oz jump seats
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: In a box, ready for shipping...
Posts: 717
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Department of Transport and Regional Services ruling...
Only ASIC holders are permitted to use the jumpseat of commercial airlines for staff travel purposes. Non ASIC holders, including beneficiaries, are no longer permitted.
Only ASIC holders are permitted to use the jumpseat of commercial airlines for staff travel purposes. Non ASIC holders, including beneficiaries, are no longer permitted.
I don't believe that this is the case.
As far as I am aware the jump seat is not limited to ASIC holders.
It certainly isn't in our company - we need photo ID and the Captain needs to positively identify the person, and they need to be the usual official people or people eligible for staff travel
As far as I am aware the jump seat is not limited to ASIC holders.
It certainly isn't in our company - we need photo ID and the Captain needs to positively identify the person, and they need to be the usual official people or people eligible for staff travel
Grandpa Aerotart
In my company only 'staff'....so my daughter who I have, naturally enough, known since she was born cannot....but a staff member who I have never met can...to his credit even our boss thinks that is bizarre but there you go....another gem from DOTARS.
Nunc est bibendum
DHD, this was the subject of some discussion on Qrewroom.
We have been informed that ASIC holder only. Parents, brothers, sisters and children now can NOT ride in the jump seat unless they are employed by QF group and hold ASIC. QF claims that this is what the regulation states. Most crew reckon that the regulation means one the aircraft is airborne.
Can you confirm for me that DJ is still allowing 'eligible beneficiaries' on the jump? We have heard it rumoured thus but I've never heard it direct from a DJ source.
Like Chimbu, we all recognise the stupidity that Bilal Kalzai (or however the baggage handler on terrorism charges spells his name) was eligible for jump seat ride whilst my kids aren't however we've been warned that if we push the issue with the government, the flight deck may become off limits to everyone except the operating crew. That creates major hassles for commuters and those of us who get the jump seat occasionally.
We have been informed that ASIC holder only. Parents, brothers, sisters and children now can NOT ride in the jump seat unless they are employed by QF group and hold ASIC. QF claims that this is what the regulation states. Most crew reckon that the regulation means one the aircraft is airborne.
Can you confirm for me that DJ is still allowing 'eligible beneficiaries' on the jump? We have heard it rumoured thus but I've never heard it direct from a DJ source.
Like Chimbu, we all recognise the stupidity that Bilal Kalzai (or however the baggage handler on terrorism charges spells his name) was eligible for jump seat ride whilst my kids aren't however we've been warned that if we push the issue with the government, the flight deck may become off limits to everyone except the operating crew. That creates major hassles for commuters and those of us who get the jump seat occasionally.
Grandpa Aerotart
Keg I wonder if a GA pilot travelling as a pax with his shiny new ATSIC card can occupy a jumpseat if no other seat available...and if not why not?
They couldn't suggest their new ATSIC is not good enough surely?
They couldn't suggest their new ATSIC is not good enough surely?
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: BN196R @ 20nm
Age: 59
Posts: 79
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not sure if a Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Community (ATSIC) card will help but an Aviation Security Identification Card(ASIC) still won't help unless you are an employee(of QF at least)
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
QF claims that this is what the regulation states.
-------------------------------------------------
Keg,
QF has chosen, for whatever reason, to interpret the regulation in that manner. To the best of my knowledge, not many other carriers (if any, other than Australian & Jet* ??) do likewise. You'd have to try to obtain a clarification of policy from DOTARS. Good luck!
-------------------------------------------------
Keg,
QF has chosen, for whatever reason, to interpret the regulation in that manner. To the best of my knowledge, not many other carriers (if any, other than Australian & Jet* ??) do likewise. You'd have to try to obtain a clarification of policy from DOTARS. Good luck!
Nunc est bibendum
56P, that much I'm clear on. What I was after from DHD or other DJ crew is that they definitely are applying the very same legislation in a very different way and the logic that they are using to do that.
At the moment, no one is taking responsibility for sorting this out. DOTARS say the reg is the reg and so comply, Qf security interpret it one way and force a very restrictive set of rules on Flight Ops that mean my seven year old daughter is not allowed on the flight deck with me- very hard to take her anywhere now! DJ take a different line and appear to be able to still do this. Flight Ops blame security, security blame DOTARS, DOTARS shrug their soldiers and say the reg is the reg so just comply.....it's not a concern to any of them about whether my wife and kids can join me on the flight deck or not. It is a concern to me.
At the moment, no one is taking responsibility for sorting this out. DOTARS say the reg is the reg and so comply, Qf security interpret it one way and force a very restrictive set of rules on Flight Ops that mean my seven year old daughter is not allowed on the flight deck with me- very hard to take her anywhere now! DJ take a different line and appear to be able to still do this. Flight Ops blame security, security blame DOTARS, DOTARS shrug their soldiers and say the reg is the reg so just comply.....it's not a concern to any of them about whether my wife and kids can join me on the flight deck or not. It is a concern to me.
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Lost, but often Indonesia
Posts: 653
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My brother has told me that I can no longer ride in the jump seat (Virgin Blue).
Last had the pleasure in November 2005, Perth-Melb. Apparently applies to flight attendants and other non-tech crew also.
Last had the pleasure in November 2005, Perth-Melb. Apparently applies to flight attendants and other non-tech crew also.
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Perth Australia
Age: 80
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
1 Post
What a sad place the world has become where our own kids are considered to be "unsuitable" to travel in our cockpits, the sodding sysem couldn't find it's arse in the dark with both hands.
Captains used to be CAPTAINS and had the authority to do that job in all its glory and RESPONSIBILITY and earned that respect.
Some knuckle dragging low life people have beaten us all to be pushed around, disadvantaged, frisked by thugs at the gate, prevented from enjoying most things aviation as pilots.
BUT WE HAVE LET IT HAPPEN!!!!!!
All too busy being busy and let the dills run us ragged.
I am sure I had the best times 1960s to 2003 as an operator/pilot.
Simulators are a lot more fun.
siu generous
Captains used to be CAPTAINS and had the authority to do that job in all its glory and RESPONSIBILITY and earned that respect.
Some knuckle dragging low life people have beaten us all to be pushed around, disadvantaged, frisked by thugs at the gate, prevented from enjoying most things aviation as pilots.
BUT WE HAVE LET IT HAPPEN!!!!!!
All too busy being busy and let the dills run us ragged.
I am sure I had the best times 1960s to 2003 as an operator/pilot.
Simulators are a lot more fun.
siu generous
I recall back in the good old days when I was an apprentice with TAA I used to ride in the jump seat all the time. My wife and kids have all done the same. Those days the captain was the commander and with the rare exception were all top guys. Later in PX it was the same too.
I think this crass stupidity by the lawmakers, and being hassled by security goons with a collective IQ of ??? has taken all the fun and enjoyment of travel.
I certainly do not enjoy the industry as I used to.
I think this crass stupidity by the lawmakers, and being hassled by security goons with a collective IQ of ??? has taken all the fun and enjoyment of travel.
I certainly do not enjoy the industry as I used to.
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Conventia, the convention hall planet
Age: 42
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This seems a bit rich.
Back in the day I was a bag chucker, not employed by the airline (contractor, with NoPulse). Often I'd wonder up to Dispatch at the end of my shift and score a jump ride up or down the coast. 90% of the time this was fine with them, providing no C&T was going on, pending captain's approval. Never had one turn me down.
It was a great way to make friends and network - being a student at the time, it was very helpful and a great motivator. Sad to see this opportunity go through paranoia
Back in the day I was a bag chucker, not employed by the airline (contractor, with NoPulse). Often I'd wonder up to Dispatch at the end of my shift and score a jump ride up or down the coast. 90% of the time this was fine with them, providing no C&T was going on, pending captain's approval. Never had one turn me down.
It was a great way to make friends and network - being a student at the time, it was very helpful and a great motivator. Sad to see this opportunity go through paranoia
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Where people don't care
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are two aspects to staff in jump seats: 'security' and 'staff travel'. It's easy to understand why jump seating is verbotim fort security reasons, no matter who the jump seat rider is. As to Staff Travel, why should a dependent of a pilot get a ride ahead of anyone else in the pecking order just because he or she is somehow connected to the pilot?? Is any pilot able to justify with a straight face and with fairness why their kith and kin should get a ride ahead of a more senior colleague?
pilot?? Is any pilot able to justify with a straight face and with fairness why their kith and kin should get a ride ahead of a more senior colleague?
Nunc est bibendum
Originally Posted by Don Esson
Is any pilot able to justify with a straight face and with fairness why their kith and kin should get a ride ahead of a more senior colleague?
To extend the thought though, I've got no problems with the most junior F/O/ Captain in the airline promising the jump to his travel partner, kids, another crew member, whoever no matter how junior to me. I do that because I understand that the jump seat is a privilege that belongs to the operating crew to bestow. It is not mine to demand because I'm the next most senior person on the flight.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some years back pre 9/11 there was a fairly major incident at a US freight airline, I think it was UPS(?) a disgruntled employee fired one day, came back the next day, as the crews all knew him they gladly let him hop into the jump to hitch a lift somewhere. Shortly after take off he took to the operating crew with a fireaxe, fortunately the CAPT was able to subdue him despite his serious injuries. A very sketchy report I know, but proves the point that an operating crew can not just automatically assume that an airline employee is a safe bet...
I have also been advised at work (DJ) that only staff with ASIC and technically meant to be in uniform, can be allocated the jump, and strictly with CAPT permission.
I have also been advised at work (DJ) that only staff with ASIC and technically meant to be in uniform, can be allocated the jump, and strictly with CAPT permission.