Tiger Moth crashed @ Ashburton - 2 dead
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NZ
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tiger Moth crashed @ Ashburton - 2 dead
I am slightly suprised this story hasn't made it here yet. Don't want to speculate too much what happened although I have a good idea - plane simply crashed into the ground.
There was a reasonably strong NE blowing - I was preflighting our Yak 52, about 50m from the chap in the Tiger. I flew away for the day, but it was quite eerie as I kind of saw the guys face and remember seeing him stick the chocks under the wheels etc. I was having a great day until I heard about the accident just before taking off on the return trip from Wigram, Christchurch. Just wanted to get the plane on the ground safely as quickly as possible.
Unfortunately the media has done a great job of talking bull**** into the series of stories that havecome out so far, including one wing detached, it struck powerlines etc, totally incorrect.
There was a reasonably strong NE blowing - I was preflighting our Yak 52, about 50m from the chap in the Tiger. I flew away for the day, but it was quite eerie as I kind of saw the guys face and remember seeing him stick the chocks under the wheels etc. I was having a great day until I heard about the accident just before taking off on the return trip from Wigram, Christchurch. Just wanted to get the plane on the ground safely as quickly as possible.
Unfortunately the media has done a great job of talking bull**** into the series of stories that havecome out so far, including one wing detached, it struck powerlines etc, totally incorrect.
Guest
Posts: n/a
http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3886976a10,00.html
The second part of the article, another double engine failure in the Partenavia, they will rapidly be lowering the mathematical odds of a double engine failure with piston engines. The salesmen moving C208's and PC12's will be loving them.
The second part of the article, another double engine failure in the Partenavia, they will rapidly be lowering the mathematical odds of a double engine failure with piston engines. The salesmen moving C208's and PC12's will be loving them.
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Police name dead tiger moth pilot
11.05am Sunday December 3, 2006
Police have released the name of one of the two victims of a light plane crash in Mid-Canterbury yesterday morning.
Pilot John Copland of Ashburton and his passenger died instantly when their deHavilland DH82A Tiger Moth spiralled into the ground, bursting into flames about 11am yesterday.
The two men were believed to have taken-off just moments before the recently restored Tiger Moth came crashing down 50 metres from a farm house north of Ashburton, just off State Highway One.
Police are yet to release the name of the dead passenger.
The two bodies were removed from the wreckage shortly before 5pm.
Police and the Civil Aviation Authority are investigating.
- NZPA
11.05am Sunday December 3, 2006
Police have released the name of one of the two victims of a light plane crash in Mid-Canterbury yesterday morning.
Pilot John Copland of Ashburton and his passenger died instantly when their deHavilland DH82A Tiger Moth spiralled into the ground, bursting into flames about 11am yesterday.
The two men were believed to have taken-off just moments before the recently restored Tiger Moth came crashing down 50 metres from a farm house north of Ashburton, just off State Highway One.
Police are yet to release the name of the dead passenger.
The two bodies were removed from the wreckage shortly before 5pm.
Police and the Civil Aviation Authority are investigating.
- NZPA
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NZ
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gotta love the media. They have put in their pathetic write up (which covers 50% of the front page) that the aeroplane in question is from the local aeroclub. Great publicity for them, I hope they have written to the newspaper concerned and demanded it be corrected in the next paper.
Sometimes I'd rather live in a cave and never hear news on world events, that way I'd never get the wrong idea, because I'd have no idea at all.
Sometimes I'd rather live in a cave and never hear news on world events, that way I'd never get the wrong idea, because I'd have no idea at all.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NZ
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It has been said that it will be virtually impossible to find out the course, such is the condition of the Tiger, it is completely destroyed, you can't tell the original colour of the paint job, as it appears to have burnt to nothing, judging by the photo in the paper - I just can't believe I was looking at that immaculate red and silver DH82 only hours before, lying meters from where I was, on a beautiful saturday morning on the airfield.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: NZCH
Age: 49
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My thoughts are with their family and friends alright.
It has been a bit of a dark period for NZ GA recently. But in other countries, this tragic event wouldn't even make the news.
It has been a bit of a dark period for NZ GA recently. But in other countries, this tragic event wouldn't even make the news.
Guest
Posts: n/a
how is it that we all know that 2 engines don't fail as such, but the media reports it as such? it's got nothing to do with piston engines, everything to do with trying to sort out problems at the expense of flying the plane first.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NZ
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Of course I didn't state that but I have been thinking about, hence how I indicated how much I was looking forward to getting on the ground that day as I had had enough for one day.
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Alice Springs
Posts: 1,744
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
People
Nearly all accidents are caused by errors made by humans. Partenavias CAN fly on one engine, but only if they are in good shape (and that does not mean just shiny paint and pretty avionics) and they have to be handled correctly.
With nearly all piston twins this is the case. They lose about 80% of their climbing ability when an engine fails, so there is not much left. It also happens to Cessnas, and Pipers, and Beechcraft.(and others) Some are a little better than others, but they are all much the same.
There has even been a case in Australia where a King Air did not have the performance to fly a circuit at sea level after an engine failure. It crashed short of the runway. King airs have reasonable performance on one, if everything is right. (about 600fpm)
A Bristol freighter flying freight across Bass straight lost an engine, and could not maintain altitude. It went into the sea. I believe the spare engines for that aircraft were tested, and found to be lacking in power.
We used to do simulated engine failures in Partenavias, after takeoff every time we did a rating renewal or a base check. You knew it was coming "not below 50 ft, not below VMCA plus ten." and an assymetric overshoot was also routine. The aeroplane WILL do it, but you have to do the sums, and do it right, in a good aeroplane. I did these from both the left seat and the right seat.
We cannot just say "pilot error" or "poor aircraft design that aeroplane won't do it", or the "double ngine failure" copout. The aircraft performance is spelled out in the POH/flight manual. If it won't do it there is omething wrong with either the crew, and the operating techniques, or the aircraft maintenance.
Our third world GA system has very limited maintenance facilities, poor infrastructure, a flood of inexperienced, temporary pilots and lack of finance due, it seems, to a regulator that the industry does not trust. We are bogged down in paperwork, and ever changing rules, and differing interpretations of the same rules.
Propping it up with tax concessions, and/or new aeroplanes only disguises the problem, and it will come back later. The "poor bugger me" system will not work.
What is needed is a team effort, where GA is considered as more than just a place for trainee airline pilots to get limited experience. and go. We must all work together to build a proper system where aeroplanes and pilots CAN do what they are supposed to do.
We have turbocharged aeroplanes flying around, limited to 8500ft amsl, due to a a transition level that is far too low, and an oxygen requiement at 10,000 ft. The rest of the world needs oxygen above 12,000 ft. Australians are weakies. All this costs time and money, for no reason.
We burn far more fuel in our aircraft than we need to. We have been doing it for decades. It's "the Australian way". Old wives tales rule.
Let's get back to the FACTS. These can be found in the POH,s and flight manuals. They don't come from the aircraft salesmen, or the aero club bar.
With nearly all piston twins this is the case. They lose about 80% of their climbing ability when an engine fails, so there is not much left. It also happens to Cessnas, and Pipers, and Beechcraft.(and others) Some are a little better than others, but they are all much the same.
There has even been a case in Australia where a King Air did not have the performance to fly a circuit at sea level after an engine failure. It crashed short of the runway. King airs have reasonable performance on one, if everything is right. (about 600fpm)
A Bristol freighter flying freight across Bass straight lost an engine, and could not maintain altitude. It went into the sea. I believe the spare engines for that aircraft were tested, and found to be lacking in power.
We used to do simulated engine failures in Partenavias, after takeoff every time we did a rating renewal or a base check. You knew it was coming "not below 50 ft, not below VMCA plus ten." and an assymetric overshoot was also routine. The aeroplane WILL do it, but you have to do the sums, and do it right, in a good aeroplane. I did these from both the left seat and the right seat.
We cannot just say "pilot error" or "poor aircraft design that aeroplane won't do it", or the "double ngine failure" copout. The aircraft performance is spelled out in the POH/flight manual. If it won't do it there is omething wrong with either the crew, and the operating techniques, or the aircraft maintenance.
Our third world GA system has very limited maintenance facilities, poor infrastructure, a flood of inexperienced, temporary pilots and lack of finance due, it seems, to a regulator that the industry does not trust. We are bogged down in paperwork, and ever changing rules, and differing interpretations of the same rules.
Propping it up with tax concessions, and/or new aeroplanes only disguises the problem, and it will come back later. The "poor bugger me" system will not work.
What is needed is a team effort, where GA is considered as more than just a place for trainee airline pilots to get limited experience. and go. We must all work together to build a proper system where aeroplanes and pilots CAN do what they are supposed to do.
We have turbocharged aeroplanes flying around, limited to 8500ft amsl, due to a a transition level that is far too low, and an oxygen requiement at 10,000 ft. The rest of the world needs oxygen above 12,000 ft. Australians are weakies. All this costs time and money, for no reason.
We burn far more fuel in our aircraft than we need to. We have been doing it for decades. It's "the Australian way". Old wives tales rule.
Let's get back to the FACTS. These can be found in the POH,s and flight manuals. They don't come from the aircraft salesmen, or the aero club bar.
