ANSETT....what made it a GREAT airline?
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ANSETT....what made it a GREAT airline?
Bound to be a winner - this thread has been a long time coming, and I`m sure there are plenty who`d be interested in adding their tuppence worth.
During my time there - from 1978 until 1989 - we Ansett staff all perceived, imo, that we were different to our main competitor (TAA) - there was a LOVE of the company, that meant each of us actually enjoyed going to work, and didn`t mind giving extra when it was called for, and even when it wasn`t.
Until the Fat Man started fiddling (by placing no talent, "Yes men" in the top positions), I don`t believe that any of us (AN staff) had the dislike of management that seemd to prevail in TAA.
It was the PEOPLE, all working together, that I would say made the old Ansett a GREAT airline!!
Edit: Rather than tacking on a post somewhere below this one, I believe that ALL ex-Ansett staff would have to agree that without the foresight and and hard work of the founder himself, and those whom HE subsequently appointed, Ansett - the airline - could never have achieved the "cult status" amongst its staff, that it did.
So, to state the obvious:-
................SIR REGINALD ANSETT
During my time there - from 1978 until 1989 - we Ansett staff all perceived, imo, that we were different to our main competitor (TAA) - there was a LOVE of the company, that meant each of us actually enjoyed going to work, and didn`t mind giving extra when it was called for, and even when it wasn`t.
Until the Fat Man started fiddling (by placing no talent, "Yes men" in the top positions), I don`t believe that any of us (AN staff) had the dislike of management that seemd to prevail in TAA.
It was the PEOPLE, all working together, that I would say made the old Ansett a GREAT airline!!
Edit: Rather than tacking on a post somewhere below this one, I believe that ALL ex-Ansett staff would have to agree that without the foresight and and hard work of the founder himself, and those whom HE subsequently appointed, Ansett - the airline - could never have achieved the "cult status" amongst its staff, that it did.
So, to state the obvious:-
................
SIR REGINALD ANSETT
Last edited by Kaptin M; 8th Sep 2004 at 04:39.
It was a great airline. I enjoyed working there and I still talk to one or two of the people I met.
The thing that I remember was the depth of talent and experience - from 16 year old kids to greybeards who had messed with DC3's and flying boats.
Anyone remember Ray Wensor, Doug Kelynack, Ron Bush, John Bibo, Ron Jackson, Kieth Ball, John Muir or Ken Bond?
Sad to leave, but thank god I did.
The thing that I remember was the depth of talent and experience - from 16 year old kids to greybeards who had messed with DC3's and flying boats.
Anyone remember Ray Wensor, Doug Kelynack, Ron Bush, John Bibo, Ron Jackson, Kieth Ball, John Muir or Ken Bond?
Sad to leave, but thank god I did.
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I agree,Ansett was a great airline and I was proud to work there.R.M.A was a great boss (as well as an Electra)
I flew with Ray Wensor on Viscounts and remember Kieth Ball and Ron Bush.Capt.Longbottom was one of my favourites.
The old Ansett had CLASS
I flew with Ray Wensor on Viscounts and remember Kieth Ball and Ron Bush.Capt.Longbottom was one of my favourites.
The old Ansett had CLASS
Evertonian
I was there before & after 89 Kaptin and, (I hope this doesn't degenerate into the usual 89 posts!) I would have to say that the spirit you knew up to '89 continued beyond that year, however, AN was gutted by the events that transpired and that spirit eventually did die. You could say that it lingered for some time in the long term staff who actually kept her going all those years, even when she was rudderless, the staff kept her alive, but it just goes to prove that good, respected leadership plays a vital role in business.
Ansett had a good name in & out of the industry. I never had an issue, say, applying for a loan. When you told them you were at Ansett & had been there for X years, there was always an immediate approval. Ansett was known, liked and an icon. There are lots of people happy to have seen the back of Ansett, for various reasons, but rest assured, we will never see her like again.
Ansett had a good name in & out of the industry. I never had an issue, say, applying for a loan. When you told them you were at Ansett & had been there for X years, there was always an immediate approval. Ansett was known, liked and an icon. There are lots of people happy to have seen the back of Ansett, for various reasons, but rest assured, we will never see her like again.
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Ansett pre-89 WAS a great airline, with many pilots I rank in the "Gods" book.
Having said that, nothing wrong with TAA
OK, I am biased!
Abeles not only ruined Ansett, he ruined the aviation industry in Australia foreever. Thank God he is no longer around.
Having said that, nothing wrong with TAA
OK, I am biased!
Abeles not only ruined Ansett, he ruined the aviation industry in Australia foreever. Thank God he is no longer around.
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Hello,
I dont mean to hijack this thread, but could someone explain me what happened in 1989
Let's just say at that time i wasnt as old as i am now 
( History Lesson )
Many Thanks
I dont mean to hijack this thread, but could someone explain me what happened in 1989
Let's just say at that time i wasnt as old as i am now ( History Lesson )Many Thanks
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Anyone remember Ray Wensor, Doug Kelynack, Ron Bush, John Bibo, Ron Jackson, Kieth Ball, John Muir or Ken Bond?
could someone explain me what happened in 1989
Let's just say at that time i wasnt as old as i am now
What made Ansett great:
1. The "30 years old or married and you're OUT" rule.
No un-singles, fatties, psychos, nutcases, bunny-boilers or even regular boilers. The girls' careers didn't last long enough for them to go all sour and bitter.
2. The hosties shirts.
They reckon there was one designed by some pervert in hosty recruiting with the top button somewhere down near their belly-button (or nipples on some of the boiler varieties.....
)
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AIRWAY,
I'll try to be polite.
Your profile says you reqistered in July 2003, you have 638 posts (hmmmmmm), and that you are an ATPL (Student). Now, the first two would be correct for your current persona, the third we have to take your word for.
Given the above, you have been either unbelievably un-observant over the past year, in which case please take Capt Claret's advice and study carefully the history of the industry you are about to enter, or you are a troll.
Now back to the thread.......................
Snooze
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!
I'll try to be polite.
Your profile says you reqistered in July 2003, you have 638 posts (hmmmmmm), and that you are an ATPL (Student). Now, the first two would be correct for your current persona, the third we have to take your word for.
Given the above, you have been either unbelievably un-observant over the past year, in which case please take Capt Claret's advice and study carefully the history of the industry you are about to enter, or you are a troll.
Now back to the thread.......................
Snooze
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!
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Well,
Im glad you are polite because there is no need to be rude
I asked a simple question ( always been told if in doubt, ask! ), i have to say i should have done a search first that to ask here.
By the way dont think that student pilots wherever they might be in the world knows what happened in 1989.
AIRWAY
Now im going for a ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Airways
Please do us all a favour and don't press the issue - it's rather a taboo subject on this forum. As suggested, do a search on "89" and you'll find all the answers.
Ah, air-slag, your usual quality and informative posts I see....
In your case, Sir Reg's comment about old boilers would be a compliment! 
Woomera
Im glad you are polite because there is no need to be rude
I asked a simple question ( always been told if in doubt, ask! ), i have to say i should have done a search first that to ask here.
By the way dont think that student pilots wherever they might be in the world knows what happened in 1989.
AIRWAY
Now im going for a ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Airways
Please do us all a favour and don't press the issue - it's rather a taboo subject on this forum. As suggested, do a search on "89" and you'll find all the answers.
Ah, air-slag, your usual quality and informative posts I see....
In your case, Sir Reg's comment about old boilers would be a compliment! Woomera
Last edited by Woomera; 7th Sep 2004 at 00:31.
Sixdemonbag 
Only now as an old fart my braincell levels have reduced so I can learn to fly
I think I just realised (at about 5.00am this morning) why AN ended up with such a mixed and hence costly fleet - Abeles only knew about trucks and he thought that aircraft were jusat expensive trucks.
Having worked with some logistics companies I know how they buy their trucks - they go out to tender and they find which of Kenworth, Mack, Mercedes, Iveco etc. are desperate for a big sale.
I suspect that this is what Abeles did. I have only one bit of hard evidence for this. Back in 1980 (or 81?) Sunfish put together the maintenance budget for AN and its brand new 737/727/767? fleet. The number came out at about $110 million.
As usual, after the normal vetting, this was dutifully submitted up the line until it got to Peter A. Sir Peter's response in his deep Hungarian accent, as reported to me, was "You mean I buy all these brand new airplanes and you want THIS much money? What gives? they are still under warranty?"
The next thing Sunfish knows he is frogmarched into Graeme McM's office and given the third degree about his calculations and assumptions. Fortunately for me, these stood up, and I was able to provide the background information to support my position.
What I suddenly realised today was that Abeles question made sense if he was thinking of aircraft just as expensive trucks, which as we all know, they aren't.
Only now as an old fart my braincell levels have reduced so I can learn to flyI think I just realised (at about 5.00am this morning) why AN ended up with such a mixed and hence costly fleet - Abeles only knew about trucks and he thought that aircraft were jusat expensive trucks.
Having worked with some logistics companies I know how they buy their trucks - they go out to tender and they find which of Kenworth, Mack, Mercedes, Iveco etc. are desperate for a big sale.
I suspect that this is what Abeles did. I have only one bit of hard evidence for this. Back in 1980 (or 81?) Sunfish put together the maintenance budget for AN and its brand new 737/727/767? fleet. The number came out at about $110 million.
As usual, after the normal vetting, this was dutifully submitted up the line until it got to Peter A. Sir Peter's response in his deep Hungarian accent, as reported to me, was "You mean I buy all these brand new airplanes and you want THIS much money? What gives? they are still under warranty?"
The next thing Sunfish knows he is frogmarched into Graeme McM's office and given the third degree about his calculations and assumptions. Fortunately for me, these stood up, and I was able to provide the background information to support my position.
What I suddenly realised today was that Abeles question made sense if he was thinking of aircraft just as expensive trucks, which as we all know, they aren't.
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I've worked for Qantas and beside the Ansett engineers sharing a hangar space.
Ansett engineers were about 4 times more productive and although I dont have any figures, Ansett guys achieved more work with far less resources on what was really quite a large and varied fleet.
The fleet was getting old and was too varied, Bae 146 operation was laughable as both engineers and flight crew disliked this machine. It wasnt that long ago 727, F50 and F28 were still operating.
Must of been a nightmare with this many types.
OZTECH
Ansett engineers were about 4 times more productive and although I dont have any figures, Ansett guys achieved more work with far less resources on what was really quite a large and varied fleet.
The fleet was getting old and was too varied, Bae 146 operation was laughable as both engineers and flight crew disliked this machine. It wasnt that long ago 727, F50 and F28 were still operating.
Must of been a nightmare with this many types.
OZTECH
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Ok Woomera...
no worries... Someone with intellectual capacity has explained me what hapened via a PM, i can imagine now how some people feel, specially with the response i got earlier on. Anyway time to hit the skies lesson to attend...
This issue for me is now closed and sorry for asking...
G'day
no worries... Someone with intellectual capacity has explained me what hapened via a PM, i can imagine now how some people feel, specially with the response i got earlier on. Anyway time to hit the skies lesson to attend...
This issue for me is now closed and sorry for asking...
G'day
Last edited by AIRWAY; 7th Sep 2004 at 06:36.
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Airway as Capt. Snooze alluded to you are a "pratt" you are now telling us:
So now you are telling us you believe ONE persons educated opinion ! 
There would 1000 opinions on this forum as to the cause and effect of "The '89 dispute"
If you want most of the story there is a book on the subject which covers it pretty well --- The Title which escapes me however I'm sure the many learned people here in this forum would provide you with the Title.
By the way I am an acquantance of Capt. Snooze and your denigration of him was unwarranted.
Someone with interlectual capacity has now explained to me what happened via a PM
There would 1000 opinions on this forum as to the cause and effect of "The '89 dispute"
If you want most of the story there is a book on the subject which covers it pretty well --- The Title which escapes me however I'm sure the many learned people here in this forum would provide you with the Title.
By the way I am an acquantance of Capt. Snooze and your denigration of him was unwarranted.
Last edited by FarQ2; 7th Sep 2004 at 14:11.
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Thanks for the compliment, may i take this opportunity to extend it to you and your mate snooze, oops i mean Captain Snooze.
I didnt say i believed that person's opinion, i simply stated that i received an intellectual reply to my original question, but before that someone decided to blow all this out of proportion, was my question stupid? Maybe it was for someone who knows the answer, but since i have lived all of my 22 years of life in Europe i think im qualified not to know the answer to my original question.
You're an acquantance Of Captain Snooze? Well good for you it's a very noble gesture
Thanks for the tip regarding the book
Im just trying to increase my knowledge regarding Australian aviation... And i dont think asking is a crime.
Sorry again Woomera.
AIRWAY
I didnt say i believed that person's opinion, i simply stated that i received an intellectual reply to my original question, but before that someone decided to blow all this out of proportion, was my question stupid? Maybe it was for someone who knows the answer, but since i have lived all of my 22 years of life in Europe i think im qualified not to know the answer to my original question.
You're an acquantance Of Captain Snooze? Well good for you it's a very noble gesture
Thanks for the tip regarding the book
Im just trying to increase my knowledge regarding Australian aviation... And i dont think asking is a crime.
Sorry again Woomera.
AIRWAY
Last edited by AIRWAY; 7th Sep 2004 at 21:49.