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RAF pilot is to become first non-American to fly Air Force One
This is simply amazing and I wish this Officer all the very best of luck for what is undoubtedly one of the most high profile and stressful flying jobs on the planet. This is great news for the RAF!
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/13...24QwdT1UJfjWs8 |
And why not? We’re on the same side, apparently.
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Originally Posted by MPN11
(Post 10921976)
And why not? We’re on the same side, apparently.
Now all we need is for a USAF Officer to fly Her Majesty the Queen. And maybe Bozzer. |
Originally Posted by BVRAAM
(Post 10921989)
Now all we need is for a USAF Officer to fly Her Majesty the Queen.
And maybe Bozzer. |
Originally Posted by air pig
(Post 10921996)
Well they have in the past commanded RAF Squadrons.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....ed882138e7.jpg |
Originally Posted by MPN11
(Post 10921976)
And why not? We’re on the same side, apparently.
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Reading between the lines, he'll most likely be flying one of the support aircraft like the C-17.
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Originally Posted by Sky Sports
(Post 10922003)
Reading between the lines, he'll most likely be flying one of the support aircraft like the C-17.
Sources say the officer, who has not been named, will begin his attachment by flying or co-piloting some of the other aircraft in the fleet before being placed on the reserve list for Air Force One. 'Air Force One'' is of course, a callsign for when the POTUS is onboard any U.S. Air Force aircraft. Not a specific aircraft type, as it is often incorrectly applied exclusively to the VC-25. |
I suppose the cynic in me sees it as the RAF now see it as safe for him to get a 747 rating now BA are getting rid of theirs ;)
seriously though, congratulations to the individual involved |
VC25 yes, AF 1 not so sure
Perhaps eventually fly VC25 2800 or 2900, but when POTUS is onboard (callsign Air Force 1) not very likely to be allowed to handle the controls. Unless done for diplomatic purposes and even then I would be somewhat skeptical.
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RCAF has had both RAF and USAF on the Squadron that flew the Canadian PM . Generally they would fly all types of missions . Do not remember any restrictions.
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Originally Posted by BVRAAM
(Post 10922006)
Now, I am a bit pedantic and it does irritate me a tiny bit to see 'Air Force One' used incorrectly.... but it's the media and we should be grateful they managed to list aircraft types that actually exist.
'Air Force One'' is of course, a callsign for when the POTUS is onboard any U.S. Air Force aircraft. Not a specific aircraft type, as it is often incorrectly applied exclusively to the VC-25. |
If true, well done for whoever it's to be. But I'm surprised at the 4 decades/1971 bit - I went to the States in 1970 and there had been others on Exchange for many, many years before that. And as it's apparently a new post, I wonder what the quid pro quo is to be over here?
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Originally Posted by BVRAAM
(Post 10921998)
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Originally Posted by ICM
(Post 10922111)
If true, well done for whoever it's to be. But I'm surprised at the 4 decades/1971 bit - I went to the States in 1970 and there had been others on Exchange for many, many years before that. And as it's apparently a new post, I wonder what the quid pro quo is to be over here?
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Straightforward explanation Is exchange posting say to the likes of 89th AW and with that special privileges , TS clearence to fly occasionally the VC-25 pair.
Kind of reminding me of opening sequence of Moonraker with Flt Lt (albeit with Nav Wings co Piloting the SCA) |
Originally Posted by tdracer
(Post 10922107)
I suppose it would been too much to ask for them to have shown a picture of a VC-25 747. The 757 is rarely (if ever) used as Air Force One...:ugh:
Oh, it is... I know for a fact that the 757 has flown over my head carrying the President and the First Lady not too long ago. They were taking off from my local airport and were followed by other world leaders, including Her Majesty the Queen. I was on my way home at the time and couldn't be there to photograph the event. The runway isn't long enough to safely support a 747. |
Is dual citizenship possible as an RAF officer? I would have thought that if he has US citizenship in addition to U.K. , that would go a long ways towards smoothing the path to flying AF One ?
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Originally Posted by hunterboy
(Post 10922228)
Is dual citizenship possible as an RAF officer? I would have thought that if he has US citizenship in addition to U.K. , that would go a long ways towards smoothing the path to flying AF One ?
For an RAF Pilot, yes. For an Intelligence Officer (for example), absolutely not. The RAF Recruitment website is pretty clear on what is accepted for each branch. I presume the Intelligence branches and trades are the exceptions and not necessarily the rule, probably because of the large amount of UK Eyes Only information they will be dealing with throughout their career. I'd imagine the ISR field of the multi-engine stream would be off limits to a Pilot who holds, or has held, a dual nationality, as well... but that's just speculation on my part. |
Hunterboy
I’m a dual UK/CAN citizen (Canadian citizenship attained whilst on exchange in Canada) and it gives me no problems.
BV |
So as far as getting the opportunity to fly AF one, an RAF Officer holding dual citizenship would probably be in a good position I would have thought ?
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Has anyone stopped to wonder whether this Sunday Express piece (rapidly copied by the DM!) is accurate? I would have expected comment from MOD or the RAF but do not see one in the article, and a journalist claiming a "senior source" does not mean the source is actually senior.
Does anyone recall another recent example of a wg cdr exchange flying appointment? The exchange system is balanced by rank and role; as the name implies, it is a 2-way exchange, so presumably we will see a USAF LTC coming to fly here. And all exchange posts are established on the basis that there is some technical or operational knowledge and experience to be gained that will benefit both parties (forces). It all seems a little odd given the consistent 'America first' pronouncements over the last 4 years when this scheme was apparently being developed. If it is true, it's good news, and I hope the selected officer enjoys his or her time at Andrews. |
Allowing for the essential pinch (bucketful?) of salt necessarily associated with any Express article, surely any such development would require that the RAF officer did not have dual nationality and did get to take the controls?
Since we can safely assume that the US and the USAF in particular are unlikely to run out of 747 rated pilots anytime soon, the sole purpose of the exercise would be to show to the world what great buddies we are, and how deep the relationship between our armed forces actually runs. The mood music following last week's events would suggest that such a public display of affection may need to be postponed...... |
Originally Posted by tdracer
(Post 10922107)
I suppose it would been too much to ask for them to have shown a picture of a VC-25 747. The 757 is rarely (if ever) used as Air Force One...:ugh:
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I am told the story is entirely made up, hence no official comment from the RAF.
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Originally Posted by tdracer
(Post 10922107)
I suppose it would been too much to ask for them to have shown a picture of a VC-25 747. The 757 is rarely (if ever) used as Air Force One...:ugh:
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Originally Posted by Fortissimo
(Post 10922302)
...Does anyone recall another recent example of a wg cdr exchange flying appointment? The exchange system is balanced by rank and role; as the name implies, it is a 2-way exchange, so presumably we will see a USAF LTC coming to fly here...
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We shouldn't forget that President Eisenhower on a visit to the UK in August 1959 was flown to and from Aberdeen in a 216 Sqn Comet, pilot S/Ldr P. E. Pullen.
Details here: https://www.pprune.org/military-avia...ml#post5527893 Post #6 https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....399468c843.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....e6e0048ffa.jpg |
Originally Posted by Peter Fanelli
(Post 10922378)
I guess you haven't been paying much attention to the aircraft in the background of many of the Trump rallies over the last few months.
One unique airport driven use was for President Obama visiting Midway island for the Marine Monument dedication. Sure there was a good Gooney bird walk down that day..... |
I'm a lucky civi sod. I've flown airliners for about 30 years. My most precious back seaters were always my family. They got the same treatment as everyone else. No more, no less.
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An Excellent Example of British/American Cooperation
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....2a747f80af.png
Though he never occupied left seat in Air Force 1, at one time the fate of the Free World rested upon Group Captain Lionel Mandrake's broad shoulders! - Ed ;) |
Originally Posted by cavuman1
(Post 10922903)
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....2a747f80af.png
Though he never occupied left seat in Air Force 1, at one time the fate of the Free World rested upon Group Captain Lionel Mandrake's broad shoulders! - Ed ;) |
Biden was said to be joking when he said this. If he wasn't, he may prefer not to have an RAF pilot flying him:
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Originally Posted by tdracer
(Post 10922107)
I suppose it would been too much to ask for them to have shown a picture of a VC-25 747. The 757 is rarely (if ever) used as Air Force One...:ugh:
The AF1 757s are C-32As with Pratt motors. The planes used as AF1 are 09-0015, 09-0016 and 09-0017. https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....510318beda.jpg https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....f282b01047.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....5a4e736979.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....b1f51c6421.jpg |
Originally Posted by hunterboy
(Post 10922248)
So as far as getting the opportunity to fly AF one, an RAF Officer holding dual citizenship would probably be in a good position I would have thought ?
Some excerpts from DoD Instruction 5210.87 for the sea lawyers here: The investigative request shall be processed as follows: E3.3.1. The administrative nickname “YANKEE WHITE” must be stamped or printed in the Remarks section of the DD Form 1879, “Request for Personnel Security Investigation,” for all Presidential support requests that are manually submitted. For those electronic submissions of the DD Form 1879, “YANKEE WHITE” will be typed in item 1 and the form will then be stamped by the Defense Security Service (DSS) upon completion of the investigation. All requests for investigation must indicate whether or not the individual is being processed for a security clearance by any other Department or Agency of the Federal Government. E3.3.2. Scope of investigation required: E3.3.2.1. Personnel assigned to Category One or Category Two (enclosure 2) duties must have a favorably completed single scope background investigation (SSBI) within 36 months preceding selection for Presidential support duties. If an individual marries subsequent to the completion of the SSBI, a National Agency Check (NAC) on the spouse must be conducted. Category One nominees shall be required to sign a tax information waiver form. The Executive Secretary shall process the tax form through the Internal Revenue Service (IRS). PRESIDENTIAL SUPPORT PROGRAM STANDARDS E4.1.1. In addition to the adjudication standards contained in DoD 5200.2-R (reference (c)), individuals under consideration for Presidential support duties are also subject to the standards listed below to ensure that the assignment or retention is clearly consistent with optimum Presidential security and support. The determination must be a common sense judgment based on all available information. E4.1.5. Minimum Requirements for Nomination E4.1.5.1. U.S. citizenship. E4.1.5.2. High degree of maturity, discretion, and trustworthiness. E4.1.5.3. Unquestionable loyalty to the United States. E4.1.5.4. Satisfactory past and present duty performance. E4.1.7. Discretionary Criteria E4.1.7.3. Immediate family are citizens of another country. Immediate family under this Instruction includes spouse, offspring, living parents, brothers, sisters, or other relatives or persons to whom the individual is closely linked by affection or obligation. It must be determined that family members are not subject to physical, mental, or other forms of duress by a foreign power and who do not advocate or practice acts of force or violence to prevent others from exercising their rights under the constitution or laws of the United States or any State or subdivision thereof. |
Originally Posted by TwoStep
(Post 10922493)
I am told the story is entirely made up, hence no official comment from the RAF.
Years ago I flew on a U.S. military crew led by an exchange officer who was an RAF Squadron Leader. He was required to leave the flight deck whenever procedures involving nuke weapons were practiced even though he held a NATO COSMIC TOP SECRET ATOMAL clearance. |
Originally Posted by Airbubba
(Post 10922959)
I presume this administrative nickname will soon have to be changed to something more politically correct in the woke Black Lives Matter era.
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Is it really credible that an RAF pilot who would not be type rated for a 747, let alone experienced, be allowed to even be 1st officer on Airforce One, whereas seconded as a pilot of a C17 is believable.
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Originally Posted by Mechta
(Post 10922914)
Biden was said to be joking when he said this. If he wasn't, he may prefer not to have an RAF pilot flying him:
Joe Biden: "I'm Irish" |
Originally Posted by Deltasierra010
(Post 10923051)
Is it really credible that an RAF pilot who would not be type rated for a 747, let alone experienced, be allowed to even be 1st officer on Airforce One, whereas seconded as a pilot of a C17 is believable.
An E-4 follows the President wherever he goes, its landing location is always classified until it arrives on the tarmac and kept away from the VC-25/C-32. It proved its worth in the immediate aftermath of the 9/11 attacks. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....fa98be99a.jpeg |
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