NTSB- New Board-anyother Human Factors guy
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NTSB- New Board-anyother Human Factors guy
"... Member Rosekind ... fatigue expert ... specializes in fatigue management. ... was Chief of the Aviation Operations Branch in the Flight Management and Human Factors Division at the NASA Ames Research Center.... was the Director of the Center for Human Sleep Research ...""... term as a Member of the NTSB expires December 31, 2014 "
Hmmm, another Human Factors guy.
In an investigation, we all see various elements, mostly related to our background. Bomb-guys see sabotage, engineers see design weaknesses, Ops-guys see weaknesses in procedures.
The problem with HF-guys is that any mysterious inflight upset or breakup, or mysterious ARC, becomes a study of the pilot's human weaknesses (SD, lack of SA, &ct).
I hope the next new Board Member has some technical insight.
Last edited by IGh; 1st Jul 2010 at 19:05.
The NTSB Board members do not direct or control investigations, they do however control recommendations for avoiding a similar accident scenario.
They do respond to politics (they listen to congress and the president) They also listen to beefs from the industry and the public.
What's nice about having a PHD in an aviation subject, is that they can more easily understand and weigh proposed recommendations for corrective actions for a contributing cause.
Maybe it's just my cynicism but I would suspect that a HF guy would be more likely to blame the machine for putting undue pressure on the crew, while a technical guy would be more likey to blame the crew for not accomodating a seemingly benign system failure
but then there is that fleeting thought that we all just really want to prevent another similar accident rather than apportion blame
They do respond to politics (they listen to congress and the president) They also listen to beefs from the industry and the public.
What's nice about having a PHD in an aviation subject, is that they can more easily understand and weigh proposed recommendations for corrective actions for a contributing cause.
Maybe it's just my cynicism but I would suspect that a HF guy would be more likely to blame the machine for putting undue pressure on the crew, while a technical guy would be more likey to blame the crew for not accomodating a seemingly benign system failure
but then there is that fleeting thought that we all just really want to prevent another similar accident rather than apportion blame
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Makes Sense
Mark Rosekind has an absolutely rock solid reputation in his field, and we used some of his research in a document we produced in 2008 on adjusting duty cycles and shift patterns on rigs to improve safety.
1) We shouldn't be surprised: looking at the fatigue factors in the Buffalo crash (could it have been any worse?) it was inevitable.
2) Just because someone excels in one narrow discipline doesn't mean they are completely clueless about related disciplines which abut their field.
3) There is a famous quote by past US president William Jefferson Clinton: "Every major error I made in my life, I made when I was tired".
In my view, an HF guy can only help raise the profile of the importance of crew fatigue management and its role in accidents.
Pinkman
1) We shouldn't be surprised: looking at the fatigue factors in the Buffalo crash (could it have been any worse?) it was inevitable.
2) Just because someone excels in one narrow discipline doesn't mean they are completely clueless about related disciplines which abut their field.
3) There is a famous quote by past US president William Jefferson Clinton: "Every major error I made in my life, I made when I was tired".
In my view, an HF guy can only help raise the profile of the importance of crew fatigue management and its role in accidents.
Pinkman
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For heaven's sake people, .....
people get invited to join the NTSB. It is not a dream job. It is not a dream job even for people who specialise in aviation safety and make it their life's work. Please don't slag someone who is highly qualified, who is asked, and who says yes. Rather, be thankful and grateful that heshe undertook the job!
PBL
people get invited to join the NTSB. It is not a dream job. It is not a dream job even for people who specialise in aviation safety and make it their life's work. Please don't slag someone who is highly qualified, who is asked, and who says yes. Rather, be thankful and grateful that heshe undertook the job!
PBL
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CRM, Human factors, IS9000....I wonder what new area of expertise we can invent to justify a job and pull down paycheck...
People get tired they fall asleep....hire healthier people, give them better schedules.....solved..
People crash planes, because they are stupid, under trained, lie about their credentials....hire better people....solved...
People get tired they fall asleep....hire healthier people, give them better schedules.....solved..
People crash planes, because they are stupid, under trained, lie about their credentials....hire better people....solved...
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Rather Simplistic View
John27022
You have a rather simplistic view of accident causation ... Although there is concern about fatigue issues and scheduling is an area which is being examined (at least at my airline) to say people are "People crash planes, because they are stupid, under trained, lie about their credentials....hire better people." just isnt so. I can say Ive lost friends (very good pilots) because of issues that are legitimate concerns wrt to technology and how it sometimes lets us down.
Coming from someone with 9000 hours big iron time (B777/B767/B757) AND a Masters degree in Human Factors Engineering.
You have a rather simplistic view of accident causation ... Although there is concern about fatigue issues and scheduling is an area which is being examined (at least at my airline) to say people are "People crash planes, because they are stupid, under trained, lie about their credentials....hire better people." just isnt so. I can say Ive lost friends (very good pilots) because of issues that are legitimate concerns wrt to technology and how it sometimes lets us down.
Coming from someone with 9000 hours big iron time (B777/B767/B757) AND a Masters degree in Human Factors Engineering.
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"specializes in fatigue management" 
... i.e. realistic, defined, regulated, enforced limitations of Flight Duty Periods.
... elimination of "split duty" periods.
... elimination of "extended duty" periods at crew's discretion.
... elimination of "minimum rest" periods less than 24 hours.
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Fatigue is perhaps the most common factor in a/c accidents-incidents.. one of the easiest to identify..
And maybe the most difficult to combat.
When the guys up front are starting their 4th/5th sector at 21:00 the bean counters are snuggled up in front of the TV... "what fatigue ?" And the FAA are sitting alongside them.
And maybe the most difficult to combat.
When the guys up front are starting their 4th/5th sector at 21:00 the bean counters are snuggled up in front of the TV... "what fatigue ?" And the FAA are sitting alongside them.
