Too much TT???
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Too much TT???
Can you have too much s/e TT?
Anyone care to comment on circumstances where someone has had too much S/E TT and only small amount of M/E time.
Have been recently told be an employer that I had far too much TT and the multi ratio was far too low.
3500TT. 100multi
Suppose it is in the same basket as "comensurate with age" ???
Anyone care to comment on circumstances where someone has had too much S/E TT and only small amount of M/E time.
Have been recently told be an employer that I had far too much TT and the multi ratio was far too low.
3500TT. 100multi
Suppose it is in the same basket as "comensurate with age" ???
You can never have too many hours of any aircraft type (from an experience point of view).
What has been told to you is most likely the easiest way for a CP to cull you out of the list.
S/he will have hundreds of applicants, it's just a tool. Keep plugging away.
CS
What has been told to you is most likely the easiest way for a CP to cull you out of the list.
S/he will have hundreds of applicants, it's just a tool. Keep plugging away.
CS
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Depends on the job you're going for. Certainly in NZ at the mo you would find it hard to get into a third level airline, the fear is that you would move on as soon as you got 200 multi (which would be the case unless you were unlucky).
Having said that, i'm sure it's still a case of getting to know the perspective employer and/or being in the right place at the right time. I'm sure there are some (more responsible) employers who would value your experience. I'm not sure what it's like in your country, but I recon if you keep banging down the doors you'll eventually get somewhere. Good luck
Having said that, i'm sure it's still a case of getting to know the perspective employer and/or being in the right place at the right time. I'm sure there are some (more responsible) employers who would value your experience. I'm not sure what it's like in your country, but I recon if you keep banging down the doors you'll eventually get somewhere. Good luck
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Well CC, I know someone with the ratio round the other way..... isint that amaaaaazing! 
Stalin - You are not the only person to have found this out latley - A similar thread was running somewhere in D+G a few weeks ago.
Depending what your looking at moving too 10% of TT on a twin seems to be a realistic ratio over here.
Stalin - You are not the only person to have found this out latley - A similar thread was running somewhere in D+G a few weeks ago.
Depending what your looking at moving too 10% of TT on a twin seems to be a realistic ratio over here.
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Thanks for the responses.
Always the way "buggered if you do, buggered if you dont"
Seems to be going ahead in NZ at the moment.Funny because I had to leave NZ GA scene to get some hrs, now having got a few struggling just as badly. refer para 2.
But still got enough $ for beers at the end of the week so it cant be that bad!
Always the way "buggered if you do, buggered if you dont"
Seems to be going ahead in NZ at the moment.Funny because I had to leave NZ GA scene to get some hrs, now having got a few struggling just as badly. refer para 2.
But still got enough $ for beers at the end of the week so it cant be that bad!
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Total time is the biggest misconseption in aviation today,what's more the industry still uses it as a yardstick for asertaining experience levels.
Take for example someone from the RAAF that has had intensive training and had his horizon (IF) taken away in the first 3 hrs of training and had TT 800 and mostly on complex turbines with tricky systems,how could they possibly be compared to some twit who's been banging round in the circuit for 3500 hrs in a warrier.
Comparison is not even possible.
I reckon its about time that the industry started looking at experience rather than a number.
A bloke said to me the other day I wouldn't get in a A/C unless they had a least 1000 TT,So I flogged him with my Log book so he never forgets what one looks like.
Take for example someone from the RAAF that has had intensive training and had his horizon (IF) taken away in the first 3 hrs of training and had TT 800 and mostly on complex turbines with tricky systems,how could they possibly be compared to some twit who's been banging round in the circuit for 3500 hrs in a warrier.
Comparison is not even possible.
I reckon its about time that the industry started looking at experience rather than a number.
A bloke said to me the other day I wouldn't get in a A/C unless they had a least 1000 TT,So I flogged him with my Log book so he never forgets what one looks like.
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I agree with you to a certain extent, as I am sure alot of people will.
However I can assure you that none of my TT has been spent as a circuit hero, infact quite the opposite.
Before you go making to many assumptions you must also know that people with the experience you have described, I would consider to be some of the most at risk and dangerous pilots in the air. Because they have been taught to think exactly what you have said.
Maybe you might explain to me why insurance companys have set minimums for operators and their pilots, why korean airlines hired over 100 more experienced expat pilots to prevent them from being barred to the U.S by the FAA. Experience is proven and it works.
Pull your head in
However I can assure you that none of my TT has been spent as a circuit hero, infact quite the opposite.
Before you go making to many assumptions you must also know that people with the experience you have described, I would consider to be some of the most at risk and dangerous pilots in the air. Because they have been taught to think exactly what you have said.
Maybe you might explain to me why insurance companys have set minimums for operators and their pilots, why korean airlines hired over 100 more experienced expat pilots to prevent them from being barred to the U.S by the FAA. Experience is proven and it works.
Pull your head in
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Errr, well pickle me eyebrow flyby_kiwi ol' son. That would be an interesting situation. This person could go back to flying 152s to build TT. You've given me a little bit to worry about!
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Guys just because a guy has been flogging around the circiut area instructing for a few thousand hours doesnt automatically open the doors to be called a hero or a twit as one post has mentioned.I agree that in general a pilot with 1000 hrs from the raaf would more than likely have recieved better training and on more up to date technology,however this doesnt automatically make him a better pilot.
Ive known so pilots over the years with many thousands of hrs that I wouldnt trust to drive my car let alone fly my aircraft,and in contrast ive known some with very low time that i would have no hesitation in letting my wife or mum fly with them.Some times its just a case of maturity and attitude some have it and others dont.
And before someone decides to jump all over this post with big boots NO IM NOT A CIRCUIT WARRIOR.(not that there is anything wrong with that)
Ive known so pilots over the years with many thousands of hrs that I wouldnt trust to drive my car let alone fly my aircraft,and in contrast ive known some with very low time that i would have no hesitation in letting my wife or mum fly with them.Some times its just a case of maturity and attitude some have it and others dont.
And before someone decides to jump all over this post with big boots NO IM NOT A CIRCUIT WARRIOR.(not that there is anything wrong with that)
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Ok, I'll try and put some perspective to the experience/TT conundrum.
In the last half decade I have seen a bit from both sides of the fence - 100+hrs RAAF flying training (yes,was scrubbed near the end), and 1500+hrs GA charter.
Now to be candid, the learning curve during military flying training is bloody steep. I would say that most people don't enjoy it nor get much sleep during it either. To try and describe this type of flying to the GA crew is a bit difficult. It's like having a CIR test (stress wise) to fly every day with only the night before to prep.
You can imagine with some old aircraft types still operating within the ADF with operating costs in excess of 70,000$/hr (not a typo), that the flight crew will be working pretty hard during wheels off to wheels on. (Not just A to B stuff).
But - having said this, most military a/c are maintained to a pretty high standard with most systems working properly. The sorties although sometimes demanding, have a lot of prep time(sometimes days) for little flight time.
Ok, now for the shock of GA. (NT perspective)
I'm sure some can relate - Get out of bed being thankful you still have a job although weak from malnutrition.
Get to work in you sh#t car, avoid the boss and make a coffee.
Get one sip before a pop-up flight is demanded your immediate attention with departure in 30min.
Flight plan, get wx and notams, prefilght and re-fuel, manifest/weight@balance go!
Depart, waffle over the tree line at Vx in your under peforming S/E piece of cr#p into the black wet season Wx headed for Arnhemland.
Vis getting low, suction pump goes again. Min fuel (but wouldn't know this from the fluctuating gauges), ADF/VOR u/s or not fitted.
Trying to DR, scud running over featureless terrain with aboriginals yelling/smelling in the back.
Get back home by the skin of your teeth, and cringe at the thought of the boss finding out you defected another a/c. Will I have a job tomorrow?
I think most GA pilots wouldn't appreciate the level of skill and professionalism that todays ADF pilots (particularly RAAF @ RAN) train to. However, most ADF pilots wouldn't appreciate what conditions GA pilots work under. Both avenues are stressful and rewarding.
I must say, despite pilots having different experience, both sides do know how to enjoy each others company and a few drinks.
We're not all that different.
In the last half decade I have seen a bit from both sides of the fence - 100+hrs RAAF flying training (yes,was scrubbed near the end), and 1500+hrs GA charter.
Now to be candid, the learning curve during military flying training is bloody steep. I would say that most people don't enjoy it nor get much sleep during it either. To try and describe this type of flying to the GA crew is a bit difficult. It's like having a CIR test (stress wise) to fly every day with only the night before to prep.
You can imagine with some old aircraft types still operating within the ADF with operating costs in excess of 70,000$/hr (not a typo), that the flight crew will be working pretty hard during wheels off to wheels on. (Not just A to B stuff).
But - having said this, most military a/c are maintained to a pretty high standard with most systems working properly. The sorties although sometimes demanding, have a lot of prep time(sometimes days) for little flight time.
Ok, now for the shock of GA. (NT perspective)
I'm sure some can relate - Get out of bed being thankful you still have a job although weak from malnutrition.
Get to work in you sh#t car, avoid the boss and make a coffee.
Get one sip before a pop-up flight is demanded your immediate attention with departure in 30min.
Flight plan, get wx and notams, prefilght and re-fuel, manifest/weight@balance go!
Depart, waffle over the tree line at Vx in your under peforming S/E piece of cr#p into the black wet season Wx headed for Arnhemland.
Vis getting low, suction pump goes again. Min fuel (but wouldn't know this from the fluctuating gauges), ADF/VOR u/s or not fitted.
Trying to DR, scud running over featureless terrain with aboriginals yelling/smelling in the back.
Get back home by the skin of your teeth, and cringe at the thought of the boss finding out you defected another a/c. Will I have a job tomorrow?
I think most GA pilots wouldn't appreciate the level of skill and professionalism that todays ADF pilots (particularly RAAF @ RAN) train to. However, most ADF pilots wouldn't appreciate what conditions GA pilots work under. Both avenues are stressful and rewarding.
I must say, despite pilots having different experience, both sides do know how to enjoy each others company and a few drinks.
We're not all that different.
Last edited by Chief Wiggam; 24th May 2004 at 11:39.
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OOPS
Cheif Wiggam,
whilst I agree with your post, I must question one small part of it.
Why were Army trained pilots so conspicuously overlooked?
Not trying to flog a dead horse here, but hasn't that obvious misconception long been stamped out?
Just wondering.
Monkey of Love.
whilst I agree with your post, I must question one small part of it.
I think most GA pilots wouldn't appreciate the level of skill and professionalism that todays ADF pilots (particularly RAAF @ RAN) train to.
Not trying to flog a dead horse here, but hasn't that obvious misconception long been stamped out?
Just wondering.
Monkey of Love.
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L M.
Didn't mean to open old wounds old pal. Nothing implied by the Army omission. I can only reflect on my experience, and didn't train alongside Army drivers.
Agreed, the quote could and should have been written without discriminating.
Have a mate at 5th Ave on the BlackHawk. Realise that low level formation on NVGs is no walk in the park.
Hope this clarifies things.
Didn't mean to open old wounds old pal. Nothing implied by the Army omission. I can only reflect on my experience, and didn't train alongside Army drivers.
Agreed, the quote could and should have been written without discriminating.
Have a mate at 5th Ave on the BlackHawk. Realise that low level formation on NVGs is no walk in the park.
Hope this clarifies things.
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capt stalingrad
I'm terribly sorry capt.... I was not for one minute suggesting that you had been flying warriers or been in the circuit or even that you were a twit,I was simply making reference to a possible comparison in the industry,they were my thoughts and still are.
Get a sense of humour and dont be so sensitive.Oh and by the way pull your own head in you Twit...
RWS888
Get a sense of humour and dont be so sensitive.Oh and by the way pull your own head in you Twit...
RWS888
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RWS888, I understand exactly what you are saying, TT is a bit of a oxymoron, which should be of importance only to the person who is writing it in his/her log book. The real issue of this TT is the breakdown of the hours within and how they are achieved. For example, a pilot may have 1500hrs flying scenics, in which there decision making skills are rarely tested and fly around at 1500ftagl. While a pilot has 700 hours, 500 flying charter operation from a to b to c with 200 hours IF whose workload and decision making processes are demonsrated on a much more frequent basis.( I repeat this is only an example, a dodgy one at that.) The point is, the breakdown of the hours should be the important issue not the total time, and the ability to sit down at the end of the day and enjoy a cold one with those around you and talk about a few other things than aviation every once in awhile.
Cheers SC
Cheers SC
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mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmhuhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmhuhmhuh.
Pearls of wisdom scanrate,I like the way you think.You have got your sh@# in a pile,your prioritys are certainly straight.
We'll have to have a cold one soon .RWS888 Bye Bye Son.
Pearls of wisdom scanrate,I like the way you think.You have got your sh@# in a pile,your prioritys are certainly straight.
We'll have to have a cold one soon .RWS888
Bye Bye Son.