Pacific Blue to disappear ?
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Pacific Blue to disappear ?
Any VB people care to comment on a very recent board meeting in Brisbane where a decision to finish Pac Blue appears to have been made and use Virgin Blue to operate the existing services.
If this decision is true, what effect would this have on pilots currently working (contracted) to Pac Blue?
If this decision is true, what effect would this have on pilots currently working (contracted) to Pac Blue?
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Heard Virgin will be operating all of the services within the next 6 months. Apparently there was a recent review of it's Pacific Ops, and it didn't paint a pretty picture.
I understand Pac Blue have way too many crew for the amount of flying and that "synergies" could be developed if the flying were transferred to Virgin. Interestingly enough however, the Flt Attendants will remain on the services!
Can't say what would happen to the tech crew - there was discussion of integration into Virgin with one very senior employee stating "it would be a long time before any of them see a command!" Guess they will be re-hired as F/O's if they are lucky? ..... time will tell
I understand Pac Blue have way too many crew for the amount of flying and that "synergies" could be developed if the flying were transferred to Virgin. Interestingly enough however, the Flt Attendants will remain on the services!
Can't say what would happen to the tech crew - there was discussion of integration into Virgin with one very senior employee stating "it would be a long time before any of them see a command!" Guess they will be re-hired as F/O's if they are lucky? ..... time will tell
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If this were the case, then will all the Pacific flying be done out of Australia? Possibly a base in Sydney? What about the fact that there is a lot of flying on the Poly runs that would be hard to do directly out of Aus, ie Auckland-Tonga etc. There has obviously been a large amount of money spent setting up PB in NZ, would it make sense to shut the doors completely? What about the prospect of the PB crew simply joining the VB group and operating on the same conditions, super and an increased salary. I am sure the pilots and cabin crew would like that. Since the days of PB there has been a large amount of sceptisism in the entire operation, who knows where it will go from there. Surely PB has been doing a reasonable job in the 2 years it has been operating, there is no record breaking on the Tasman and to break even is a bonus.?????????Where does this VB info come from anyway
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Lets hope they don’t offer direct commands to PB captains.
As a company point of view, it would make sense. ie: no training required.
As for the current FO’s time will tell.
I hope the company looks after the current pilots first.
I wouldn’t want to be in flight Op’s if they decide to use PB captains.
As a company point of view, it would make sense. ie: no training required.
As for the current FO’s time will tell.
I hope the company looks after the current pilots first.
I wouldn’t want to be in flight Op’s if they decide to use PB captains.
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Why would we want these Pilots, when for the last 2 years they have been undercutting us. They are contractors! so their contract is finished, good-bye.
To those who would like a job as an F/O apply like everyone else in the industry. We already have plenty of people with command experience who have sat patiently in the right hand seat awaiting their turn. Also, this is not to mention those who have enormous experience in the right hand seat, and are long over due for an upgrade.
I dont think there is much sympathy for the PB crew?
To those who would like a job as an F/O apply like everyone else in the industry. We already have plenty of people with command experience who have sat patiently in the right hand seat awaiting their turn. Also, this is not to mention those who have enormous experience in the right hand seat, and are long over due for an upgrade.
I dont think there is much sympathy for the PB crew?
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Still only talking about a company operating 4 aeroplanes. Hardly a major shakeup. Good news for the VB guys - at bit of variety in the flying.
Believe PB were operating with about 10 crews per aircraft.
Believe PB were operating with about 10 crews per aircraft.
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ahhhh bitterpollypurebred, it is vb that came in undercutting all and sundry. Talk of a head in the sand syndrome.....or is it head up your ar5e. There is a saying son......."a rising tide raises all ships"....the converse is also true and your company was born, and is structured on the latter.
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I wonder where you guys get your info. From the sounds of it it is all fact and not just rumor. Has it not been the case where captains have been flying together at VB and that there may be a need for more pilots. I assume there is still some leaving for other higher paying jobs worldwide? Also if VB could have done ALL the flying initially then WHY did they set up PB? The pilots who fly at PB are just the same as those at VB. They are all pilots and should not be treated with the disrespect that some on this forum seem to think is fair. Everyone should remember where they came from.
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COP,
PB was initially set up as a cheaper version of DJ. The accountants worked out that if they were employed in NZ, PB didn't have to pay super, loss of licence insurance and a few others, along with the fact that they were on less salary and on contract if things didn't work out the way they expected.
After a couple of years of ops PB have now found themselves in the position of have twice the crew to aircraft ratio of DJ. All the cost incentives that were initially there to be had, have now become a debt to the airline. PB were expected to expand, however only their main routes still exist with only minor expansion in the Pacific. This leaves PB with only a minor part in the Pacific and inefficient rosters, wheras DJ has now has identified synergies that would actually make it cheaper to have the aircraft crewed by DJ pilots.
It now turns out that PB have ETOPs and DJ had it, then lost it, want it back, but can't get it!? This is why all DJ pilots will need a NZ licence when operating an NZ aircraft on ETOPS routes through the Pacific.
Hope that clarifies some points?
BTW, no disrespect intended. I personally know a handful of guys working with PB and would only hope the best for all of them, if this works out the way previously mentioned. Most of us have been out of work before and I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
PB was initially set up as a cheaper version of DJ. The accountants worked out that if they were employed in NZ, PB didn't have to pay super, loss of licence insurance and a few others, along with the fact that they were on less salary and on contract if things didn't work out the way they expected.
After a couple of years of ops PB have now found themselves in the position of have twice the crew to aircraft ratio of DJ. All the cost incentives that were initially there to be had, have now become a debt to the airline. PB were expected to expand, however only their main routes still exist with only minor expansion in the Pacific. This leaves PB with only a minor part in the Pacific and inefficient rosters, wheras DJ has now has identified synergies that would actually make it cheaper to have the aircraft crewed by DJ pilots.
It now turns out that PB have ETOPs and DJ had it, then lost it, want it back, but can't get it!? This is why all DJ pilots will need a NZ licence when operating an NZ aircraft on ETOPS routes through the Pacific.
Hope that clarifies some points?
BTW, no disrespect intended. I personally know a handful of guys working with PB and would only hope the best for all of them, if this works out the way previously mentioned. Most of us have been out of work before and I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Last edited by Macrohard; 9th Feb 2006 at 13:28.
Originally Posted by sweetpollypurebred
Why would we want these Pilots, when for the last 2 years they have been undercutting us. They are contractors! so their contract is finished, good-bye.
To those who would like a job as an F/O apply like everyone else in the industry. We already have plenty of people with command experience who have sat patiently in the right hand seat awaiting their turn. Also, this is not to mention those who have enormous experience in the right hand seat, and are long over due for an upgrade.
I dont think there is much sympathy for the PB crew?
To those who would like a job as an F/O apply like everyone else in the industry. We already have plenty of people with command experience who have sat patiently in the right hand seat awaiting their turn. Also, this is not to mention those who have enormous experience in the right hand seat, and are long over due for an upgrade.
I dont think there is much sympathy for the PB crew?
Well there is the pot calling the kettle black! Virgin Blue pilots bemoaning being professsionally undercut.
What a horrible tone toward others in possible misfortune, from the creme de la creme of the crap.
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I hate to dispell your rumour but it is incorrect. It is public record that Pacific/Poly Blue are strong and have an extensive Pacific network, in only their 2 years of operation.
What pricks my ears up is the International (A340) prospects, up agianst QF, across the Pacific (as on other threads here).
Also, number of crew per frame is very dependant of the length of flying legs undertaken... ie you have no choice but to overnight crews on some of the long ETOPS routes.
Happy landings
What pricks my ears up is the International (A340) prospects, up agianst QF, across the Pacific (as on other threads here).
Also, number of crew per frame is very dependant of the length of flying legs undertaken... ie you have no choice but to overnight crews on some of the long ETOPS routes.
Happy landings
Last edited by Chocks Away; 10th Feb 2006 at 00:01.
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NZ Aviation Medicals
Does this mean if VB take over all the PB flying that they will then pay for the cost of the New Zealand licence plus all the sundry expenses associated with the NZ medical tests you must undertake in order to obtain the NZ Licence?
I don't think there are a lot of Doctors in Australia who do NZ aviation medicals however there is one guy in Brisbane who does Australian, New Zealand plus quite a few other countries also.
Dr G Chaffey
Aviation Medical Centre Brisbane
585 Old Cleveland Road
CAMP HILL QLD 4152
Tel: 07 3398 8177
Fax: 07 3843 0055
Good luck to all PB & VB drivers - hope no-one gets the rough end of the pineapple!
I don't think there are a lot of Doctors in Australia who do NZ aviation medicals however there is one guy in Brisbane who does Australian, New Zealand plus quite a few other countries also.
Dr G Chaffey
Aviation Medical Centre Brisbane
585 Old Cleveland Road
CAMP HILL QLD 4152
Tel: 07 3398 8177
Fax: 07 3843 0055
Good luck to all PB & VB drivers - hope no-one gets the rough end of the pineapple!
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props, I'm not with you. Why would you not want to be in Flt Ops if PB crew come on board?
And which w@nker mentioned PB undercutting VB? Isn't tht what VB has been doing since its inception; doing it for less than QF? So how's that different?
I'm sure youcan justify it, or at least the former CP can. It was worth upwards of $10 Million, yes Million, in his back pocket to screw his pilots down.
And which w@nker mentioned PB undercutting VB? Isn't tht what VB has been doing since its inception; doing it for less than QF? So how's that different?
I'm sure youcan justify it, or at least the former CP can. It was worth upwards of $10 Million, yes Million, in his back pocket to screw his pilots down.
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Relax737
Reference my Flt Op’s comment.
I said if they use PB captains before VB FO’s, nothing said about using PB crew.
I was only referring to the current FO’s possibly being upset.
A lot of VB FO’s have been around since day one (5 years). They are just as qualified as anyone else.
Reference my Flt Op’s comment.
I said if they use PB captains before VB FO’s, nothing said about using PB crew.
I was only referring to the current FO’s possibly being upset.
A lot of VB FO’s have been around since day one (5 years). They are just as qualified as anyone else.
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As one of the other people mentioned the reason for the seemingly lack of synergy at PB would probably have something to do with the fact that the sectors are long and the flight and duty restrictions would not allow a return trip to NZ. Even some of the Aus to Island flying would surely test the limit, ie Syd-Nan-Syd. It may seem that some do not work as hard as others, but I would think that most would rather be flying and earning than sitting around at a hotel. I have no answer for the extra crew other than what I just mentioned, but if that is not the reason, then someone should explain why there is more crew per aircraft. I could see that most pilots working 60 hours a month could do with more, especially thiose that want it and if the number of crew per aircraft was reduced then this would occur. Less crew and more flying probably leading to more whinging and less morale. But I guess that is what every pilot and every airline has excelled at. As I said earlier, if there is a reason for the more crews lets hear it. Anyone??? Other than the Pacific flying what else is there? Everything done at PB is surely done with the approval of big brother at VB, if this is the case then there must be a solid reason.
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Listen here Fire Knob, I`d be real careful who I called SON, I`d reckon I was long at work earning my keep, while you were still suckling your Mummy's Breast!!
So hitch up your short pants Boy,and climb aboard your Tricycle and get yourself of to school, the bell's about to go.
To you Knackerberg you still need to go and see a priest or a prostitute and expel your bitterness. keep smiling happyman!!!
So hitch up your short pants Boy,and climb aboard your Tricycle and get yourself of to school, the bell's about to go.
To you Knackerberg you still need to go and see a priest or a prostitute and expel your bitterness. keep smiling happyman!!!
Props,
Sorry old boy, but your quote
is incorrect.
1 maybe 2 F/O's that are eligible for promotion have been around for more than 4 -4.5 years, the rest are more junior than that, and those couple have not yet got their command because of various reasons, not the least of which being when the last commands were awarded early last year they were not ready.
Sorry old boy, but your quote
A lot of VB FO’s have been around since day one (5 years).
1 maybe 2 F/O's that are eligible for promotion have been around for more than 4 -4.5 years, the rest are more junior than that, and those couple have not yet got their command because of various reasons, not the least of which being when the last commands were awarded early last year they were not ready.