Side-slipping in light aircraft
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POH says to avoid windmilling the prop, so I try to be nice to my toys, 1600-1800 range keeps the engine warm. and carb on for that length of time reduces any risk of ice, bearing in mind the following approach and landing in the next 2 mins or so
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Entry into a spin from this configuration, is it more "dynamic" than from a stall?
AcroAce60, mate thanks for the link. To be more specific about what I experienced. Was trimed for 100kts at 2000ft, was mucking about just doing turns around something my paxs wanted to look at. Started a turn but led in with a bit more rudder. Seat of pants feeling of deceleration and witnessed by speed decaying 20kts. Unusual getting ANY feeling of deceleration which made me sit up and take notice what was happening. This was only thru maybe 30deg of change of direction so was over a very short period.(I would like to add that at the time I was thinking also along the lines of the extra keel area being presented to airflow was a big factor so at the time was thinking that in a controlled situation, This could be a good thing.)But it felt too wrong so centered the ball and continued the turn. However, now I have seen this and grey matter has been jogged will put this configuration as "Something is telling me that I am not supposed to be here" Am considering an aero endorsment and will definitely ask for this to be included. Curiosity has been satisfied. Thank-you.
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Gday Ovum
I take it from your post you haven’t flown an aircraft without flaps.
Keeping in mind that every crosswind landing is a sideslip, which I'm pretty sure is what the syllabus is getting at when it says "side slip aeroplane"
Let’s see what that unit 7 of the Aeroplane Pilot Competency Standards has to say about Sideslipping.
TO ENTER SIDESLIP
Wing is lowered during the glide.
Opposite rudder is applied to prevent the turn.
Elevators are used to adjust nose attitude to maintain glide IAS (+10 -5 Knots)
Ailerons are used to maintain bank angle
Rate of descent is adjusted by coordinating angle of bank and applied rudder.
TO RECOVER FROM SIDESLIP
Recovery height is anticipated.
Wings are rolled parallel to horizon using ailerons.
Yaw is controlled with rudder.
TO ENTER A SIDESLIPPING TURN AND RECOVER.
Whilst in a gliding turn opposite rudder is applied to cause aeroplane to sideslip.
Turn and descent rates are controlled by coordinated angle of bank and use of rudder.
IAS is controlled with elevator.
Roll out feature or heading, and height is anticipated.
Wings are rolled parallel to horizon.
Yaw is controlled with rudder.
Nose attitude is adjusted with control column to maintain glide speed.
I have left out some Airmanship points from above eg lookout and oil pressure thingies.
Ovum me old mate if that is what you think is a crosswind landing you must have had some spectacular arrivals and if you do hold a GA licence I would go back to those who trained you and question them as why you weren’t taught as required by the regulations coz someone must have ticked that box.
Sorry to stuff up that theory.
Cheers Q
I take it from your post you haven’t flown an aircraft without flaps.
Keeping in mind that every crosswind landing is a sideslip, which I'm pretty sure is what the syllabus is getting at when it says "side slip aeroplane"
Let’s see what that unit 7 of the Aeroplane Pilot Competency Standards has to say about Sideslipping.
TO ENTER SIDESLIP
Wing is lowered during the glide.
Opposite rudder is applied to prevent the turn.
Elevators are used to adjust nose attitude to maintain glide IAS (+10 -5 Knots)
Ailerons are used to maintain bank angle
Rate of descent is adjusted by coordinating angle of bank and applied rudder.
TO RECOVER FROM SIDESLIP
Recovery height is anticipated.
Wings are rolled parallel to horizon using ailerons.
Yaw is controlled with rudder.
TO ENTER A SIDESLIPPING TURN AND RECOVER.
Whilst in a gliding turn opposite rudder is applied to cause aeroplane to sideslip.
Turn and descent rates are controlled by coordinated angle of bank and use of rudder.
IAS is controlled with elevator.
Roll out feature or heading, and height is anticipated.
Wings are rolled parallel to horizon.
Yaw is controlled with rudder.
Nose attitude is adjusted with control column to maintain glide speed.
I have left out some Airmanship points from above eg lookout and oil pressure thingies.
Ovum me old mate if that is what you think is a crosswind landing you must have had some spectacular arrivals and if you do hold a GA licence I would go back to those who trained you and question them as why you weren’t taught as required by the regulations coz someone must have ticked that box.
Sorry to stuff up that theory.
Cheers Q
Silly Old Git
Head in the cockpit watchin the ASI in a tiger moth during a side slip would pretty well end up with you sitting in a pile of crumpled fabric and wires on the end of the runway 
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I have been doen this road before when a local hero / grade three instructor protested loudly my use of side slip in a 182. have thought about it and experimented with it at altitude and came up with -
* Cessna flaps are not designed for a sideways load (have a look at them next time you pre flight a cessna and you will understand)
* The 'side on" relative airflow to the pitot tube will cause you asi to under read ( C-182 80 kts indicated at 30 degrees side slip equals 100 kts, try a side slip while watching the asi for confirmation)
*horizontal stabilizer and fuse shields part of the elevators in the side slip reducing control authority (experiment with this at altitude very gently as it will be apparent even at small angles of bank)
* aiming point can be off to one side in a side slip and can be used to correct position as well as height.
Finally don't listen to any crap about side slips being a thing of the past or only good for fixing a bad approach, learn them at a safe height and then chalk it up as a tool of the trade.
* Cessna flaps are not designed for a sideways load (have a look at them next time you pre flight a cessna and you will understand)
* The 'side on" relative airflow to the pitot tube will cause you asi to under read ( C-182 80 kts indicated at 30 degrees side slip equals 100 kts, try a side slip while watching the asi for confirmation)
*horizontal stabilizer and fuse shields part of the elevators in the side slip reducing control authority (experiment with this at altitude very gently as it will be apparent even at small angles of bank)
* aiming point can be off to one side in a side slip and can be used to correct position as well as height.
Finally don't listen to any crap about side slips being a thing of the past or only good for fixing a bad approach, learn them at a safe height and then chalk it up as a tool of the trade.
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G'day QNIM
You're right, I've never flown an aircraft without flaps...my point was in reference to Tinpis' post about the relevance in sideslipping a flapped aeroplane. Thanks for the reference there, however I still stick by my point that every crosswind landing is a sideslip. Anyone who disagrees needs some serious revision in aerodynamics. Just because the competency standard requires you must be able to sideslip in a glide doesn't mean there aren't other times where it would be required.
Anyways, this thread is really starting to pull teeth. Take it easy
You're right, I've never flown an aircraft without flaps...my point was in reference to Tinpis' post about the relevance in sideslipping a flapped aeroplane. Thanks for the reference there, however I still stick by my point that every crosswind landing is a sideslip. Anyone who disagrees needs some serious revision in aerodynamics. Just because the competency standard requires you must be able to sideslip in a glide doesn't mean there aren't other times where it would be required.
Anyways, this thread is really starting to pull teeth. Take it easy
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I'd like to resurrect this thread for a moment to discuss a movie clip I once saw of the Northrup YF-17 at Farnborough (1974?). The Northup pilot, who was narrating the film, said he was a mite "hot and high" on downwind after finishing his routine, so he maintained a slip during his 180 to final.
I asked him afterward if he regarded that as an undue risk. He said "No, it behaves just like a J-3 Cub, I'm very comfortable in a slip with it."
(I've been slipping down final since my third hour of dual, 45 years ago.)
I asked him afterward if he regarded that as an undue risk. He said "No, it behaves just like a J-3 Cub, I'm very comfortable in a slip with it."
(I've been slipping down final since my third hour of dual, 45 years ago.)
relative airflow to the pitot tube will cause you asi to
not designed for a sideways load
Still haven't flown a J-3, not likely to get into a YF-17.
Sunfish - I've been on hols, not done much flying recently.
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"Ahhhhh Chuck ya wanna ease up on the right rudder there a teensy bit buddy? ahhhhh..Chuck?...god damn !
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Originally Posted by barit1
I'd like to resurrect this thread for a moment to discuss a movie clip I once saw of the Northrup YF-17
At least that the way the current incarnation, Northrop Grumman Corporation, spells it!
