Don't understand SAS long distance routes.
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Don't understand SAS long distance routes.
I'll leave the infected CPH hub discussions aside. As a Swede I remember when SAS not only flew to South Africa, South America and the US West Coats. They reached all corners for awhile. Those days are long gone.
Here's what mystifies me: They used to run CPH-Seattle successfully for many years. Good numbers. Only the last economic world crisis killed that off. But they couldn't keep Stockholm-LAX profitable? Surely, with Sweden being the 3rd biggest exporter of music, over 100.000 Swedes living in SoCal (as many as in London) - that looks like a no brainer? If flying to Seattle works, logic says LAX would work even better. There are about 3 Swedes in Seattle, in total
Anyone with some inside info why this was shut down?
I also think just based on demographics that SAS should consider a direct route to Santiago considering how many Chileans fled to Sweden in the 70's and 80's. I bet that would work. And tag on a second stop to Rio De Janeiro like they had in the 60's.
Another route I'm sure would work is Miami and San Francisco.
Here's what mystifies me: They used to run CPH-Seattle successfully for many years. Good numbers. Only the last economic world crisis killed that off. But they couldn't keep Stockholm-LAX profitable? Surely, with Sweden being the 3rd biggest exporter of music, over 100.000 Swedes living in SoCal (as many as in London) - that looks like a no brainer? If flying to Seattle works, logic says LAX would work even better. There are about 3 Swedes in Seattle, in total
Anyone with some inside info why this was shut down?
I also think just based on demographics that SAS should consider a direct route to Santiago considering how many Chileans fled to Sweden in the 70's and 80's. I bet that would work. And tag on a second stop to Rio De Janeiro like they had in the 60's.
Another route I'm sure would work is Miami and San Francisco.
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Hi,
CPH-SEA was closed when LH opened FRA-SEA.
Now we fly our C class pax to FRA and they continue on LH, STAR ALLIANCE!
When LAX was flown it was almost entirely M class pax, cant make money on that. ORD is a much better choice, 3 hours shorter flight time, better yield and its UA's hub for those who wish to go to SFO or LAX.
MIA on the other hand looks like a winner, lets go!
Regards
Heavydane
CPH-SEA was closed when LH opened FRA-SEA.
Now we fly our C class pax to FRA and they continue on LH, STAR ALLIANCE!
When LAX was flown it was almost entirely M class pax, cant make money on that. ORD is a much better choice, 3 hours shorter flight time, better yield and its UA's hub for those who wish to go to SFO or LAX.
MIA on the other hand looks like a winner, lets go!
Regards
Heavydane
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MIA on the other hand looks like a winner, lets go!
Lately guys have been traveling on Condor from Norway to Frankfurt, then to Fort Lauderdale. Some have tried Air Berlin but said it was a bad experience.
Others have used KLM, most folks search price and buys the cheapest ticket and don't care whether they have to stop and change planes.
The perfect airplane for Oslo to Miami would probably be a 757, long enough legs to fly non-stop, and with 188 seats it is medium size.
(What does SAS fly these days? A-340 and or 330?)
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Yup, A330 and A340. And yes, MIA would be the place to go. Norwegian seamen's church in Miami estimated around 3000 Scandi expats in the greater Miami area. If that's not business to be tapped, I don't know what is 
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A lot of passengers does not equate with good yields.
Mainly VFR (visiting friends and relatives) traffic is almost exclusively low yield and bookings are price driven. High yield is business traffic and to atttract this regular frequencies are required, daily on longhaul and two or three daily on short haul. So the large expat Iranian community in SE, for example, although they might fill a daily flight, would not necessarily make it a profitable route.
Mainly VFR (visiting friends and relatives) traffic is almost exclusively low yield and bookings are price driven. High yield is business traffic and to atttract this regular frequencies are required, daily on longhaul and two or three daily on short haul. So the large expat Iranian community in SE, for example, although they might fill a daily flight, would not necessarily make it a profitable route.
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As far as Scandis in South Florida are concerned, I believe much of the community is tied up to the shipping industry. A lot of business folks. Not sure they'd need return flights to Scandiland on a twice daily basis though..
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A lot of passengers does not equate with good yields.
Mainly VFR (visiting friends and relatives) traffic is almost exclusively low yield and bookings are price driven. High yield is business traffic
Mainly VFR (visiting friends and relatives) traffic is almost exclusively low yield and bookings are price driven. High yield is business traffic
High paying Business traffic is great but the industry needs to modify models that survive in worse scenarios.
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But if you're the only provider on a route, you have an USP. You can charge whatever you want for it.
I travel for business all the time, bus since more often than not I pay for it myself, I don't go business (at least not on short routes). But what I do spend money on, is direct routing. I will always chose a more expensive flight that has fewer stops, than a cheaper one with more stops. Always. Air travel has become such a PITA, that that's the only way to do it these days.
That's why it's so frustrating for me many times how few direct routes there actually are in this world. They're still stuck in the hub and spoke way of thinking, especially here in the US. I can't be the only one who can't stand connecting flights and is willing to pay extra to avoid it.
I travel for business all the time, bus since more often than not I pay for it myself, I don't go business (at least not on short routes). But what I do spend money on, is direct routing. I will always chose a more expensive flight that has fewer stops, than a cheaper one with more stops. Always. Air travel has become such a PITA, that that's the only way to do it these days.
That's why it's so frustrating for me many times how few direct routes there actually are in this world. They're still stuck in the hub and spoke way of thinking, especially here in the US. I can't be the only one who can't stand connecting flights and is willing to pay extra to avoid it.
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But if you're the only provider on a route, you have an USP. You can charge whatever you want for it.
Then, if you were the only airline flying out of 'A', and flying were the only way to get out of there, i.e there were no other transport services or accessible airport, then your theory is right, but it remains a theory! If you were the only provider on the nonstop route A-B, but others operate A via X to B, then you have competition and market forces come into play. Business people might pay whatever you feel like charging, but others won't and that will dilute your revenue.
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the ideal and economical route should have 5 flights per week and minimum 3 to break even - rule of thumb.
then you need the right equipment to make the trip as cape correctly stated, since someone's got to pay for the privelige - eventually.
hence the reason for the 320LR etc
there was one scandi airline doing florida with 1 or 2 stops some time ago and if memory is correct it was a MD87.
then you need the right equipment to make the trip as cape correctly stated, since someone's got to pay for the privelige - eventually.
hence the reason for the 320LR etc
there was one scandi airline doing florida with 1 or 2 stops some time ago and if memory is correct it was a MD87.
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I believe it was Transwede, now TUIfly Nordic, that flew to Florida with the MD. There was of course no IFE onboard so they played bingo and such to make time pass, and the captīn was the man with the numbers :-D
Towerdog wrote:
Good idea, we get lots of Scandis visiting South Florida, especially in the winter. Most of them fly Continental from Oslo via Newark, then to MIA or FLL.
Lately guys have been traveling on Condor from Norway to Frankfurt, then to Fort Lauderdale. Some have tried Air Berlin but said it was a bad experience.
Others have used KLM, most folks search price and buys the cheapest ticket and don't care whether they have to stop and change planes.
The perfect airplane for Oslo to Miami would probably be a 757, long enough legs to fly non-stop, and with 188 seats it is medium size.
(What does SAS fly these days? A-340 and or 330?)
Lately guys have been traveling on Condor from Norway to Frankfurt, then to Fort Lauderdale. Some have tried Air Berlin but said it was a bad experience.
Others have used KLM, most folks search price and buys the cheapest ticket and don't care whether they have to stop and change planes.
The perfect airplane for Oslo to Miami would probably be a 757, long enough legs to fly non-stop, and with 188 seats it is medium size.
(What does SAS fly these days? A-340 and or 330?)
