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The Boss
Does anyone know where/when the practice of calling an RAF Squadron Commander 'The Boss' originated?
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I'd hazard a guess it was 1 April, 1918.
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Err, so what is he/she then?
Interesting first post:confused: |
I first heard it used in the early 80s by the Hereford Gun Club, probably migrated from there.
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In Dizzy Allen's book he says that a book called 'No Orchids for Miss Blandish' was very popular amongst the pilots on his squadron. The book was about gangsters and set in New York during Prohibition. The pilots though this a jolly wheeze and decided to copy the language. A newspaper journalist happened to be around and heard this. He thought it 'jolly good for morale' and published the story.
It may or may not be true: although I guess it's as good a reason as any..... |
Springsteen?
CG |
boss bɒs
noun ....an embellished knob |
Cant talk to you about "Embellish"!
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I remember my father telling stories relating to a Squadron Commander being referred to as Boss after the first time he was seen on a day and initially addressed as Sir (Fleet Air Arm). Not sure we will ever get to the bottom of this one. TN. |
USAAF influence WWII? "overseer, one who employs or oversees workers," 1640s, American English, from Dutch baas "a master," Middle Dutch baes, of obscure origin. If original sense was "uncle," perhaps it is related to Old High German basa "aunt," but some sources discount this theory.
The Dutch form baas is attested in English from 1620s as the standard title of a Dutch ship's captain. The word's popularity in U.S. may reflect egalitarian avoidance of master (n.) as well as the need to distinguish slave from free labor. AMERICANISMS; The English of the New World", M. Schele De Vere, LLD Of all Dutch words familiar to our ear, none has acquired a wider circulation and a stronger hold on our social system than the term boss, derived from the Dutch baas. It had, originally, with us as in its native land, the primitive meaning of “ master,” overseer, or superior of any kind, and retains it to this day in a large measure. Even now a boss shoemaker, or a boss bricklayer means the head of a gang of workmen, who deals their work out to them, and pays their wages, as an English master does to his workmen and apprentices. In this sense it is, even in England, now the cant term, if nothing more, with all mechanics, and can boast high antiquity for such a meaning, since as early as 1679, M. Philipse wrote: “Here they had their first interview with the female boss or supercargo of the vessel,” (Early Voyage to New Netherlands). strangely foreshadowing the “Advanced Female" of the New World. For the proud Yankee, from the beginning. disliked calling any man his master, a word which, as long as slavery existed, he thought none but a slave should employ; and as the relation between employer and employed required a. word, the use of boss instead of master, was either coined or discovered. Thus the word became early a part of the language in Northern and Western States, and Lord Carlisle could enjoy the naive question propounded to him by his stage-driver: “I suppose the Queen is your boss, now ?” In the same sense the slang loving New York Herald said, in speaking of the Pope: “Rothschild. refused to let him have any (money). The fact is, Rothschild is the pope and boss of all Europe.” It is curious that the word has actually found its way into French also, although only as a cant term; for M. Francisque Michel, in his Dictionnaire d' Argot, has : Beausse, un riche bourgeois, terme des voleurs Flamands. It made its way Southward, in America, but very slowly, and reached Pennsylvania only about 1852, with the construction of railways and canals. Since the emancipation of slaves in the South, the negroes also have become too proud to continue their old mode of address, and substitute for it the Northern boss, so that the word may fairly be said to be in universal use all over the Union. It has even been turned into a verb, and to boss is quite a common expression, meaning to direct anything, from bossing a job, that is, to contract and superintend it, to bossing the house, which means in the case of the husband or the wife, as Providence may direct, to rule and manage it. So familiar has the word become, that we are told of a child not five years old put into a corner for quarrelling, who wished to charge his sister with being the aggressor, and said: “ I did not boss the job, it was sister.” ( S. S. Haldeman.) Thus the Dutchman is master in the land after all. |
Baas
Still in use today among the farming community of the Cape Province of South Africa. The coloured labourers on the wine and fruit farms referred to the farm manager or owner as "Baas" in a sign of respect. Since the Dutch East India Company founded the original provisioning station there in the 1600's to revictual Sailing ships travelling to between Europe and the East. . The term has continued in general use to this day, and has travelled across the rest of Southern Africa and elsewhere. From Middle Dutch baes (“master of a household, friend”), from Old Dutch *baso (“uncle, kinsman”), from Proto-Germanic *baswô. Cognates include Middle Low German bās (“supervisor, foreman”), Old Frisian bas (“master”); possibly also Old High German basa ("father's sister, cousin"; > German Base (“aunt, cousin”)). |
OP:-
Does anyone know where/when the practice of calling an RAF Squadron Commander 'The Boss' originated? |
First time I heard a squadron CO being called 'Boss' was in Oct' 68, when with a pilot colleague from 48 Sqn ( Hercs' ) I attended the Tengah Open Day. We were in the 74 Sqn crew room when the CO walked in having just flown the solo Lightning display. 'Great display Boss' shouted Fg Off Dave Roome amongst others. Blimey I thought - our Sqn Cdrs in the transport world are called Sir. I can't recall ever hearing the Boss word used on the Herc' fleet until the time I left at the end of '73.
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Imagegear. Thank you. So....How how long before the Meejah agenda benders define the term 'Boss' as racist? Askin for a friend. |
Squipper, for your friend
The usual "Meejah agenda benders" have frequently "expounded" over many common use terms. But in this case, polite, reasonable and appropriate respect by the people of the Cape for their "baas" who ultimately and consistently puts bread on their table, is instilled from birth. Consequently most remain ambivalent when the "Meejah agenda benders" get revved up and see them for what they are, empty vessels who do not represent real politik. Labourers on wine farms are being enfranchised into the business through the medium of shared ownership with the "baas". Incentivising them and providing growth and security for everyone involved. IG |
In my world "Boss" is generally used by those who have spent time in one of HM's guesthouses.
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oldmansquipper,
"Askin for a friend" Let me fix that for you. "Askin to satisfy my agenda" There you go. |
Originally Posted by Imagegear
(Post 10581533)
Squipper, for your friend
The usual "Meejah agenda benders" have frequently "expounded" over many common use terms. But in this case, polite, reasonable and appropriate respect by the people of the Cape for their "baas" who ultimately and consistently puts bread on their table, is instilled from birth. Consequently most remain ambivalent when the "Meejah agenda benders" get revved up and see them for what they are, empty vessels who do not represent real politik. Labourers on wine farms are being enfranchised into the business through the medium of shared ownership with the "baas". Incentivising them and providing growth and security for everyone involved. IG |
Still used by the medics, junior docs on the surgical team which so effectively re-arranged my plumbing referring to Mr. J as The Boss (when he wasn't around). I think it's used by some police forces as well?
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I had a sqn boss who, one Monday morning, looked quite agitated after I’d asked him how his weekend was. I enquired of him ‘Boss, are you alright?’ He then proceeded to tell me that ‘everyone calls me boss and I find it very disrespectful’. My response was to say ‘right you are sir, I’ll let the others know’. They were, understandably quite taken aback. |
We were on detachment at Edinburgh Field in 1971 having tanked some Lightnings there from Tengah for the 50th Anniversary of the RAAF to do flypasts at Adelaide and Melbourne. At any of the functions/Mess/social events etc the Aussies always asked us why we called the Wg Cdr ‘Boss’. I’d no idea, having called them Boss for at least eight years. (Of course Rule 1 on V Force was fly with the Boss if you could, knowing he’d pinch all the best routes) ! |
So it's really a case of cultural misappropriation? IG |
Certainly widespread in the [civilian] Met Offices embedded on RAF stations ......... right back as far as 1961.
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Wonder if the UK class system and the non commissioned aircrew of old had a role to play?
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(Of course Rule 1 on V Force was fly with the Boss if you could, knowing he’d pinch all the best routes) ! |
megan:-
Wonder if the UK class system and the non commissioned aircrew of old had a role to play? The RAF has/had many issues over the years but class distinction was never a major one. As a predominantly technical Service it drew its personnel from all backgrounds and many from humble backgrounds rose to high rank. Rather than being indicative of the UK class system I would suggest that the voluntary use of the term "Boss" shows an acceptance of his/her authority over you that reflects his/her ability rather than any right of birth. |
I ended up as 214's longest serving member in 1976, having joined it in 1971. Served under four squadron commanders and none of them were ever addressed as or even referred to as "boss". I always associated this with FJ squadrons - don't know how true that was.
There is no point of having power if you cannot abuse it. |
I seem to recall that whilst at Khormaksar on Strike Wing all Sqn Ldrs and above were referred to as 'Boss'.
Aaron. |
I’m sure I remember reading an anecdote in a neighbour’s copy of Tee Emm about a squadron CO asking a mechanic what he was working on, and being dismayed at the Americanisation of squadron titles when said mechanic replied “I’m servicing the prop boss” 🙄 This dates it to the 1940s. |
Railway talk. I was Pilotman on some Single Line Working from New Barnet to Finsbury Park a few years ago, and the Hand Signallers were of African origin. They insisted in calling me ‘Boss’, and I must admit I wasn’t too comfortable about it. I did ask them to call me Andy, but they insisted in calling me ‘Boss’. |
Here is a report from an attack flown on 21 Mar 1945 by FS Marsh Walters of 450 Sqn RAAF: This was my twenty-seventh bombing sortie; by far the biggest I flew on and the only time we operated as a wing with all five squadrons together. At briefing, the Boss told us that we had a special target and that no bombs must go astray under any circumstances. If we were unsure, we had to drop the bombs in the water. He also said that it had to be a complete success because there was no way we wanted to go back for a second attack with all the defences alerted. He then unrolled the map and we saw that the target was Venice, which came as a surprise so we immediately understood why it was essential to be accurate. Each squadron was given a specific aiming point and our target was a 700-ton coaster but, if it was already hit as we dived down, we were free to select another target in the same area. Before taking off we studied a detailed map of the dock area and the layout of the docks was imprinted on our minds. |
Originally Posted by uffington sb
(Post 10582385)
Railway talk. I was Pilotman on some Single Line Working from New Barnet to Finsbury Park a few years ago, and the Hand Signallers were of African origin. They insisted in calling me ‘Boss’, and I must admit I wasn’t too comfortable about it. I did ask them to call me Andy, but they insisted in calling me ‘Boss’. But the more I asked them to call.me Phil the more stressed they got.So from thereon I just tried to make a joke of it. |
Struggling with some of this, thought it was a question why RAF Sqn Cdrs are called Boss.
My first Boss was Sir on first encounter each day then Boss, same on second etc ........... Then, when I was Boss same. |
So Boss is ancient. How about Uncle?
I know there was an attempt to resurrect San Uncles. How about origin? |
How about origin? |
Didn't Shakespeare have people call each other 'nuncle, as in "mine uncle". Not sure whether Shakespeare was in a fast jet squadron, though...
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I had a sqn boss who, one Monday morning, looked quite agitated after I’d asked him how his weekend was. I enquired of him ‘Boss, are you alright?’ He then proceeded to tell me that ‘everyone calls me boss and I find it very disrespectful’. As someone I once called "Boss" explained: "There are hundreds of people you have to call Sir [one would add Ma'am these days], but only one you can call "Boss". And then only if you want to." Works for me. |
I was fortunate enough to visit a certain military ATC unit today. Which included a visit upstairs to local. Whilst chatting with the delightful young lady ATCO, I asked her whether she'd enjoyed being posted to the station. "Well, yes - but I'll have to say that anyway, because the Boss is listening", she answered with a smile. "OK, I'll nip downstairs for a moment", said the SATCO. "Yes, I certainly do enjoy being here", she continued...
Good to know that 'Boss' is still in use as a term of mutual respect for those in charge at the top! |
Always preferred "Boss" to "Sir" in the dim distant days gone by when I qualified for either epithet. Having hung-up the bonedome for the last time in July, there is only one person I refer to now as The Boss - and she's telling me its time for my medication/ snooze/ lunch/ whatever (I still don't really listen). |
Normal mode of address in the RN.
It became a unique sobriquet for Australia's (then) richest man, Kerry Packer, whose pilot called him Boss. In return Kerry would always address his ex-RN aviator Nick as 'Biggles' :ok: |
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