cheers zonda racer, all clear

good thread and some good info.
 

I am currently flying in Nepal. I have an immigrant visa and work permit through the diversity visa.

I however have flown on a two crew-single engine turbo prop aircraft(as per the requirement of our aviation authority due to terrain). Flying to places like Lukla which is considered most dangerous airport in the world and other airfields similar to that.

both the pilots hold aircraft specific pic type rating for the aircraft. one pilot flies one leg of the flight and me usually the sector back or vice versa. who ever flies the leg logs it as PIC and rest is logged as SIC if your doing the radios and duties of SIC.
with a TT of 1800 hrs and a total of 1200 hrs pic and 600 hrs sic (including 1000 hrs pic on turbo prop). But i am not current on Instrument nor current on multi engine and only have about 20 hrs of ME time.

I plan to come to US get my BFR, IPC and ATP done. What are the chances of getting a job then? and what kinda jobs would i get?

Any suggestions?

First, welcome to America.

The good news that getting your ATP will count for your Flight Review (the B was dropped from the official title years ago) and IPC.

The bad news is your multi time is low. All the RJ operators are going to want 100 hours MEL. Even Cape Air flying CE-402s wants 25 MEL for their F/Os. You will have to find some way to up your MEL time to be competive.

Thank you.
Thanks for the info. Taking the ATP checkride would make me instrument current. But i need to log some night and multi hours plus instrument. Thus, i guess i need a bfr and ipc to fly solo. I am also planning to log about 50 mel hrs to meet the night and instrument hours on a be 76, this should make proficient on ME and instrument flying i hope.
Would then i be legible for some kinda job if yes, what kind RJ or Multi piston on 91 or 135 like cape air?

Ah, there are always details. You can get a private certificate based on your Nepal license by having your CAA verify your license to the FAA. Part of the FAA guidance to their Inspectors is to remind the new certifcate holder that that certificate is only good as long as their foreign license is valid and that they need a flight review before they fly under their FAA cert. While the regs only say that a flight review has to have one hour ground school and one hour flight training, I'd think the FR for a 61.75 pilot could go on most of a day to cover all the differences. In order to have an instrument rating on your 61.75 private certificate you will have to pass a knowledge test, either a foreign pilot differences test or the regular instrument written. But there is no checkride.

If you have 25 hours MEL now and log 50 hours to fill all the sub-totals for the ATP you'll still only have 75 hours MEL so you'll still be short the MEL time for most RJ jobs and most likely be looking at a recip or turboprop F/O position.

I already have a FAA CPL with IR and MEL.
I did my initials in USA :)

what is min mel hour requirement to get a job to fly multi engine aircrafts? Not necessarily at Regional level?

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Ah, disregard.

Every job will be different. You meet the legal requirements by holding a commercial MEL. Requirements above that are normally driven by the company's insurance and training program. Some companies want 50 hours, some want 200. If they can get enough applicants they have no reason to change their requirements.

Hi Guys me again

Just wondering if you need your FAA Commercial license in order to instruct? I currently have a European ATP..... it sounds like I can't convert my license to anything higher than a FAA PPL, it would then take me ages to build time towards a CPL if that's the minimum I need in order to teach?
Any idea how many hours difference the two licenses are??
Cheers all

You must hold an FAA CPL + IR, or an ATP, to hold an FAA instructor rating.

You wrote earlier that you have something like 250 hours. How can you have an ATPL with only those hours? Conversely, if you hold a CPL, why do you keep referring to it as an ATP?

Tinstaafl
 

We seem to do things very differently in this part of the world. I hold an EASA ATPL (made up of CPL+IR+MCC, the later being a multi crew course on a B737 sim,) which is the equivalent to an FAA ATP, and obviously requires much less hours to get.

I was referring to the FAA CPL, and how many hours I may need to build to get the FAA equivalent of the CPL +IR. For example if I need to build another 300 hours just to get my FAA licenses then I may as well stay over here until I get 1000+ hours.
Cheers for your info by the way

I hold a UK ATPL as well as an FAA ATP so I think I have some familiarity with the system(s). The minimum hours required for a UK/JAA/EASA, FAA, Australian & pretty much every other ATPL is 1,500 (with various minima within that 1,500 hours) and requires a skills test. I bet a pound to a penny you *don't* hold an ATPL if you only have 250 hours. A JAA CPL+IR+MCC (with or without passes in the ATPL exams) is not an ATPL, and is not equivalent to an FAA ATP.

Check what's written on your licence.

The minimum hours for a Part 61 (equivalent to the UK's 'self improver/modular' route) FAA Commercial licence is 250 , with various breakdowns within that amount. You shouldn't need 300 hours to get it, just what ever is needed to meet the breakdowns and enough skill to pass a recommendation check for the flight test. Similarly for the Instrument Rating - check what the minimum requirements are then compare them to your log book + enough skill to pass a recommendation and then a check ride.

The instructor rating will require some amount of training (there's a requirement for a certain amount of instruction from an FAA licenced instructor, but it's not much.

The FARs allow for all training done overseas, by an appropriately qualified instructor, to count towards FAA required training. Only instances where a sign-off from an FAA instructor is required has to be given by an FAA instructor.

Apologies Tinstaafl, I forgot to write that it was a "Frozen ATPL" (meaning until you get 1500 hours you can't be legal PIC,) I did write that earlier in the thread but not in my recent post. I did not mean 'equivalent' in terms of hours or experience, just in terms of title, anyway I wasn't clear so I apologize again.
Cheers for your info, all useful stuff

Still not equivalent then. You hold a *Commercial* licence + IR + ATPL theory. You can be legal PIC in public transport operations, but you are limited to PIC in single pilot aircraft. No different to the holder of an FAA Commercial licence + Instrument + ATP theory, for all practical purposes, so that's what you're equivalent to. The whole 'frozen ATPL' language is nothing more than a European (well, it started as a UK thing, I seem to recall) shorthand for CPL+IR+ATPL exams. In recent years it has broadened to often include MCC as well. I also think I remember it started as a marketing & advertising ploy by the CAP509 (integrated, in JAA speak) schools, as a way to improve the perception of what they were selling. I saw it start to happen in Australia too. The idea is no different to someone with a PPL & passes in CPL theory saying that they have a 'Frozen CPL', or a student pilot with passes in the PPL exams having a 'frozen PPL'.

If you're serious about a move to the US - or anywhere away from the European terminology - I strongly suggest you use the correct name for your qualifications. 'fATPL' is a meaningless term here and leaves the impression you're trying to deceive about what level of licence you actually hold. Bear in mind that your ATPL exams & MCC aren't worth anything in the US (except your understanding of the theory will be rather better than a typical CPL candidate here). Only the licence you have been issued counts. Which, by the way, is no different to some one trying to get credits for their ICAO licence(s) to get a UK/JAR/EASA licence. It's much easier going from ICAO to FAA than ICAO to UK/JAR/EASA, though.

If you go to FAA: Home and look for the links to the regulations you can find exactly what hours you need for an FAA CPL & an IR. Pay particular attention to how the cross-country time is defined for each licence & rating - it varies! Part 61 of CFR14 (often referred to as FAR61) is the section you need.

In fact, here's the link to Part 61. Definitions at the beginning, and the requirements for each certificate further down:eCFR — Code of Federal Regulations

Thanks for the info MarkerInBound

Ok so we've established my license is crap, but I haven't been pulling the wool over anyone's eyes, like I said if you bothered to read back through the thread you'll see the first time I wrote 'ATP' instead of 'Frozen' was a few days ago, and I certainly won't be doing that again.....

I agree, it's a way of selling the qualification better and people including myself fall for it. The difference is that here you can be an FO on an A320 with this damn "Frozen ATPL", and obviously in America you can't, which I agree with anyway as it means more experienced guys at the front. I've always known that Airlines seem to need around 1500+ hours before they'll look at you over there, I'm just trying to find a way into US aviation, regardless of what I fly.
Thanks for the link!

No, I didn't write that your licence was crap. I wrote that it was not an ATP and nor was it the equivalent of an FAA ATP. Your first post in this thread

stated that you hold an ATP. Later, it transpired that you don't, in fact, hold an ATPL, but a CPL. Nothing wrong with that (I held one for years) but it's not an ATPL. You also wrote that your CPL + IR + MCC is the equivalent of an FAA ATP, which it's not. It seems you have (or had) a degree of misunderstanding about the privileges & limitations for these licences, possibly including your own licence.

Your CPL qualifies you to fly as PIC in public transport for *single pilot* certificated aircraft, and SIC in multi-crew types. Much the same as an FAA CPL**. In some ways, slightly better: JAR requires 700 hours for PIC in public transport ops. FAR requires 1200 for IFR Part 135 ops (that's charter/air taxi ops) so you're slightly better off in that respect.

Better you get it sorted out now, than when you're in front of an interviewer who you led to believe in your application that you hold an ATP(L) but who then reads what's printed on your licence. What qualification(s) you actually hold also affects converting to another jurisdiction's licence. What you can or can't do to convert to an FAA depends on your licence & hours. If you held a JAR ATPL like you originally wrote then chances are you have the required hours for an FAA ATP, in which case the conversion is remarkably simple (one theory exam, one checkride that's pretty much like an IR flight test, no instructor recommendation required). Converting a CPL + IR, however, is a bit more complicated & expensive (two checkrides + 2 instructor recommendations + two theory exams *and* the required cross country experience is more specific. The Commercial checkride also involves manoeuvres that just aren't done for any JAR licence so practice will probably be needed for those)

Lots of opportunities for FAA CPLs, even those who don't meet the Part 135 requirements. Aerial survey & photography, para dropping, power & pipeline inspection, VFR Part 135 in some places (500 hrs needed though). Even instructing, which is a cheaper rating to get in the US than in JAR-land.


**There is a rule change coming that affects FAA CPLs that will prevent them being an SIC in airline ops in large aircraft (>12,500 lb MTOW). Can't remember the exact details because it doesn't affect me, but it's either that you'll need to hold an ATP to be an SIC, or you'll need ATP hours with your CPL ie 1500 hrs. CPLs still will be able to be an SIC in >12,500 lb types, but just not in Part 121 air transport ops ie airline stuff. Didn't used to be the case, but this law was enacted as a reaction to a regional airline fatal crash and takes effect over the next couple of years.

When did that change? Or is that just for FW?

As far as I was aware you could have a CFI(H) with CPL and FI exam/checkride passes and around 150 hours.

HTC

I believe that was always the case for fixed wing. Never looked into the helicopter stuff.

Haha well touche' I guess! Read PONTIUS' comment if you don't believe me, I know what I meant but it clearly wasn't the first time I wrote it, but there's no way I would have mixed this up for job purposes. I really appreciate the amount of info you're still providing me haha, despite my obvious lack of broad knowledge!

I think I'll have to put all my eggs in the instructor basket, and hope my license is transferable into an FAA CPL, earlier in this thread someone wrote that you can only convert to a PPL regardless of what license you carry, but I did most of my hours in Goodyear-Arizona and someone I know is going to check if they're transferable........

Found a place in Florida to do an Instructor Course, pre-requisites are:
"FAA Single and Multi-engine Commercial Ratings with a minimum of 15 hours Multi-Engine PIC time." So apart from the multi PIC time I should be ok providing I can somehow get my CPL instead of PPL!

It sounds like there are indeed opportunities for VFR work for a CPL holder, I wouldn't be against any of the things you listed.
Thanks again!

After you marry the girl and with your JAA ATP converted to FAA you shouldn't have any problems getting a job here. The majors are hiring and the regionals are begging pilots to work there.

Major... around 30k-40k first year. On reserve for a few years. Get used to working on weekends. But after a year or two pay will dramatically increase.

Regionals... around 30k-40k first year. But expect to top out at around 40k as a FO. Captains can earn into six figures but only after ten years or so.

Good luck.

Hi,

I am based outside the US and have in excess of 12,000 TT on widebodies with 9,000+ hrs on B777 variants including 3,000+ hrs PIC and instructional experience, and 3,000+ hrs on A340s. My wife is American, and i foresee no problems obtaining a Green Card. With my experience, will i be able to get in with the Majors, and if so, will i start as an FO and have to work my way up to command again? Any of the majors hiring?

Appreciate any guidance.

Every American airline you've heard the name of operates by seniority. So yes, you'll start in the right seat of the lowest paying aircraft with the worst schedules. United will be hiring but still have 1400 out on the street. Their furloughees still have 7 or 8 years of recall rights. Many of them have found something to pay their bills so they may pass on the recall for a few years to see how things shake out. Which means the people hired off the street will be at the bottom of the list for a long time. Delta is probably 50/50, their new contract ups their hours some which may negate the need to hire. I think US Air is hiring. American may hire, or they may be rolled into US Air.

Tks, Claybird and MarkerInbound. I'm presently earning beyond the top scale of a UAL Captain, with no complaints whatsoever with my present airline beyond the hard slog of organizing my days off and vacation days to get stateside, if the wife relocates to the US. I don't mind taking a pay cut, but RHS at the bottom would mean lousy pay and schedules for many years.

The sandpit doesn't appeal to me unless they commence basing crew in the US. Also not keen on a commuting contract with KAL, given the mixed feedback on working conditions there.

So, it appears there is no painless way of living and working in the US for me...

Merry X-Mas!

If you're already doing better than a united 777 captain, stay where you are. If united is anything like the other 777 operators in the us, that seat is likely to be over 15-20 years away. FedEx won't be an option either right now. Unfortunately, they currently require you to live in the us for 5 years before starting your employment.

Tks, Claybird and CA. Status quo it is....

what airline is recruting in the US? (except regionals...)

None, except for a very few CO new hires, but that is in the middle of the UA/CO SLI. No one sees hiring on a major scale here for 2013.

GF

Alaska will most likely be hiring next year. US Air and Hawaiian have been taking apps this fall.

Similar query; I married an American, and we're thinking of a move stateside at some point. I've 3000h, 2500h on 40T Jet (BAe 146), all of it as an FO (so only about 250h true P1).

After getting a green card and converting the licence:

- would I be able to look at regionals or at majors?
- reading Flyrr100's post about 30-40k starting, going up after the first year or two; what does it go up to? what does the salary profile look like over say a 5-10 year period?
- I know this is a really, really broad question, but what sort of rosters are there? trips? fixed days off? bid system?

Thanks in advance.

Oh - and how does the whole type rating thing work in the US? is it paid by the pilot, airline, or an intermediate arrangement (bonding, loan)?

thanks again.

The airline types you, no money out of your pocket. Some of the smaller operators will want you to sign a training contract saying you'll stay a year or two afterwards or pay back a pro rata share but none of the majors do this. I've always worked the dark side of the ramp so I've got no experience with pax schedules. I've heard pilots talking about 3 on/4 off and 4 on/3 off but I know some folks can get day turns - fly out in the morning and be back at night. EVERYTHING at US airlines depends on your senority based on date of hire. What equipment you fly, schedules, vacations.

And I'd say Flyrr100 is a bit high for starting regional pay, more like $25,000. The web site Airline Pilot Central has most US airline pay scales in the "Profile" section on their home page. Looks like a Delta or United 747 Captain is over 200k after 10 years.

Forgot, you meet the posted mins for hiring at US Airways and United. But minimums and what's competitive are two different things. Most people say 1000 turbine PIC makes you much more likely to be hired. Which is why many pilots went the regional route, figuring they'd be in and out in 4 or 5 year. That hasn't been working too well since 2001.

Thanks guys - that's really (really) useful.

Here's a (somewhat) theoretical question: which would have me in a better position in mid 2015:

1/ Stay here, get command, get 1000h PIC (which takes 2.5yrs), and be in a better position to apply directly to the majors in mid 2015.
OR
2/ Join a regional now and work up from there.


Also, a completely separate question: what about LCC's? same story?

The problem is the RVR in everyone's crystal ball is <300. If you know that the present job will lead to command in a year and you'll log 700 hours a year I'd say stay. If you show up here, first you have to be hired. Yeah, yeah, I know we're going to have a pilot shortage. From what I've heard, Delta won't be hiring this year, American still has pilots on the street from 2001, so does United. So no one has been leaving the regionals. We have a whole generation of pilots who spent 60,000-90,000 thousand getting their ratings, thinking they'd suffer through a couple years at the regionals and hit the gravy train now on fifth year FO pay. Comair, one of the older and larger regionals, shut down last year and put over 800 pilots on the street. I've heard Eagle, American's regional code share, will be hiring this year but they've got 7 year FOs as does Air Wisconsin.

I don't have any connections in the LCC world. Sprint appears to be hiring, Frontier and Virgin are not. And Virgin does say "1000 hours turbine PIC preferred." And unless you're going to stay there, they seem to be running 6 years to upgrade.

Oompa,

I'd go with option 1. Unless you're friends with the Chief Pilot, it will be exceedingly difficult to get into a major without turbine PIC (TPIC) time.

Thanks guys, again.

I thought that would be the case; Option 1 works better anyway as the practicalities of getting a green card, licence conversion, etc. will probably take a while anyway.

That should work. I've got a friend at Eagle, 15 Captain, lives in base (DFW) so no commuting to work, bids what he wants and gets it and makes about 100k. He's not going anywhere.

The hard part of jumping to the regionals is their instability. I know some guys who are on their 3rd regional in 5 years due to furloughs and companies closing shop. These guys are perpetually stuck on the bottom of their seniority lists and can't move up due to all the whipsawing.

Guys/Girls if your thinking about coming to the USA in search of a major airline job I would just stay where your at (for now).
Many airlines are laying pilots off right now... North American, Evergreen, World, USA Jet, Ryan International... just to name a few. Plus all the people at the regionals are trying to move on.
Very few airlines are hiring execpt regionals (which all now require 1500tt).
Just to give an example im at: 6800tt / 5000 jet / ATP and TR in the CRJ/A320 and have about 600PIC... I work for Pinnacle Airlines which is about to lay off 1000-1500 pilots.
I've applied at about 30 companies from the USA to Hong Kong... I have not recieved one phone call back from any of the companies in the USA I've applied at... Not to say just because I can't get a call back doesnt mean you cant either, I just wanted to point out how crappy it is in the USA right now.
Good Luck