latest I have available at present a F100 F/O starting the same day will be on $79,010 on 1st July 2012 if inb that time he becomes a Captain he will get $121,554
Now all the above is based on BASE WAGE.
SkyWest basic hours are lower, i.e. they get paid for hours in excess of 59. Hopw many hours do the do? Their productivity rate is $108/hr for a Capt NJS is $227/hr after 75 hrs. By my calculations if a Skywest Capt flies 75 hrs per month every month he will be $14,000 behind an NJS Capt. If they both fly in excess of 75 hrs the NJS Captain will be ahead $115 for every extra hr.
An NJS Pilot will have acrued, assuming they use the same amount, an extra 22 sick days.
I don't hear the SkyWest Pilots complaing so they must be happy. The whinges seen to come from other companies. Go figure??
I suspect Alliance is behind SkyWest, SkyAirWorld are around the same.
AirNorth are a couple of lengths behind the lot.
QF do better than Virgin who do better than Jetstar.
Thats about Pilot pay in Australia in a nutshell.
Last edited by RENURPP; 26th Apr 2008 at 11:19.
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RENURPP you gotta be a management stool for NJS. You are quoting figures 4 years ahead my friend. On your formulae a Virgin F/O will be pulling $107500 compared to NJS F/O $91700. Virgin Capt will be on $183000.
Skywest F/Os on the F100 start on $86500. According to your formulae in reverse that means NJS F/Os must start on $81400.If that's the Pilot pay in Australia in a nutshell I think NJS has a lot of catching up to do.
Skywest F/Os on the F100 start on $86500. According to your formulae in reverse that means NJS F/Os must start on $81400.If that's the Pilot pay in Australia in a nutshell I think NJS has a lot of catching up to do.