Pilot Shortage looms for NZ
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Pilot Shortage looms for NZ
Sunday Star Times - Sun 14th Sept
Taxpayer lands the bill as pilots thin on the ground
14 September 2003
By RACHEL GRUNWELL
Taxpayers face the possibility of another Air New Zealand bailout as the aviation industry faces chaos over the looming retirement of the baby boom generation.
Employment Minister Steve Maharey has recevied a report from the Aviation Industry Association which shows large gaps appearing in the number of qualified commercial pilots in New Zealand.
There were 1.125 million babies born in New Zealand between 1946 and 1965 - who are now heading towards retirement, raising fears of a shortage of experienced pilots as well as a national work force shortage.
The association's review also reveals the industry is being hit by overseas companies poaching our qualified pilots.
It is understood Cathay Pacific alone recruited 20 Kiwi pilots last year.
The association met Maharey last week to discuss how many pilots need to be trained to meet industry requirements in the future.
Maharey will prepare a cabinet report based on the association's findings on September 29 so the government can then decide how much taxpayers' money should be used to train pilots.
"Taxpayers have some responsibility, but the industry has to pay as well," said Maharey, who was briefed on Friday on the association's findings.
The association's review was spurred by the government's proposal in May, which included capping the amount students allowed to borrow under the loan scheme to around $6500. This would particularly affect trainee pilots because it costs about $60,000 to learn to fly.
The government wants to reign in large student loans - particularly for aviation students. The 10 biggest individual student loans paid out last year went to aviation students, with one receiving almost $140,000.
Talk of capping trainee pilots' cashflow meant the association had to look at how many pilots it needs in training to meet growing industry requirements.
Irene King, chairwoman of the assoication's transport division who has been working on the review, said up to 800 people learn to fly each year and it appeared this number of students could need to continue to be trained each year to meet industry demands.
"The government is saying they will only fund X amount of pilots to undergo training. But the review looks like it will say they will have to pump in this money and crank through 700-800 pilots a year to be able to fulfill the needs of the jet operations,"said King.
Air New Zealand employs about 1000 pilots and there are about 3500 in the industry - a big proportion of which are from the baby boom era.
The review surveyed 1241 pilots, 300 of which were aged 51 years and over. In the next age group 41-50-years, there were 435 pilots; 382 pilots were aged 31-40 years; 127 in 21-30 years; and seven pilots aged under 20.
King said it took six to 10 years to train a pilot for jet operations.
Taxpayer lands the bill as pilots thin on the ground
14 September 2003
By RACHEL GRUNWELL
Taxpayers face the possibility of another Air New Zealand bailout as the aviation industry faces chaos over the looming retirement of the baby boom generation.
Employment Minister Steve Maharey has recevied a report from the Aviation Industry Association which shows large gaps appearing in the number of qualified commercial pilots in New Zealand.
There were 1.125 million babies born in New Zealand between 1946 and 1965 - who are now heading towards retirement, raising fears of a shortage of experienced pilots as well as a national work force shortage.
The association's review also reveals the industry is being hit by overseas companies poaching our qualified pilots.
It is understood Cathay Pacific alone recruited 20 Kiwi pilots last year.
The association met Maharey last week to discuss how many pilots need to be trained to meet industry requirements in the future.
Maharey will prepare a cabinet report based on the association's findings on September 29 so the government can then decide how much taxpayers' money should be used to train pilots.
"Taxpayers have some responsibility, but the industry has to pay as well," said Maharey, who was briefed on Friday on the association's findings.
The association's review was spurred by the government's proposal in May, which included capping the amount students allowed to borrow under the loan scheme to around $6500. This would particularly affect trainee pilots because it costs about $60,000 to learn to fly.
The government wants to reign in large student loans - particularly for aviation students. The 10 biggest individual student loans paid out last year went to aviation students, with one receiving almost $140,000.
Talk of capping trainee pilots' cashflow meant the association had to look at how many pilots it needs in training to meet growing industry requirements.
Irene King, chairwoman of the assoication's transport division who has been working on the review, said up to 800 people learn to fly each year and it appeared this number of students could need to continue to be trained each year to meet industry demands.
"The government is saying they will only fund X amount of pilots to undergo training. But the review looks like it will say they will have to pump in this money and crank through 700-800 pilots a year to be able to fulfill the needs of the jet operations,"said King.
Air New Zealand employs about 1000 pilots and there are about 3500 in the industry - a big proportion of which are from the baby boom era.
The review surveyed 1241 pilots, 300 of which were aged 51 years and over. In the next age group 41-50-years, there were 435 pilots; 382 pilots were aged 31-40 years; 127 in 21-30 years; and seven pilots aged under 20.
King said it took six to 10 years to train a pilot for jet operations.
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Sounds like the same bollocks story I heard when I started in 97, however I'am interested to see where 700-800 pilots a year are going to work when there is not even that many domestic postions in NZ.
Makes interesting reading though, thanks for posting it S2K.
Makes interesting reading though, thanks for posting it S2K.
oooh pilot shortage....supply and demand dictates that
you can all have a payrise when it eventuates!
140k??????? somebody saw that sucker coming...
thats almost as criminal as paying a solo mum 300 bucks a week to sit at home
you can all have a payrise when it eventuates!
140k??????? somebody saw that sucker coming...
thats almost as criminal as paying a solo mum 300 bucks a week to sit at home
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How the hell do you justify putting through 700-800 student pilots a year?!?!?!?
I can see many a Air traffic controller growing many a grey hair reading that!!
I get the impression that it's another one of those stories where you can make the statistics say what you want to say... Could it just be that in the survey, more of the older pilots responded... suppose you have to find something to do while sitting at FL350...
We just need another SARS or Sept 11, and they won't be shedding pilots quick enough!!!!!
Thanks for posting that Sqwark... bout time we had a bit of humour posted on the board..
I can see many a Air traffic controller growing many a grey hair reading that!!
I get the impression that it's another one of those stories where you can make the statistics say what you want to say... Could it just be that in the survey, more of the older pilots responded... suppose you have to find something to do while sitting at FL350...
We just need another SARS or Sept 11, and they won't be shedding pilots quick enough!!!!!
Thanks for posting that Sqwark... bout time we had a bit of humour posted on the board..
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How come you got time to read newspapers. Your son should be wearing you down about now..... or has that new job got too much time off huh?
Nice spotting anyway S2K. Most interesting.
Nice spotting anyway S2K. Most interesting.
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Its total lies. Look around New Zealand at the number of Flying schools creaming it from the student loan scheme. The government is about to put an end to it all. The industry has made up a BS story about the need to train 800 people per year. In other words "don't cut the funding please".
I doubt whether 10% of these people ever get to fly for a living and ultimately end up with nothing but a huge debt while the local flying school polishes its new aircraft.
The whole thing is just one big sad con job sold on lies!!!
I doubt whether 10% of these people ever get to fly for a living and ultimately end up with nothing but a huge debt while the local flying school polishes its new aircraft.
The whole thing is just one big sad con job sold on lies!!!
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Translation....
Translating the article in summary...
Aviation Industry Association, aka Air New Zealand puppet, gets Irene King, from Air New Zealand's Bullsh*t Castle, to go cap in hand to Helen asking the taxpayer to cover a further shortfall in strategic planning at Air NZ.
Some politicians will believe anything.
Roll on Pacific Blue...the next New Zealand flag carrier.
Aviation Industry Association, aka Air New Zealand puppet, gets Irene King, from Air New Zealand's Bullsh*t Castle, to go cap in hand to Helen asking the taxpayer to cover a further shortfall in strategic planning at Air NZ.
Some politicians will believe anything.
Roll on Pacific Blue...the next New Zealand flag carrier.
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Shortages
Hmmm there yoiu are seems like a nother crap frpm the NZ . go and fund the kids, wish we have a funding system like that in Aussi , or may be we shouls start sending them to NZ ,,,,
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TIS
I think you hit the nail on the head with that one.
Too many people with the possibility of losing their nice lifestyle paid for by the unsuspecting wanna-be pilot.
I think you hit the nail on the head with that one.
Too many people with the possibility of losing their nice lifestyle paid for by the unsuspecting wanna-be pilot.
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Don't blow the newspaper article off altogether. There are some pertinent aspects there. The US employment market is in a swamp at the moment, however a read of several new books and magazine articles indicate the US employment boom of the late 1990s was only a warm-up compared to the employment situation coming in 2010.
The reason - the bulk proportion of the baby boomers hit their big spending years around then, while the number of retirees can't be replaced by the lesser number of generation x'ers. It's not just going to effect pilots, but every market, particularly the tech industry. If reality matches the forecasts, kids will be able to pick and choose their employment.
It's a little hard to fathom given the current situation, but the chorus indicating labour shortages is getting bigger, and you don't think HR staff aren't taking notice?
The reason - the bulk proportion of the baby boomers hit their big spending years around then, while the number of retirees can't be replaced by the lesser number of generation x'ers. It's not just going to effect pilots, but every market, particularly the tech industry. If reality matches the forecasts, kids will be able to pick and choose their employment.
It's a little hard to fathom given the current situation, but the chorus indicating labour shortages is getting bigger, and you don't think HR staff aren't taking notice?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
You're talking 7 years away, L/D. There are going to be a myriad of changes to many jobs during that period, not least of which will see the developing countries, with their associated enormous potential workforces, come into their own.
Current immigration barriers will be lowered or removed, to enable companies to maintain a staffing level, and to prevent country's economies from floundering.
All part of the "Global Village" bs that has caused the downward spiral in the western world's employment conditions.
Current immigration barriers will be lowered or removed, to enable companies to maintain a staffing level, and to prevent country's economies from floundering.
All part of the "Global Village" bs that has caused the downward spiral in the western world's employment conditions.
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2010-2014 reportedly is going to be the peak period. If the market goes as predicted, people will start noticing the first signs late next year and it will just keep building.
Varying estimates indicate by 2010, there could be 10 million jobs that can't be filled just in the US alone. What's that going to do to wages and staff retention? If the job explosion comes to fruition there are going to be a lot of people with memories about getting screwed by particular companies in the early 2000's.
Varying estimates indicate by 2010, there could be 10 million jobs that can't be filled just in the US alone. What's that going to do to wages and staff retention? If the job explosion comes to fruition there are going to be a lot of people with memories about getting screwed by particular companies in the early 2000's.
Last edited by Lodown; 15th Sep 2003 at 11:24.
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Tape It Shut,
Bang on with that comment brother, cant belive the AIA is blowing smoke up MP's arses like that, they are supposed to look after the industry.
There will NEVER be a situation in NZ where aircraft are grounded because the Cheif Pilot has run out of CV,s. Yes experience levels may fluctuate, they may not get the personalites they like, and training may take slightly longer with less experienced chaps taking a bigger jump than they may have done when movement is not as swift. But you can be damm sure that airlines will not ground aircraft because they cant get somebody to fill the front 2 seats.
If somebody would be kind enough to save this reply somewhere and when the pilot shortage hits, present it to me and I will gladly eat my hat, as long as I can have some of that nice sweet chilli sauce on it.
Good topic starter S2K, Im off to write a letter to that MP to let him know hes having his leg pulled.
Grumble grumble mumble cuss
Bang on with that comment brother, cant belive the AIA is blowing smoke up MP's arses like that, they are supposed to look after the industry.
There will NEVER be a situation in NZ where aircraft are grounded because the Cheif Pilot has run out of CV,s. Yes experience levels may fluctuate, they may not get the personalites they like, and training may take slightly longer with less experienced chaps taking a bigger jump than they may have done when movement is not as swift. But you can be damm sure that airlines will not ground aircraft because they cant get somebody to fill the front 2 seats.
If somebody would be kind enough to save this reply somewhere and when the pilot shortage hits, present it to me and I will gladly eat my hat, as long as I can have some of that nice sweet chilli sauce on it.
Good topic starter S2K, Im off to write a letter to that MP to let him know hes having his leg pulled.
Grumble grumble mumble cuss
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The whole thing could be a crock, but I do dispute Irene Kings' assertion that it takes several years to train a jet pilot.
Only in Australia and NZ are pilots brainwashed into thinking that they need to have 2500hrs plus to be 'experienced enough' or worthy to fly a Dash/Saab etc, let alone a jet.
I spent my first 2 years flying in the bush back home, but now that I am in the UK, I see 250 hr guys going straight onto heavy jets. And given a decent competant individual and solid line training there is absolutely no problem.
The idea that a pilot has to spend several years 'training' to fly a jet is rubbish. Perhaps if she said that supply and demand dictates several years experience, that would be more accurate.
As for the chances of a pilot shortage, I will believe it when Robyn Hind calls me in the UK begging me to come home for an interview.
cheers all.
Only in Australia and NZ are pilots brainwashed into thinking that they need to have 2500hrs plus to be 'experienced enough' or worthy to fly a Dash/Saab etc, let alone a jet.
I spent my first 2 years flying in the bush back home, but now that I am in the UK, I see 250 hr guys going straight onto heavy jets. And given a decent competant individual and solid line training there is absolutely no problem.
The idea that a pilot has to spend several years 'training' to fly a jet is rubbish. Perhaps if she said that supply and demand dictates several years experience, that would be more accurate.
As for the chances of a pilot shortage, I will believe it when Robyn Hind calls me in the UK begging me to come home for an interview.
cheers all.
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I spent my first 2 years flying in the bush back home, but now that I am in the UK, I see 250 hr guys going straight onto heavy jets. And given a decent competant individual and solid line training there is absolutely no problem.
The idea that a pilot has to spend several years 'training' to fly a jet is rubbish.
Ohhmegod! Now some b@st@rds gunna accuse me a bein' bateman.
An youse all thought I was avin a go at youse.
The big down ill slides startin blokes. I'll give 'er 3 or 4 years from now til we start ta see a NOTICEABLE increase in major prangs.
There ya go!
See youse round.
The idea that a pilot has to spend several years 'training' to fly a jet is rubbish.
Ohhmegod! Now some b@st@rds gunna accuse me a bein' bateman.
An youse all thought I was avin a go at youse.
The big down ill slides startin blokes. I'll give 'er 3 or 4 years from now til we start ta see a NOTICEABLE increase in major prangs.
There ya go!
See youse round.
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Now there is a scary thought! If Im on an "El Cheapo Air" flight
from Luton to Ibiza and the captain becomes incapacitated,
the guy in charge has 250 hours!
Might as well have a med student perform unsupervised brain
surgery
from Luton to Ibiza and the captain becomes incapacitated,
the guy in charge has 250 hours!
Might as well have a med student perform unsupervised brain
surgery