probably has as much chance of flying again as the ones at Bruntingthorpe!

Is there any truth in the rumour that the RB 211 twisted the fuselage so much that the a/c was a write off ? Also that the contract with MOD did not specify that the a/c be returned in a serviceable condition ?

aa62:

I don't know about the twisted fuselage story. I was at Filton while RR were doing this flying, and certainly we heard that their contract with MoD did not include returning it to the original 4-engined fit on completion of the loan. Who were the smart people who wrote the contract, I wonder?

G-AXLR - originally XR 809

I seem to remember that there was a dispute over the engine winches and who would repair them, hence they were never fixed, they loaned electric? ones to RR who returned them U/S, hence forever and a day after we had to use the hand winches with their design flaw.

Given that 809 was 'returned' in 1975, another background factor is likely to have been that the reduction by half of the Air Transport Force was very much in play then, and it must have been inconceivable that MOD would have funded an airframe refurbishment in those circumstances.

Indeed, ICM, that was when they retired the Belfast. I was the last Flt Cdr Ops on 53, and I was on the last Belfast task on 12 Sep 1976. We all thought if they were gong to get rid of anything, it should have been the VC10 - after all, four good screws is better than a blow job any day....

That was before they thought of making VC10s tankers, of course - they were just airliners then.

airsound

I also flew on 12 Sep 76. Brize - Gutersloh - Brize in XR362 with Herbie Sutcliffe, Al Richey and Paddy Tranter.

Yes Nutty,
I believe a modified Jet Pipe was all that was required, to introduce cold air to the jet stream. That would have reduced noise levels and enabled landing at all EASAland airports...but possibly beyond MOD budgets at the time.

I had a quick look on google. Does anyone have any images of the flight deck and Engineer's panel for the flying test bed?

Just curious to see what they did when changing two engines for one.

Have a look at the link in post #76 and scroll down to the end of the page.

Jhieminga,

Do you know what was the exact cause of the fuselage distortion?

B1, see the earlier links....

.....”One hair-raising flight was the test bed's 44th flight on 7th august 1972. This was the first flight with a new pressure switch to prevent deployment of the thrust reverser on the RB211. With an expected flight time of five hours the aircraft took off laden with fuel. An initial warning light for the thrust reverser was investigated, but the crew decided to continue the flight as they didn't want to dump fuel this early in the flight.

After an initial performance test run at 250 knots at 20,000 feet, the aircraft was being prepared for a second run at 300 knots when the cold stream reverser of the RB211 slid back into the reverse position, sealing off the bypass duct. The effect of this was a reverse idle which produced an initial slight lurch on the aircraft. Shortly afterwards, a more violent lurch occurred, followed by aircraft buffet. There was adverse yaw and roll, and the throttles were closed, initiating a descent before recovering to wings level. Full power was set on the Conways but level flight could not be maintained. The aircraft continued to descend at 2,500 feet per minute as the RB211 was windmilling with the reverser extended.

Fuel jettison was initiated as the equation was quite clear to all on board - the aircraft would hit the ground in approximately twelve minutes unless the weight could be brought down to a value that the Conways could cope with. As the VC10 was aimed at the Bristol Channel, the crew was running through their sea survival kit and ditching drills. As the weight came down, the rate of descent improved, until, at 3000 feet, the aircraft weight was low enough to enable level flight on the thrust available. Fuel dumping was stopped at the coastline and the crew briefed for the approach and landing procedure for this new configuration. A go-around would not be possible with the drag of the RB211 and the available power on the Conways. A safe landing was carried out after a careful, wide circuit.“........

35 years ago, ZA150 arrived at Brize as the very first VC10K3:

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....2b524f2cc2.jpg
OC101 immediately decided that 'Juliet' would be his personal jet - and woe betide any planner who allocated him anything else if 150 was available!

ORAC,

Thank you, I have already read that, but it does not explain exactly how and where the fuselage was distorted

Aah, ZA150. Remember it well. Good pic with some familiar faces there.

I have never found an account that linked one to the other, but according to most accounts the distortion wasn't found until after the testbed's final flight and the reverser incident would appear to be the most likely suspect. There is a firsthand account of that flight here: https://www.vc10.net/Memories/Testflight.html
It could also have been the result of asymmetrical weight, drag or something else, but I haven't found an answer yet unfortunately.

As an engineer I would say it distorted the engine beams or rear fuselage structure where it is attached, the two beams run across the rear fuselage and are the main structural spars of the stub wings, they are also if I am correct fwd of the rear pressure bulkhead as you could see them through the access door behind the mirror in the rear bog. Not a place you want distortion as the fin is also nailed on in that area.

This might help, see

VC10 Engine Installation

quote from a post on the ZA150 farcebook page...

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....61dd374c5c.jpg
From 'The Aeroplane'.

SD:-
You may well say that SD but, despite all the professional input here corroborating your blanket condemnation of those who might differ, I still have a worrying suspicion that this a/c may yet wing its way stateside per the OP, airworthiness issues notwithstanding.

As to the FAA and the Max-8, I believe that abomination is about to be relaunched too. Money talks.

Call me a fool or just plain stupid. I'm quite sure you will.