...............This time wankers
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...............This time wankers
An annoying phrase that won't go away is "This time".
If your departing then it takes no longer to say "XYZ departed 55" rather than "XYZ departed this time"
When taxying, then your taxying why say this time, if your going to say this time then why not say on this fine day too?
If your departing then it takes no longer to say "XYZ departed 55" rather than "XYZ departed this time"
When taxying, then your taxying why say this time, if your going to say this time then why not say on this fine day too?
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I'm not sure which is more anal, people who say "this time", or people who complain about other people who say "this time'...
Besides we all know that ATC are unable to tell time, so...
Besides we all know that ATC are unable to tell time, so...
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Couple of reasons
1. One less number to keep in your head when giving (sometimes) long and complex radio calls.
2. "This time" means right now. If I were to say (at time 55) "Departed time 55" that means that everyone who has an interest in my transmission has to check their timepiece and do a mental conversion, only to realise "Oh, he meant right now!"
(I've never heard anyone giving "this time" as part of a taxi call)
Why is this a problem for you?
2. "This time" means right now. If I were to say (at time 55) "Departed time 55" that means that everyone who has an interest in my transmission has to check their timepiece and do a mental conversion, only to realise "Oh, he meant right now!"
(I've never heard anyone giving "this time" as part of a taxi call)
Why is this a problem for you?
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Fair point
I hadn't thought of that. I do get a time check when taxiing, but of course, am unlikely to be saying "This time" to the ATCO with whom I did a time check.
Disagree with the "plain lazy" call, as I still think it's an aid to other pilots SA.
DIVOSH!
Disagree with the "plain lazy" call, as I still think it's an aid to other pilots SA.
DIVOSH!
Seasonally Adjusted
Of a similar nature is the call, "....estimate XXX at time three six". Is it necessary to say 'time'?
Not being anal here, just trying to 'trim some of the fat' from my radio calls.
Not being anal here, just trying to 'trim some of the fat' from my radio calls.
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Right on Chef. No requirement anywhere in AIP/Jepps to use the word "time", but it really is amusing to hear it so often.
In addition Cecil, saying the numbers allows a latent check (for ATC) to confirm your clocks are reasonably in synch. This is particularly important in a procedural environment.
If I had a $ for every time somebody got a departure time wrong (including myself), only for the ATCO to query it with a time check, then I'd have a full pocket of dollar coins
Gidday.
In addition Cecil, saying the numbers allows a latent check (for ATC) to confirm your clocks are reasonably in synch. This is particularly important in a procedural environment.
If I had a $ for every time somebody got a departure time wrong (including myself), only for the ATCO to query it with a time check, then I'd have a full pocket of dollar coins
Gidday.
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It's just another Americanism, a piece of verbal diahorrea used by people who have watched one too many war movies.
The only words you need to use are the ones described in the AIP. Anything else is unnecessary.
Saying "xxxxx this time" is a complete oxymoron, as all around you already know that is what you are doing without the additional words.
Lastly, it certainly doesn't help Situational Awareness when you are in airspace used by others for whom English is not their first language. Many foreign pilots only have specific english for aviation (particularly Russians), and if you start using non-standard phraseology, you confuse the crap out of them.
Are we really discussing this...?
The only words you need to use are the ones described in the AIP. Anything else is unnecessary.
Saying "xxxxx this time" is a complete oxymoron, as all around you already know that is what you are doing without the additional words.
Lastly, it certainly doesn't help Situational Awareness when you are in airspace used by others for whom English is not their first language. Many foreign pilots only have specific english for aviation (particularly Russians), and if you start using non-standard phraseology, you confuse the crap out of them.
Are we really discussing this...?
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As oposed to pilots (usually private pilots -Joe Lighty- and usually kiwis) who announce they are "over the top" of some town/lake/spot-height/whatever when they make a position report.
OTT is where the diggers used to go in WWI, but is not mentioned in the AIP....
Let it stop now.
OTT is where the diggers used to go in WWI, but is not mentioned in the AIP....
Let it stop now.
another one
"XXX rolls this time for XXX" ******
most departure calls require an estimate for the first reporting point???
this time + 27 mins = ???
definelty lazy and oh so coooool
"XXX rolls this time for XXX" ******
most departure calls require an estimate for the first reporting point???
this time + 27 mins = ???
definelty lazy and oh so coooool
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Yeah.
Most days listening out on 126.7 one can hear some clown in some hot $hit aircraft give some four (4) point position call when inbound.
None of which mean anything to any VFR pilot.
Inclined to call back "yes, but where are you?"
Most days listening out on 126.7 one can hear some clown in some hot $hit aircraft give some four (4) point position call when inbound.
None of which mean anything to any VFR pilot.
Inclined to call back "yes, but where are you?"
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Glad it's not just me that gets driven to distraction by the "this time" gnomes.
My pet hate on Perth Radar "All stations in the lane, XXX overhead Fremantle Golf Course AT THIS TIME tracking north in the lane...."
1. It is a radar frequency, get a traffic advisory then we can all hear you and you'll know where the traffic is!
2. There is no lane, it's just pottering along under a control step, the legend on the VTC is "VFR Route", as I understand it a "lane" has CTR each side of it, not the case here.
3. Feel like telling them to learn how to use R/T AT THIS TIME!
Who is teaching them this cr@p? Who gave these people R/T licences??
My pet hate on Perth Radar "All stations in the lane, XXX overhead Fremantle Golf Course AT THIS TIME tracking north in the lane...."
1. It is a radar frequency, get a traffic advisory then we can all hear you and you'll know where the traffic is!
2. There is no lane, it's just pottering along under a control step, the legend on the VTC is "VFR Route", as I understand it a "lane" has CTR each side of it, not the case here.
3. Feel like telling them to learn how to use R/T AT THIS TIME!
Who is teaching them this cr@p? Who gave these people R/T licences??
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ABC Position????
Why are there so many people just giving position reports with out saying Position, and waiting for atc to tell them to go ahead.
It really annoys me when atc are busy and miss it because they didn't know it was coming so get them to do it again. which just jams up the freq for longer and its usually when your trying to get a call out yourself.
The worst offenders appear to be QF, its sad when air china, paradise, and a host of others all sound more profesional than our national carrier
keep smiling
Why are there so many people just giving position reports with out saying Position, and waiting for atc to tell them to go ahead.
It really annoys me when atc are busy and miss it because they didn't know it was coming so get them to do it again. which just jams up the freq for longer and its usually when your trying to get a call out yourself.
The worst offenders appear to be QF, its sad when air china, paradise, and a host of others all sound more profesional than our national carrier
keep smiling
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No .. the most useless phrase used is when some pilots get airborne and wish to start their SAR prior to the dep call...
".... airborne place, standby for departure"
Just what else is ATS going to do? Go and have a cup of tea... they are of course always standing by.
Just "....airborne place" is all that is needed. None of which is in AIP anyway.... just one of those calls that has been passed on over time.
Duke... you are showing your age. The practice you refer to is called "offering" in which you give ATS time to pick up their pen or mouse. Pre TAAATS it was the done thing to just go straight ahead, except perhaps on HF if comms were not that good. Most good ATC and FS (boohoo) officers would always get it first time. Far less chat than now with the offering now written into the AIP as a result of TAAATS. Operator we were told needed time to get your electronic stip on the screen so as to process the info there directly. Also told that it would be only in place during TAAATS intro so training would be easier, but like other things as stuck.
Much the same as the provision of first ETA with departure call. Can you think of a worse time to put your head down and work out the first ETA. Call was needed to verify TAAATS info. Should have been at top of climb where there is a call anyway.....
".... airborne place, standby for departure"
Just what else is ATS going to do? Go and have a cup of tea... they are of course always standing by.
Just "....airborne place" is all that is needed. None of which is in AIP anyway.... just one of those calls that has been passed on over time.
Duke... you are showing your age. The practice you refer to is called "offering" in which you give ATS time to pick up their pen or mouse. Pre TAAATS it was the done thing to just go straight ahead, except perhaps on HF if comms were not that good. Most good ATC and FS (boohoo) officers would always get it first time. Far less chat than now with the offering now written into the AIP as a result of TAAATS. Operator we were told needed time to get your electronic stip on the screen so as to process the info there directly. Also told that it would be only in place during TAAATS intro so training would be easier, but like other things as stuck.
Much the same as the provision of first ETA with departure call. Can you think of a worse time to put your head down and work out the first ETA. Call was needed to verify TAAATS info. Should have been at top of climb where there is a call anyway.....