Archer or Tobago
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Archer or Tobago
Hi All
I'm looking at purchasing either an Archer or Tobago.
I'd appreciate it greatly if anyone who has any experience in owning either of them let me know how it's going?
At the moment I just can't decide between the 120kt/extra wide cabin/better looking/ higher running costs of the Tobago and the 110kt/bit more squishy/bit plain looking but cheaper to run Archer.
Thanks very muchly in advance!!
st777
I'm looking at purchasing either an Archer or Tobago.
I'd appreciate it greatly if anyone who has any experience in owning either of them let me know how it's going?
At the moment I just can't decide between the 120kt/extra wide cabin/better looking/ higher running costs of the Tobago and the 110kt/bit more squishy/bit plain looking but cheaper to run Archer.
Thanks very muchly in advance!!
st777
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Good question...
I've spent a reasonable time in both and they are in many ways very similar. I really don't know about owning them, all I can tell you is how they fly.
TB10 (Tobago)
Pros - relatively newer technology
- Sturdy and strong
- Quite common, so maintaining one would not be too much of a problem
- Faster than the Archer, but only slightly
Cons - made by the French
- Forward visibilty is quite poor due to the dash being very high, if you're under 6 feet tall you will probably need a cushion, but if you're over, you won't but there is not much spare headroom
- Gull wing doors look great but are quite impractical, there is a lot of perspex there so in the sun, the cabin heats up quickly and a door may need to be left ajar. If you add power when taxiing with the door ajar, the prop wash can take the door off the hinges, costing you money.
- Again with the doors, they have had problems with the locking mechanism causing them to open in flight, this can become a nightmare
- Glides about as well as a brick
PA-28 (Archer)
Pros - Strong and sturdy also
- Built by Piper
- Probably better resale value, if a similar age to the Tobago
- Very reliable
- Better payload and endurance
Cons - A little slower
- Cockpit a bit more cramped
I think that the Archer will probably cost you less all around, ie to buy and to keep.
A very close call but I reckon the Archer wins it by a nose.
Good Luck
Hydro
I've spent a reasonable time in both and they are in many ways very similar. I really don't know about owning them, all I can tell you is how they fly.
TB10 (Tobago)
Pros - relatively newer technology
- Sturdy and strong
- Quite common, so maintaining one would not be too much of a problem
- Faster than the Archer, but only slightly
Cons - made by the French
- Forward visibilty is quite poor due to the dash being very high, if you're under 6 feet tall you will probably need a cushion, but if you're over, you won't but there is not much spare headroom
- Gull wing doors look great but are quite impractical, there is a lot of perspex there so in the sun, the cabin heats up quickly and a door may need to be left ajar. If you add power when taxiing with the door ajar, the prop wash can take the door off the hinges, costing you money.
- Again with the doors, they have had problems with the locking mechanism causing them to open in flight, this can become a nightmare
- Glides about as well as a brick
PA-28 (Archer)
Pros - Strong and sturdy also
- Built by Piper
- Probably better resale value, if a similar age to the Tobago
- Very reliable
- Better payload and endurance
Cons - A little slower
- Cockpit a bit more cramped
I think that the Archer will probably cost you less all around, ie to buy and to keep.
A very close call but I reckon the Archer wins it by a nose.
Good Luck
Hydro
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Beware of the costs involved im maintaining a Tobago, for example get a quote from eads for a 6mm bolt with nylock nut and washer and then comapre it to an AN equivilant... I have worked on both and but only ever owned a PA28-180 and won't ever own a TB unless the prices for spares and the prices for airframes comes down. Most owners will say that their TB's are worth that much in the USA but will neglect to also tell you that most of the ones in Australia wont be allowed on the N register (unless they had been imported new into the states).
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Bellsux
All Australian Tobagos can go on the N Register. They just need to have a FAA required Rudder-Aileron interconnect mod which costs about $US2K to install. The US is the only place where this mod is required.
For what it's worth, I reckon a Socata Tobago is far superior to fly, operate and maintain compared to an Archer...
All Australian Tobagos can go on the N Register. They just need to have a FAA required Rudder-Aileron interconnect mod which costs about $US2K to install. The US is the only place where this mod is required.
For what it's worth, I reckon a Socata Tobago is far superior to fly, operate and maintain compared to an Archer...
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So are you saying that the Tobagos built in France and exported to Australia with French Type Certificates are allowed into the USA and onto the N register without a FAA one? I guess that you could apply for one if you complied with all the requirements of AC 21 2J but why would you want to waste your time with all that red tape when you could have got one with a Piper???
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Issues with the N Register or not; that doesn't have much relevance in owning one here in Oz. And re corrosion, as with purchasing any aircraft, get a detailed pre purchase inspection done to check for corrosion before buying it.
KLN
KLN
TB10 as sturdy as an Archer....... um..... nope 
The Archer doesn't require a 50 hrly engine mount inspection and the TB10 does.... specifically why a TB10 has a MLW limitation opposed to the PA28-180......
Land slightly heavier then normal at max weight (MTOW or MLW ... of course no-one lands above MLW in a TB10) and you in for an expensive repair bill.
The Type two model instrument guages will cost you somewhere near $4000 for the unit but are pretty much as unreliable as the Series one guages....
... oh yeah.. they drop out of the sky fairly quickly when the cooling fan stops aswell... whats the glide ration 1:6 or something....
The Archer doesn't require a 50 hrly engine mount inspection and the TB10 does.... specifically why a TB10 has a MLW limitation opposed to the PA28-180......
Land slightly heavier then normal at max weight (MTOW or MLW ... of course no-one lands above MLW in a TB10) and you in for an expensive repair bill.
The Type two model instrument guages will cost you somewhere near $4000 for the unit but are pretty much as unreliable as the Series one guages....
... oh yeah.. they drop out of the sky fairly quickly when the cooling fan stops aswell... whats the glide ration 1:6 or something....
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We had a TB-10 in our club a while back. It seemed more maintenance heavy than the Pipers, but I think some has to do with the way it was treated. Metric screws seem to upset some mechanics - the engine ofcourse is US std so they need both sets of tools ...
Never saw any real speed advantage to a good Archer but the cabin is rather nice and roomy. Handles well, except short-field takeoff performance worse than Archer.
Comfortable to ride in and the dual doors are a blessing I think. Personally I detest single-door GA - especially when I'm in the wrong seat !
If you want comfort go for the TB, if it doesn't matter go with the Archer.
Never saw any real speed advantage to a good Archer but the cabin is rather nice and roomy. Handles well, except short-field takeoff performance worse than Archer.
Comfortable to ride in and the dual doors are a blessing I think. Personally I detest single-door GA - especially when I'm in the wrong seat !
If you want comfort go for the TB, if it doesn't matter go with the Archer.
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TB aircaft also have the support of a fairly good users group web site. www.socata.org
