Skydiving resumes at Barwon Heads?
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To rs480
The way CASA is going Dancing Boy could be dancing the highland fling.
It is now 23 days since the show cause notice date and all you lot at Barwon Heads should be concerned
Is CASA going to turn over and let the dancing continue?
Must have been some reply probably full of the usual bull***t that is know to come from the boy and partner
I believe he is putting on a display at the air rally.
Not sure if parachuting or dancing
The way CASA is going Dancing Boy could be dancing the highland fling.
It is now 23 days since the show cause notice date and all you lot at Barwon Heads should be concerned
Is CASA going to turn over and let the dancing continue?
Must have been some reply probably full of the usual bull***t that is know to come from the boy and partner
I believe he is putting on a display at the air rally.
Not sure if parachuting or dancing
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Hi John Walters
Dancing boy did a silly thing in my opinion, he had jumpers onto the field with the Air Rally Sunday at approx. 11:30 hrs. and heard a lot of pilots questioning the wisdom of this with 3 aircraft in the circuit, one person has stated he is 225 ing as this is not on (visitor to area) maybe he has had problems elsewhere but he was a bit upset!!!!
Dancing boy did a silly thing in my opinion, he had jumpers onto the field with the Air Rally Sunday at approx. 11:30 hrs. and heard a lot of pilots questioning the wisdom of this with 3 aircraft in the circuit, one person has stated he is 225 ing as this is not on (visitor to area) maybe he has had problems elsewhere but he was a bit upset!!!!
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Rocket Rob you are right. Have heard plenty of this para operation and decided to have a good look for myself at the weekend.
Looked around Saturday from mid morning with arrivals of trikes ultralights and GA. was great to see.
Then Sunday morning attended again to watch aircraft take off. couldnt believe my eyes when seeing so many aircraft in the air and tandem parachutists landing inside the circuit, and within 100m of aircraft taking off
This clown has no respect for public safety, aircraft safety and safety of his staff. He had two jump planes Sunday.
What is wrong with CASA? Why no decision yet on the show cause? It appears CASA has got themselves in a right old mess and may cost millions to get out.
Believe owner does not want parachuting on the airfield. So why no decision.
I have read the rules, but then some of these parachutists either cant read or just ignor them
Dancing bay appears to have his own set.
after the weekend CASA must act and do what they threatened to do, kick the law breakers out.
Looked around Saturday from mid morning with arrivals of trikes ultralights and GA. was great to see.
Then Sunday morning attended again to watch aircraft take off. couldnt believe my eyes when seeing so many aircraft in the air and tandem parachutists landing inside the circuit, and within 100m of aircraft taking off
This clown has no respect for public safety, aircraft safety and safety of his staff. He had two jump planes Sunday.
What is wrong with CASA? Why no decision yet on the show cause? It appears CASA has got themselves in a right old mess and may cost millions to get out.
Believe owner does not want parachuting on the airfield. So why no decision.
I have read the rules, but then some of these parachutists either cant read or just ignor them
Dancing bay appears to have his own set.
after the weekend CASA must act and do what they threatened to do, kick the law breakers out.
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Hi John
It sounds like you know a little bit more than you let on.
But think about this logically for a second. Drop about to commence and other aircraft in the area notified 2 minutes before they leave the aircraft, thence again on dropping. 1 minute in air, then under parachute for another few minutes before conflicting with circuit height. Thats about 5 minutes warning roughly (normally) agreed?
Question.
Isnt that enough prior notice for a taxiing or lined up aircraft to either take off and get out of there OR (as common sense would suggest) to establish there will be a conflict and wait on the ground? Theres no big fuel burners down there to worry about idle time. And on landing enough preparation to push out slightly on base or downwind to provide separation. Or are the private operators angry and unwilling? There are 2 sides always.
As you did say you have read the rules, so dont departing aircraft have to give way to arriving aircraft (as much as we dont like it, thats what we have to interpret them to be!).
And to top it off, dont powered aircraft have to give way to unpowered?
The key to this whole situation is that the courts and CASA still will not decide on anything down there so I think a few people will have to swallow their pride and get along with each other and work together to make it work.
And yes it can work with them all there, it has at just about every other aerodrome in the country with a drop zone. Barwon Heads is definately no different! Just the characters are.
Time this was finally put to bed id say? Its had its time in the sun!
Keep your cool guys and have fun. Thats what its all about.
C.A.
It sounds like you know a little bit more than you let on.
But think about this logically for a second. Drop about to commence and other aircraft in the area notified 2 minutes before they leave the aircraft, thence again on dropping. 1 minute in air, then under parachute for another few minutes before conflicting with circuit height. Thats about 5 minutes warning roughly (normally) agreed?
Question.
Isnt that enough prior notice for a taxiing or lined up aircraft to either take off and get out of there OR (as common sense would suggest) to establish there will be a conflict and wait on the ground? Theres no big fuel burners down there to worry about idle time. And on landing enough preparation to push out slightly on base or downwind to provide separation. Or are the private operators angry and unwilling? There are 2 sides always.
As you did say you have read the rules, so dont departing aircraft have to give way to arriving aircraft (as much as we dont like it, thats what we have to interpret them to be!).
And to top it off, dont powered aircraft have to give way to unpowered?
The key to this whole situation is that the courts and CASA still will not decide on anything down there so I think a few people will have to swallow their pride and get along with each other and work together to make it work.
And yes it can work with them all there, it has at just about every other aerodrome in the country with a drop zone. Barwon Heads is definately no different! Just the characters are.
Time this was finally put to bed id say? Its had its time in the sun!
Keep your cool guys and have fun. Thats what its all about.
C.A.
Yes,C.A. a sweet reasonable point, and that is how it should be. However I think the point is that Saturday and Sunday BH was hosting the Great Australian Air Rally.
It was well known that there were going to be a lot of aircraft about.
Sweet reason suggests that perhaps Mr. Mc Williams (if that is the person who is being alluded to) should have contacted the organisers of the Rally and perhaps arranged a few half hour windows for his activities or made some other arrangement.
I would like to understand more about all this. It sounds as if certain people were rather upset.
It was well known that there were going to be a lot of aircraft about.
Sweet reason suggests that perhaps Mr. Mc Williams (if that is the person who is being alluded to) should have contacted the organisers of the Rally and perhaps arranged a few half hour windows for his activities or made some other arrangement.
I would like to understand more about all this. It sounds as if certain people were rather upset.
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C.A.
You are missing the point!! this miscreant has caused so much trouble and anguish that the OWNER of this AIRFIELD (not licenced but an ALA) does not want him around jumping into this airfield at ALL . Must be hard to get into people's heads that owners have rights too and also I believe the hangar he is in is also under dispute,he does not want him in IT as WELL, gee this sure is simple he has caused so much trouble NO ONE WANTS THE DANCING BOY. Your lovely get together and be friends has been tried to death, but he just does not want to be doing it by the RULES (he has his own opinion and CASA can get St****d, why bother with RULES if you seem to be getting away with it) makes you think hard about CASA as they would jump (bad pun) on anybody else with big fines and threats of all kinds but in this instance it seems a bit strange about the goings on???
What about the cloud penetrations, the climb to oxygen required levels, the need for seat belts, and just pop down and watch a taxi when the tail is almost dragging on the ground (would love a look at the weight and balance sheet)
I suppose the TV stations that have copies of film of drops through cloud and other violations are wrong too!!! best you get of the high horse you are on and take a real look at the situation down that way as it is not SAFE and do you expect law abiding pilots to turn a blind eye??? DO NOT THINK SO!!!!
Thought I better point out that yes I know the 180 he was using as well on the last weekend is a tail dragger, so the tail will drag but the other is not supposed to!!
You are missing the point!! this miscreant has caused so much trouble and anguish that the OWNER of this AIRFIELD (not licenced but an ALA) does not want him around jumping into this airfield at ALL . Must be hard to get into people's heads that owners have rights too and also I believe the hangar he is in is also under dispute,he does not want him in IT as WELL, gee this sure is simple he has caused so much trouble NO ONE WANTS THE DANCING BOY. Your lovely get together and be friends has been tried to death, but he just does not want to be doing it by the RULES (he has his own opinion and CASA can get St****d, why bother with RULES if you seem to be getting away with it) makes you think hard about CASA as they would jump (bad pun) on anybody else with big fines and threats of all kinds but in this instance it seems a bit strange about the goings on???
What about the cloud penetrations, the climb to oxygen required levels, the need for seat belts, and just pop down and watch a taxi when the tail is almost dragging on the ground (would love a look at the weight and balance sheet)
I suppose the TV stations that have copies of film of drops through cloud and other violations are wrong too!!! best you get of the high horse you are on and take a real look at the situation down that way as it is not SAFE and do you expect law abiding pilots to turn a blind eye??? DO NOT THINK SO!!!!
Thought I better point out that yes I know the 180 he was using as well on the last weekend is a tail dragger, so the tail will drag but the other is not supposed to!!
Last edited by Lukeatme; 4th Mar 2005 at 00:33.
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Have a beer and relax Luke
Luke,
No need to get so defensive over my reply to John. Or do you too have more than one identity here? I dont believe I am missing the point or getting on a horse.
Your very first 2 lines display an underlying issue which I would probably say from your previous posts, stems the problem. The operator is not liked! Fine, dont deal with him. The person/s you speak to on the radio will not be him but a pilot who is trying to organise some kind of separation as best they can. Can you not speak to them and organise some kind of system amongst yourselves?
After all even the busiest skydiving operations in the country have their jumpers conflicting with circuit traffic for about 2 minutes every load. In general that is about every 30 minutes but if they are using a 206 or (as you mention) 182 that will be about every 45 minutes. (Ok, so less if 2 aircraft but does that happen a lot?) So at max. 4 minutes every hour you have to contend with separation and maybe hold. Thats not even an hour every day! Come on, let these people enjoy their aviation too.
I think thats the point that is being forgotten here. These tandem passengers, students and skydivers want to enjoy themselves. Their way of doing it is slightly different than ours but its still a form of aviation! Just because we dont do it personally doesnt mean it does not count!
Yes the owner is daft and you dont like him. But do you want to stop other people enjoying themselves in aviation and deny them the same rights of pleasure that we have. Surely you cant be on that type of high horse thinking that your form of enjoyment and aviation is far superior than others.
Can you see how this looks in an international aviation forum when the issues seem to be clearly personal, local and political. The problems seem to be the operator, not the plane or the pilot which makes it something that needs to be dealt locally. Keep it local, as Im sure that Barwon Heads as a place and an airport has suffered by these complaints.
How many people (please post in) would not go to this airport or area now since these topics were risen? It has been said by many already? Is that hurting the local economy or even your air rally?
In reference to your vindictive first paragraph, I am unsure about hangar and aerodrome access but with all the actions in the courts down there he obviously has some legal right to be there. People should stop signing the contracts! I assume thats what links him to these places. Maybe the almighty dollar keeps this thing going behind your back. Maybe people arent what the seem.
Sunfish, thankyou. My sweetness is only generally trying to offer ideas out of this conflict for you all. And I definately agree about prior notice but didnt John say something about this on Feb 21. Obviously someone knew something?
Fun remember. We should all be enjoying ourselves, not getting bitter and twisted.
C.A.
Law abiding pilots. Come on Im sure weve all got some cool story we tell over beer of days when we didnt follow all the laws. Please dont try and convince me we are all angels!
No need to get so defensive over my reply to John. Or do you too have more than one identity here? I dont believe I am missing the point or getting on a horse.
Your very first 2 lines display an underlying issue which I would probably say from your previous posts, stems the problem. The operator is not liked! Fine, dont deal with him. The person/s you speak to on the radio will not be him but a pilot who is trying to organise some kind of separation as best they can. Can you not speak to them and organise some kind of system amongst yourselves?
After all even the busiest skydiving operations in the country have their jumpers conflicting with circuit traffic for about 2 minutes every load. In general that is about every 30 minutes but if they are using a 206 or (as you mention) 182 that will be about every 45 minutes. (Ok, so less if 2 aircraft but does that happen a lot?) So at max. 4 minutes every hour you have to contend with separation and maybe hold. Thats not even an hour every day! Come on, let these people enjoy their aviation too.
I think thats the point that is being forgotten here. These tandem passengers, students and skydivers want to enjoy themselves. Their way of doing it is slightly different than ours but its still a form of aviation! Just because we dont do it personally doesnt mean it does not count!
Yes the owner is daft and you dont like him. But do you want to stop other people enjoying themselves in aviation and deny them the same rights of pleasure that we have. Surely you cant be on that type of high horse thinking that your form of enjoyment and aviation is far superior than others.
Can you see how this looks in an international aviation forum when the issues seem to be clearly personal, local and political. The problems seem to be the operator, not the plane or the pilot which makes it something that needs to be dealt locally. Keep it local, as Im sure that Barwon Heads as a place and an airport has suffered by these complaints.
How many people (please post in) would not go to this airport or area now since these topics were risen? It has been said by many already? Is that hurting the local economy or even your air rally?
In reference to your vindictive first paragraph, I am unsure about hangar and aerodrome access but with all the actions in the courts down there he obviously has some legal right to be there. People should stop signing the contracts! I assume thats what links him to these places. Maybe the almighty dollar keeps this thing going behind your back. Maybe people arent what the seem.
Sunfish, thankyou. My sweetness is only generally trying to offer ideas out of this conflict for you all. And I definately agree about prior notice but didnt John say something about this on Feb 21. Obviously someone knew something?
Fun remember. We should all be enjoying ourselves, not getting bitter and twisted.
C.A.
Law abiding pilots. Come on Im sure weve all got some cool story we tell over beer of days when we didnt follow all the laws. Please dont try and convince me we are all angels!
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Interesting points, C.A. The only reason he is there at all is because in the first instance, the owner decided that the skydive operators "pieces of silver" were what mattered. As has been pointed out before, they were warned about his style of operation. And not just from one source, either. His track record at his previous airport should have alerted the airport owner at BH, if nothing else. But the idea of getting a leg up over the "other airport" just proved tooooo damn tempting, didn't it. Reap as ye sow, as they say.....
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Gday
I have spoken to several pilots attending the rally and they said that they together with their mates have submitted incident reports to CASA re the dropping while conflicting traffic in the circuit on Sunday morning these are not local people so the powers to be should take notice as they are not as bias as some. They were dropping through low cloud the previous weekend coz I saw them.
Cheers Q
I have spoken to several pilots attending the rally and they said that they together with their mates have submitted incident reports to CASA re the dropping while conflicting traffic in the circuit on Sunday morning these are not local people so the powers to be should take notice as they are not as bias as some. They were dropping through low cloud the previous weekend coz I saw them.
Cheers Q
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"not as bias as some" - they would be you wouldn't it QNIM?
Dropping through low cloud, umm - does that mean jumpers were jumping from 1,000ft or something?
Or were they jumping from 14,000ft., opening at 4,000ft., as would be the case and there was broken/scattered below them under canopy. Sorry to rain on ya parade, but perfectly legal.
Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
Dropping through low cloud, umm - does that mean jumpers were jumping from 1,000ft or something?
Or were they jumping from 14,000ft., opening at 4,000ft., as would be the case and there was broken/scattered below them under canopy. Sorry to rain on ya parade, but perfectly legal.
Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.
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I'm just writing here for a bit of fun!
I have skydived both in Australia and the US. In the states I was jumping at a large GA airport with 4 intersecting runways, at least 2 of which were active on most ocassions. I must admit it was nerve racking to start with but the skydiving operator and airfield operators work together and it is a very well oiled chain.
Skydiving is a very progressive sport and one that is going to be around for a hell of a long time so get used to it. I reckon that half of you guys talk it down so much simply because you are scared of it.
After looking on this forum I was surprised at just how much rubbish there is on this particular subject. Don't you dereks have anything better to do with your life? I mean one guy mentioned that he went out there on the weekend to check it all out, one would think he works for CASA or something, get a life!
I honestly hope that this operator wins in court and sticks it right up the lot of ya! Blue skies mate!
Oh yeah and if jumping through cloud is dangerous then so is flying through it in your flying spam cans!
Ha ha ha this is funny, I can't wait to see what people say.
I have skydived both in Australia and the US. In the states I was jumping at a large GA airport with 4 intersecting runways, at least 2 of which were active on most ocassions. I must admit it was nerve racking to start with but the skydiving operator and airfield operators work together and it is a very well oiled chain.
Skydiving is a very progressive sport and one that is going to be around for a hell of a long time so get used to it. I reckon that half of you guys talk it down so much simply because you are scared of it.
After looking on this forum I was surprised at just how much rubbish there is on this particular subject. Don't you dereks have anything better to do with your life? I mean one guy mentioned that he went out there on the weekend to check it all out, one would think he works for CASA or something, get a life!
I honestly hope that this operator wins in court and sticks it right up the lot of ya! Blue skies mate!
Oh yeah and if jumping through cloud is dangerous then so is flying through it in your flying spam cans!
Ha ha ha this is funny, I can't wait to see what people say.
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Errr My Sunfish learn how to read before writing mate! I didn't make any reference to VFR or IFR pilots, all I said is that if it is safe to fly a plane through cloud then it is just as safe to fly your body and a parachute. I think we all know that the V in VFR means visual.
This statement was made by Rocket Rob in the Great Air Rally thread and in my opinion sums it all up....
"But the folks that did attend seemed to have a good time!! I think you will find that if you can count we call anything that flies an aircraft so you can add about 15 trikes and other home made variants to your list"
Ha ha you better add parachutes to this as well!!!!!!
Talk about a conflicting statement.
This statement was made by Rocket Rob in the Great Air Rally thread and in my opinion sums it all up....
"But the folks that did attend seemed to have a good time!! I think you will find that if you can count we call anything that flies an aircraft so you can add about 15 trikes and other home made variants to your list"
Ha ha you better add parachutes to this as well!!!!!!
Talk about a conflicting statement.
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Jumpnut
This has been going on for a year and a half. A post is put up (always by the same person) and then the usual suspects post at least once a week for a couple of months until it dies. A month or so later, another one appears and it all starts again.
It really is quite sad to see how small some peoples lives are.
Pathetic!
This has been going on for a year and a half. A post is put up (always by the same person) and then the usual suspects post at least once a week for a couple of months until it dies. A month or so later, another one appears and it all starts again.
It really is quite sad to see how small some peoples lives are.
Pathetic!
I think I am going to throw up, preferably all over you, jumpnut.
If your attitude to regulation is typical, then I hope you only kill yourself when you eventually bend the rules once too often.
As for me, the Barwon Heads CTAF is off limits until such time is it can be demonstrated that its likely occupants, with or without aircraft attached, are obeying the rules.
If your attitude to regulation is typical, then I hope you only kill yourself when you eventually bend the rules once too often.
As for me, the Barwon Heads CTAF is off limits until such time is it can be demonstrated that its likely occupants, with or without aircraft attached, are obeying the rules.