Pacific Blue to disappear ?
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Dehavillanddriver
Without dragging this out of proportion.
Yes you are correct;
my point is that there are many FO’s in the VB network, which are more than ready to take up a command position.
The last command training took place around September 2004. So any pilot that didn’t have the requirements then, hopefully wouldn’t have that problem now.
Keep in mind this point of view is of a general nature, I’m sure there would still be pilots not ready for a command.
Without dragging this out of proportion.
Yes you are correct;
my point is that there are many FO’s in the VB network, which are more than ready to take up a command position.The last command training took place around September 2004. So any pilot that didn’t have the requirements then, hopefully wouldn’t have that problem now.
Keep in mind this point of view is of a general nature, I’m sure there would still be pilots not ready for a command.
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Interesting replies but no real feedback or confirmation that it is going to happen.
The current PB cost base would increase significantly if VB crews took this on full time, as Australian labour costs would still be paid. Contract crews are very cheap (relatively speaking).
Also, can't see how PB crew numbers could be reduced much with the current network and duty hours involved.
It may well pay to keep PB afloat until all the issues with Trans Pacific flying, use of the VB name etc etc are resolved - and that could take years.
The other "biggy" is how will an outcome from the barney between Toll and Patrick affect both VB and PB?
The current PB cost base would increase significantly if VB crews took this on full time, as Australian labour costs would still be paid. Contract crews are very cheap (relatively speaking).
Also, can't see how PB crew numbers could be reduced much with the current network and duty hours involved.
It may well pay to keep PB afloat until all the issues with Trans Pacific flying, use of the VB name etc etc are resolved - and that could take years.
The other "biggy" is how will an outcome from the barney between Toll and Patrick affect both VB and PB?
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No one really knows and there is a lot of hot air within the ranks.
There is a current review of Work Rules in progress, the result of which could potentially seal the fate of the PB crews, and introduce some much needed variety into the VB pilots network.
Alternatively if the VB crews don't accept/negotiate changes, the future could be gold for the PB crews including wide bodies to the USA.
There is a current review of Work Rules in progress, the result of which could potentially seal the fate of the PB crews, and introduce some much needed variety into the VB pilots network.
Alternatively if the VB crews don't accept/negotiate changes, the future could be gold for the PB crews including wide bodies to the USA.
I think I can say with almost total certainty that pay and conditions will not go backwards - they may not leap ahead, but they won't go backwards.
I think the reference to the eba was to do with flight and duty rules.
Regardless of the eba, the widebodies, if they actually come, will probably be VH tailed because of the traffic right issues.
I think the reference to the eba was to do with flight and duty rules.
Regardless of the eba, the widebodies, if they actually come, will probably be VH tailed because of the traffic right issues.
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Re-read my post matey.
I never have nor ever will advocate a reduction in VB's pay or conditions. Work Rules changes will hopefully be a win-win for pilots and Management. Work Rules changes could involve flexibility etc, not a reduction in conditions.
I could see PB's operation moving to a Sydney base with a long-haul consideration for whoever gets the gig - VB or PB.
History will tell but either way there is no way I see the VB crew signing off on a long haul/widebody deal as shabby as the one J@#*r have signed !
I never have nor ever will advocate a reduction in VB's pay or conditions. Work Rules changes will hopefully be a win-win for pilots and Management. Work Rules changes could involve flexibility etc, not a reduction in conditions.
I could see PB's operation moving to a Sydney base with a long-haul consideration for whoever gets the gig - VB or PB.
History will tell but either way there is no way I see the VB crew signing off on a long haul/widebody deal as shabby as the one J@#*r have signed !
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PB/ VB
Well I hope PB stays just where it is. The inside story I here is thats exactly whats going to happen!
A nice quiet little job flying around the Pacific in a nice quiet little industry, or join the kindergarten here in Oz.
I know what my choice would be!
A nice quiet little job flying around the Pacific in a nice quiet little industry, or join the kindergarten here in Oz.
I know what my choice would be!
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Yes, where is the business plan to confront the structured roll out of J* all across the Pacific in what use to be the domain of smart,contemporary, VB with its sassy PB brand?
J* is about to eat PB's lunch and there is absolutely no strategic overview of any response, plan or counterpoint.....
Why I bet the Flight Operations staff on the line, don't know they have a new CEO. Officially any way.
The silence from the continued review of Pacific Blue Operations is,,,,,,
well indicative of one of those paralysis of VB management.
If there is a future for PB the time to point out where it lies is Now.
Serious comments from HGW and Pete Conrad welcomed.
Over to you, all.
J* is about to eat PB's lunch and there is absolutely no strategic overview of any response, plan or counterpoint.....
Why I bet the Flight Operations staff on the line, don't know they have a new CEO. Officially any way.
The silence from the continued review of Pacific Blue Operations is,,,,,,
well indicative of one of those paralysis of VB management.
If there is a future for PB the time to point out where it lies is Now.
Serious comments from HGW and Pete Conrad welcomed.
Over to you, all.
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Yuh dreamin...
The reason "Pornstar" is launching into the Pacific (and only on a limited basis mind you) is 'cause PB have done a good job of expanding the Pacific market (on public record) and putting a dent in Air Pacifics' ledger (partly QF owned!).
PB are just going about their jobs, doing the jobs and looking after the jobs at hand, complimenting the Virgin/Rex network.
While I'm at it : Pornstars' roll out in Christchurch was funny... big street procession, bands, road writing etc and PB just sent down a handfull of their available cabin crew/staff, handing out brochures and talking to people... took the pace of the launch...
All's fair in love and war.
Happy landings
The reason "Pornstar" is launching into the Pacific (and only on a limited basis mind you) is 'cause PB have done a good job of expanding the Pacific market (on public record) and putting a dent in Air Pacifics' ledger (partly QF owned!).
PB are just going about their jobs, doing the jobs and looking after the jobs at hand, complimenting the Virgin/Rex network.
While I'm at it : Pornstars' roll out in Christchurch was funny... big street procession, bands, road writing etc and PB just sent down a handfull of their available cabin crew/staff, handing out brochures and talking to people... took the pace of the launch...
All's fair in love and war.
Happy landings
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As for the Virgin name being used outside of Oz, how about this for the way it is going to work?
Toll buys Patrick (and all who sail in her).
Toll sells VB to Virgin Atlantic (49% owned by SQ).
Therefore, SQ now own a large portion of VB.
If the Oz Govt won't let SQ fly accross the Pacific in their own right, then at least they can take a chunk of the profit from VBs new long haul pacific venture.
I think you'll find when SQ have a stake in VB, there won't be such a problem using the Virgin name outside Oz anymore.
Makes sense to me.............
Toll buys Patrick (and all who sail in her).
Toll sells VB to Virgin Atlantic (49% owned by SQ).
Therefore, SQ now own a large portion of VB.
If the Oz Govt won't let SQ fly accross the Pacific in their own right, then at least they can take a chunk of the profit from VBs new long haul pacific venture.
I think you'll find when SQ have a stake in VB, there won't be such a problem using the Virgin name outside Oz anymore.
Makes sense to me.............
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Excuse Me !!!!! 
The reason "Pornstar" is launching into the Pacific (and only on a limited basis mind you) is 'cause PB have done a good job of expanding the Pacific market (on public record) and putting a dent in Air Pacifics' ledger (partly QF owned!).
Where have the expanded the market? They might have stolen the odd pax off the other carriers but expanded the market is bull. They are doing very little more than what Poly was doing before.
The reason "Pornstar" is launching into the Pacific (and only on a limited basis mind you) is 'cause PB have done a good job of expanding the Pacific market (on public record) and putting a dent in Air Pacifics' ledger (partly QF owned!).
Where have the expanded the market? They might have stolen the odd pax off the other carriers but expanded the market is bull. They are doing very little more than what Poly was doing before.
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Chocks beware "lies, damned lies and statistics".
If there were 100 passengers a week to Vanuatu and now there are 150 that represents a 50% growth. However 50 passengers is not even a third of the 738's capacity if you get my point.
The PR smells of someone trying real hard to hang on to a sinking ship "just in case".
Once again no offence to the great PB crew intended. For their sake I hope all goes well.
If there were 100 passengers a week to Vanuatu and now there are 150 that represents a 50% growth. However 50 passengers is not even a third of the 738's capacity if you get my point.
The PR smells of someone trying real hard to hang on to a sinking ship "just in case".
Once again no offence to the great PB crew intended. For their sake I hope all goes well.
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Fellas, there's no sinking ship as you blokes try to spread.
That link was taken from the first year of operation if you care toi look at the date. Not PR but have a look at the asterix at the bottom and it's offical Dept Trans figures!
It is public knowledge that in the first 2 years of operations THEY MADE A PROFIT AND ARE HEALTHY... How much plainer does it have to be, or more reading of actual statistics do you need before you understand.
That link was taken from the first year of operation if you care toi look at the date. Not PR but have a look at the asterix at the bottom and it's offical Dept Trans figures!
It is public knowledge that in the first 2 years of operations THEY MADE A PROFIT AND ARE HEALTHY... How much plainer does it have to be, or more reading of actual statistics do you need before you understand.
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I can't believe that you would provide a link to PBs own Web site to back up your belief. Ask the Vanuatu Govt, the Fiji Govt etc if visitor numbers have increased......
The Flights Samoa etc were being done by Poly before they hooked up with PB...
BTW the average Samoan is pi
ed off with the short seat pitch etc on the PB aircraft compared to the Poly aircraft that was handed back to the leasors.
PB spin not market growth mate..
The Flights Samoa etc were being done by Poly before they hooked up with PB...
BTW the average Samoan is pi
ed off with the short seat pitch etc on the PB aircraft compared to the Poly aircraft that was handed back to the leasors. PB spin not market growth mate..
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I'll repeat in bold for those of you that can't read and put 2 and 2 together... IN ASTERIX:* Bureau of Transport and Regional Services (BTRE) publication "International Scheduled Air Transport - Aviation Statistics" and are for the period September 04 to April 05....not MY BELIEF or PB spin doctors!!!
You have a short memory.
Poly went under/struggled to survive, as has many Pacific carriers over the times.
Pacific Blue/Virgin struck an amicable deal with the current owners and has operated since, where there may possibly have been an over priced (read inequitable) operation otherwise.
Happy Landings
...and don't call me mate.
You have a short memory.
Poly went under/struggled to survive, as has many Pacific carriers over the times.
Pacific Blue/Virgin struck an amicable deal with the current owners and has operated since, where there may possibly have been an over priced (read inequitable) operation otherwise.
Happy Landings
...and don't call me mate.
Last edited by Chocks Away; 18th Apr 2006 at 15:50.
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Chocks away Maaate!
The BTRE did not attribute the so called expansion to PB.... Godfrey did.
As Air NZ and Qantas have found out on the Tasman .... extra flights don't necessarily mean market expansion. Re-distribution of existing customers among carriers does not mean market expansion.
Re-distribution of existing passengers to new carriers does not mean market expansion.
The BTRE did not attribute the so called expansion to PB.... Godfrey did.
As Air NZ and Qantas have found out on the Tasman .... extra flights don't necessarily mean market expansion. Re-distribution of existing customers among carriers does not mean market expansion.
Re-distribution of existing passengers to new carriers does not mean market expansion.
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Poly still exists Maate! It has not "gone under" It does struggle under pathetic management but what airline doesn't.
So does anybody know (apart from those who paid and took incentives) how long the deal is for?
So does anybody know (apart from those who paid and took incentives) how long the deal is for?
