Those pesky Aussie ATPL exams
Join Date: Jul 2005
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YIKES.
Brinda. Settle down mate. I think there may have been an unhealthy amount of inference associated with your last post. I believe the following quote has been rather taken out of context:
Allow me to expound... Australian pilots have to pass 7 ATPL exams. Therefore it is only fair that Aussies working O/S whom want to return home, should have to pass the same 7 exams in the same way as all the others have. Likewise, if Aussies want to fly in the US, they should have to pass the US ATP (and any associated flight test) just as any American pilot would have to. Nothing complex here. Not bagging Americans or Aussies. Fair go for everyone. We should all have to play by the local rules.
So once again, DJ & QF
Brinda. Settle down mate. I think there may have been an unhealthy amount of inference associated with your last post. I believe the following quote has been rather taken out of context:
We have standards here in Aus the Aussie pilots must meet. By all means let the others come home and give them a job if they meet the SAME standards.
So once again, DJ & QF
Join Date: Nov 2004
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Yes OhForSure .... I apologise for the tone of my last post. It was rather unprofessional.
Here is the problem I have with the blanket "no exams" policy. You say pilots like me need to meet the "same" standard as Australian pilots yet by your measure of standards a 22 year old flight instructor with 1500 hours and a Oz ATPL is of somehow of a higher standard than someone with thousands of hours of airline and bizjet time from all over the world.
Two Qantas group companies and two Virgin group companies (not to mention all the regionals etc) do not require these exams. Don’t you think if they were concerned about the standard of pilots they would change their hiring policies to that of DJ and QF mainline?
Who remembers even a fraction of the garbage in the ATPL exams! No one. Don't pretend these exams make better pilots, they don't.
I asked Chimbu Chuckles if he would feel cheated if someone with a 'converted' ATPL with essentially the same experience got a job ahead of him.(No answer yet) I would ask you the same question.
I have "played by the local rules". I did the IREX, comm law, ATPL law and an instrument check ride to get my Oz ATPL yet it's your belief that its unfair that I got a job back here because I should have to pass the same 7 exams in the same way as all the others have.
It is clear that your reasons are based on what you perceive as fair and nothing to do with standards or playing by the local rules. In fact I would suggest that most people that agree with this policy would feel the same way.
Level with me OFS.... this policy does tilt the playing field in your favour just a bit doesn't it. I would much rather you come out and say that its better for you as it cuts out some of your more experienced competition. I can respect that position more than making up some unsubstantiated argument like "rules", "fair" and "standards".
Enough band width on this has been taken up on this subject.... I won't be revisiting it, my opinion on this is clear. You're welcome to have the last word though.
Brinda.
Here is the problem I have with the blanket "no exams" policy. You say pilots like me need to meet the "same" standard as Australian pilots yet by your measure of standards a 22 year old flight instructor with 1500 hours and a Oz ATPL is of somehow of a higher standard than someone with thousands of hours of airline and bizjet time from all over the world.
Two Qantas group companies and two Virgin group companies (not to mention all the regionals etc) do not require these exams. Don’t you think if they were concerned about the standard of pilots they would change their hiring policies to that of DJ and QF mainline?
Who remembers even a fraction of the garbage in the ATPL exams! No one. Don't pretend these exams make better pilots, they don't.
I asked Chimbu Chuckles if he would feel cheated if someone with a 'converted' ATPL with essentially the same experience got a job ahead of him.(No answer yet) I would ask you the same question.
We should all have to play by the local rules.
It is clear that your reasons are based on what you perceive as fair and nothing to do with standards or playing by the local rules. In fact I would suggest that most people that agree with this policy would feel the same way.
Level with me OFS.... this policy does tilt the playing field in your favour just a bit doesn't it. I would much rather you come out and say that its better for you as it cuts out some of your more experienced competition. I can respect that position more than making up some unsubstantiated argument like "rules", "fair" and "standards".
Enough band width on this has been taken up on this subject.... I won't be revisiting it, my opinion on this is clear. You're welcome to have the last word though.
Brinda.
Join Date: Jun 2002
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Brindabella,...I tend to agree that it does tilt the field a little in our favour. Seems to me a little like the wheat Board (or any other agency in the same vein) arranging with the pollies to reduce the amount of imports to protect the industry in Aus.
I am NOT buying into the argument that O/S is better/same /worse than here, I have not been O/S, I have not looked into the standards or cross exam and licence transfer situation. I will say though that it would be nice if an international agreement was set to transfer back and forth with set targets and standards. OK I'm now dreaming.....Doe!
I am NOT buying into the argument that O/S is better/same /worse than here, I have not been O/S, I have not looked into the standards or cross exam and licence transfer situation. I will say though that it would be nice if an international agreement was set to transfer back and forth with set targets and standards. OK I'm now dreaming.....Doe!
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Brinda:
And yes, you're spot on, it does tilt the field(???) in my favour, and yes I'm grateful for that! But no, I still have what I feel are legitimate reasons for my opinion.
All the best.
