If you disapprove of the beard policy do not read further....
 

I know it's the Daily Mail so may be "fake news" but is this a step too far or is it another sign of the modern times?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...y-service.html

Your link is goosed. However it is true.

And my 2p, as one of the few serving people on this forum....who actually cares. I don't and have bigger fish to fry, as long as they can do the job I really couldn't care about a hairstyle.

As long as the job is dome properly they shouldn't care much about it, it's not a company trying to sell their image. I guess some captains need to show their rank by shouting and demanding.

It is a great barometer of how lamentable recruitment must be.

I saw CAS's comments on the version I read and it was utterly pathetic PC claptrap.

Having served with the RCAF and transitioned to the private sector, some of the individuals with the hairstyles also sometimes have attitudes and personalities that match the hairstyles.

May as well got the whole hog and allow everything, as long as it fits into a hairnet, like the 1970s Bundeswehr..

Next it will be you don't have to turn up to work in uniform!!

Well they do stifle individuality. :}

I wonder what would happen when you hear the words 'Gas Gas Gas' just tuck the braids and ponytail in and hope for the best.

agreed - is it about how they look or how they fight?

Would that be natural, or un-natural selection?

Not much point in having a SWO now, then. :}

They are unlikely to have braids and ponytails by this stage. My information is that an escalating NBC posture would include the order: "Parade will remove beards, braids, cornrows and ponytails."

Au contraire, Blackadder, I gather RAF recruiting is actually quite buoyant. Personally, I would quite like recruitment of the future CAS to be unconstrained by his or her choice of tattoo, hairstyle or branch. The sooner we get into best person for the job, rather than best pilot for the job, the better.

O ye of short memory. In the 60s and probably before, officers wore civilian clothes watching the afflicted commit sport on Wednesday afternoons. On Saturday mornings too, worked to make up for Wednesday sports afternoons, half the officers would be at work in civies with the rest elsewhere 😀

A braided hairpiece to the bottom of collar could be very popular, bound to wind up a few. Held at the ends with ribbon, Airforce blue of course. 😈

Actually, quite the opposite, he/she can pull some young erk over for not getting his/her corn rows straight and above the determined minimum number required or whatever. Or,, the SWO could be shouting from the Main Guard room "get that that %£*@ing Ponytail tucked inside inside your 'at you 'orrible little person.

I suppose the times they are a changing, Come gather round people wherever ye roam! Michael Whigston was born in the midst of the social upheaval of the 1960s, the radical changes and enmity toward Britain's imperial past which is being revisited with a passion now. Each of the CAS's when I was in the RAF grew up in a world where the British Raj was still the Jewel in the Crown, and they only ever saw a chap with long hair at all if it was a sepia picture of Oscar Wilde or Quentin Crisp.

FB

Or you could have the 1700 Monday beard parade where the SWO (or CWO as in this case) gets everyone who wants to wear a beard to line up with their chit from Wing boss and told to have a shave as they don't meet his standards, or be issued with a beard pass that must not be photographed or ridiculed in any fashion.
We were informed that it was NOT a spectator's sport and our comments and laughter were not appreciated.

Brian W May

OR, it's merely the RAF updating itself to move with the times and you are a dinosaur?

Royal Air Farce springs to mind !!!!!

ptr914

Really? Says a lot about your mind...

And while we are on the subject of outdated nonsense, when will the RAF drop the silly and outdated habit of wearing hats and ties?

pr00ne,

I thought they already had? save for parades and other formal occasions. Another question, why aren't other arms doing the same? Whenever I see any Armed Services on parade, unless full ceremonial uniform is called for ie the Guards, they all wear ties, shirts, polished shoes/boots and yes, hats and shiny buttons. And why not? There comes a point pr00ne where there is no point. I suspect you just want to discard anything with a traditional line to it for the sake of it. Personally, although I jest, as in my previous post, I do actually accept that the times are a changing. But nobody should have anything to fear from those who don't adopt the same style and attitude which woke now demands, we're all different I suppose. Viv la differaunce!

FB

There is absolutely no shortage of those wishing to join him at the moment.

Finningley Boy,

No, no agenda to discard anything with a traditional line to it for the sake of it. The armed forces should be a reflection of the population they claim to exist to serve and defend. I think that they, and the RAF in particular, are doing a pretty decent job of it so far, but there is much much more to be done.

As to there coming a point when there is no point, what on earth do you mean? The RAF does not exist purely to wear hats and silly clothes, nor does it exist to salute and do other silly traditional stuff that is now meaningless and archaic. It exists to deliver air power when and where the Govt decrees.

Imagine if you were devising the armed forces today from scratch. Would you devise a rule that means whenever you come across, or even see, some one of a higher rank you have to put your hand up to your head? I know some say that you are saluting the Queen and not the individual, but the nonsense of that for Junior Ranks is that they do not even salute the Queen, only officers do that. You couldn't make it up.

What was it someone once said about tradition? That it was the bitterness of older men.

Like I said pr00ne, I know I'm certainly a few years younger than you, but I feel perhaps more keenly that my time has come and passed. I'm mystified by all this talk of little metal robots everywhere and artificial intelligence. I suppose when you look at all that Corporal Marsh and his Nissen Huts, Blanco and Kiwi polish are a teeny bit anachronistic.

FB

We do indeed live in unprecedented times as I find myself agreeing with pr00ne! They should have done away with saluting long ago, except perhaps for the Stn Cdr & Air Ranks, and on the parade square. As an aged PAS Flt Lt I could spot the young JOs a long way off trying to discern my rank versus the grey hair & often hedge their bets by saluting, I even once encountered a Sqn Ldr who threw up a salute as at my advanced age I surely had to be at least a Wingco? All of it rather tiresome & frankly unnecessary, you could still be polite & say ‘good morning’, it worked well enough on ops where no one saluted.

I accept the line about reflecting the population they serve, but surely the requirement ultimately to lay down your life means the armed services are fundamentally different to the population they serve. I joined in the 70s when the fashions of the population were also changing rapidly. Standards of hair, dress, deference and so on were unrecognisable to the then older generation but then we took a pride in being different, having different standards and that fostered an esprit that surely is still needed.

By all means evolve and move with the times but I hope the armed services never become indistinguishable from the rest of the population.

Some of the people who sign up you would not want within an asses roar of polite and civil population. Thankfully after a couple of years they are more than able to hold their own because the training and discipline that has changed them. If they have stupid hair when younger it doesn't mean they will when older. Learning is sometimes wasted on youth but most times not.

Military ultimately reflect the population they serve.

pr00ne

Are you against ties in general or just the military; if just the military why should they be singled out for treatment? That said, it was time to leave for me when berets were required for Officers!

Shirts designed to be worm without ties are OK - such as Oxford shirts with button down collars. But the current trend of wearing a normal 'office shirt' with a suit jacket makes you look like some sleazy politician and is deplorably scruffy.

Short-sleeved shirts with ties are ridiculous in my view - but quite common on 't other side of the pond.

Berets? Dear me no - not for officers. Other ranks and French onion johnnies only!

Those with long PPRuNe memorieswill recall that one RAFG F-4 pilot actually gave the reason for his leaving the mob as being due to not being allowed to have long hair.....

And SH mates of course BEags mon brave (despite French epithet, I don't sell onions!)

I left when they abandoned bar books and insisted on cash over the bar.

It's an interesting idea that the military should "reflect the population it serves". I would actually prefer that it didn't! To my mind, it would be smarter if it reflected the job that has to be done.

I am also curious to know what impact removing 'traditions' such as uniform, saluting and other hierarchical manifestations will have on the ranks, as is being suggested in this thread. Have any behavioural scientists been consulted about whether it might lead to dissent and, ultimately, a military force in which it becomes a bit of a gamble as to whether a legal order will actually be carried out?

So what's your view on the wearing of wigs and gowns in court?

Whenever this is discussed I always think of a bit in Robert Graves Great War memoir "Goodbye to all That". Graves was given a break from front line service and was training Canadian troops away from the front, and in parts this went right back to basics, including drill. When the Canadians complained along the lines of "Why do we have to do all this bull, we're not the Brigade of Guards?" ,Graves replied "When you can fight as well as the Guards, I'll go easy on the drill". he also noted that "smarter" regiments, such as the Guards, and his own regiment, The Royal Welsh Fusiliers, suffered far fewer losses from causes such as trench foot and other medical complaints. Being smart does not necessarily mean being efficient, but neither does being scruffy.

Re saluting, as far as I recall in most army regiments it was common practice among officers to salute only the colonel, and then only when first encountering him in the morning. Soldiers saluted officers at all times, of course, and quite rightly so ;)

There is in fact no reason at all to dismantle service traditions and customs, such as many on here have grown up with and recognise. The only argument for the radical changes being authorised at the top of the chain and being defended by some posters is change sake itself, nothing otherwise. Its an attempt to be down with the latest trends, of course the dividend is expected to be an easing of the recruitment crisis which seems to be present. But none of the Armed Forces exist to mimic or struggle to keep up with the latest styles, many of which represent a disagreement with any kind of established authority. But I will point out again, what will be, will be.

FB

O tempora, o mores!

Wrathmonk's point in respect of our trendy barrister is well made.

Glad I left when I did.

What a load of woke clap trap nonsense, not only from the senior leadership of the RAF, but also some of the posters on here. Uniformity in the military has played a vital role in establishing ethos, unity, respect, discipline and the necessary esprit de corp that we will desperately need if we ever find ourselves fighting for our survival again. When I joined the RAF it was like joining a family, and establishing a totally new way of life. When I left it was more like a nine to five job with the bar empty on Fridays, nobody attending dinning in nights, the absolute minimum time at work to get the job done and then as quickly out the front gate as possible. Crew room chat was dominated by airlines, licenses and how to access resettlement courses, even from the JP’s who had only just arrived on their first tour but had somehow been in the RAF for ten years. Basically, it couldn’t have felt less military if it tried.

The RAF has lost its way. And when you get lost you don’t aimlessly start firing off in random directions (as I painfully learnt on my FNT), you retrace your steps to find the path. The RAF should be looking to undo some of the nonsense of the last few years rather than silly ‘virtue signalling’ crap like this.

Further to my ‘Royal Air Farce’ comment the statement below now appears on forces.net:

The Royal Air Force is promoting the use of gender-neutral pronouns to encourage inclusion and diversity across the service.

Alternative pronouns to 'he', 'she', 'him' and 'her' include 'Ze', 'Per' and 'Hir'.

The language system will be launched within the service rank and title protocol, which could have previously seen female officers referred to as 'Sir'.

Under the new environment, a Leading Aircraftman could be referred to as a Leading Aircraft-Per.

I recall that part of the narration by Sir Laurence Olivier, in one of the episodes of World at War, one of the episodes dealing with the USSR, he points out that one of the measures to improve the performance of the Red Army was the re-introduction of Gold Braid, rank insignia, smart uniforms etc as well as hauling back out of the Gulags, those Officers who hadn't been murdered during the purges.

FB

So I suppose next we will be seeing the Station Commander with long hair & earrings, and not a female officer either!!