PPRuNe Forums - Iran claims RQ-4 shootdown

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- Military Aviation (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation-57/)

- - Iran claims RQ-4 shootdown (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/622688-iran-claims-rq-4-shootdown.html)

Easy Street

22nd Jun 2019 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by dead_pan (Post 10500219)

Plink a hole in a runway intersection at one of their airbases? V low chance of collateral casualties, unless a planeload of orphans and puppies just so happen to be taking off.... On which topic, were there really no such options?

I think there is plenty of mileage in total restraint. The US can afford to lose more drones without retaliating provided it can produce firm evidence that they were in international airspace. There are downsides for the Iranians to keep shooting at them, too.

racedo

22nd Jun 2019 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy Street (Post 10500215)

Which goes to show what a dilemma the West faces in its policy options. Externally-enforced regime change is (rightly, IMHO) considered toxic by most after the debacles since 2003. But enabling the regime to sit comfortably, as it would do under the JCPOA, is no help to the good people of Iran over the long run. Change has got to come from within to stick, but that’s not to say an external catalyst would be illegitimate. Look at the revolutions that made the West what it is; many were triggered by interference from afar. Trump’s sanctions may be controversial but if they helped to precipitate a counter-revolution then how harshly would history judge them? I don’t pretend to know for a moment what the answer is and am bemused by the absolutely certainty of some that whatever Trump does is wrong wrong wrong.

So when does the West change its imperialism of deciding what is right / wrong and what population can experience genocide this decade ?

Easy Street

22nd Jun 2019 09:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by racedo (Post 10500246)

So when does the West change its imperialism of deciding what is right / wrong and what population can experience genocide this decade ?

I don’t disagree with your general thrust and take the view that people need to fight their own battles, but you shouldn’t make the West out to be uniquely guilty of imposing its values: the Uighurs of Xinjiang and the Christians of the Middle East are both on the path to extinction right now, it’s just that the long game played by the protagonists (including Western ‘allies’ in the latter case) attracts much less attention than the short games which the West repeatedly gets itself tied up in. You can point to sovereignty and the states system all you like but it’s alternately invoked and ignored by pretty much everyone in the bear pit of international politics.

ORAC	22nd Jun 2019 10:08

They’re not sitting comfortably, that’s exactly why they are trying to provoke a reaction - because economic sanctions are killing them.

The USA has, for once, made the sensible decision to use the main weapons they have - the control of the default currency and banking. Which is why Trump was persuaded to back away from a military response - and look implement additional sanctions.

The loss of the Triton cost the USA about $100M in assets, the additional sanctions will cost Iran a lot lot more......

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/21/polit...ion/index.html

falcon900

22nd Jun 2019 10:14

Easy street makes the key point: it is all about the long game. Take a look at the population growth projections by nationality, race , and religion, and ask yourself who is going to win the long game. It shouldn't take you long to work it out, and in some cases, the game might not be as long as you imagine.

Easy Street

22nd Jun 2019 10:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 10500303)

That was my point about the JCPOA and the potentially misplaced criticism of Trump. He is an economic realist by background and seems (along with his generals) to have a better grip of the realities of international politics than Obama, Hillary or the Pompeo/Bolton gang.

Timelord

22nd Jun 2019 11:09

I wonder if GPS jamming or spoofing played a part in this story?

dogsridewith

22nd Jun 2019 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogsridewith (Post 10499870)

Whether vacillation or strategy, it might have been useful to have a lot more than 150 Iranians spending several minutes thinking they were about to get a serving of Shock & Awe. (For one thing, all the other surveillance assets got to see where and how everyone reacted.)

Oops.

The first morning TV news I got on this mission hold included "...planes were in the air." But, in the commander's words, we were "locked and loaded," with press now saying the hold order came 10 minutes before the planned launch. So I guess air-raid sirens weren't going off in Iran.

Would Iran have noticed any of the mission prep?

SASless

22nd Jun 2019 20:58

Notice "Prep"....probably not.....but they would definitely notice the "execution" part of the OP.

AnglianAV8R

22nd Jun 2019 21:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 10500303)

the control of the default currency and banking

Nope. The petro-dollar is past its peak. For example, Saudi Arabia is accepting yuan in payment for oil supplies to China. Russia and China have set up new financial mechanisms for mutual trade, circumventing the USD and associated mechannisms. Times are changing.

All times are GMT. The time now is 15:10.

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