Sadly only some 40 years adrift, Ian, according to the 1879 Royal Naval Uniform Regulations

Jack

You mean I was lied to?

Shock, horror.

Can I claim compensation?

WUH, the proper shirts with detached collars also had double cuffs. The latter secured with plain gold cuff links with chain not bayonet. I stil! have mine.

Really? All ranks?

AOC 1Gp authorised "sans tie" during the 1976 heatwave when I was based at Bawtry. Yours truly got a bollocking from the SWO at Finningley when I had to visit there on an admin matter. He kindly informed me that Finningley was not 1Gp territory and that I should scrounge a tie from someone before venturing onto his domain!

Ian - Don't get "shirty" with me! Over to you to slap in via https://searchworks.stanford.edu/view/3830774 although I regret tat none of the libraries mentioned is very near you....

PN - No, not all, as indicated in the 1879 Royal Naval Uniform Regulations , only men dressed in Class I (Chief Petty Officers) and Class III (Petty Officers and Men Not Dressed as Seamen) - known as "Fore and Aft rig", and the latter including new entry ratings in certain branches - since Class II rig, worn then by Petty Officers and Men Dressed as Seamen - known as "Square Rig" - consisted of course of bell-bottomed trousers and seamen's blue jerseys or white fronts, depending on the time of year and area of service.

"Off the cuff" - double of course! - Class I included certain Petty Officers from 1920, and later all confirmed Petty Officers, Class III no longer exists, and Class II happily lives on, albeit in a rather different form with flared rather than bell-bottomed trousers, and a different style of jumper.

Jack

Yours truly got a bollocking from the SWO at Finningley

Ah, the legend that was WO Johnny Walker. A stickler for dress and deportment.

Picture the scene, the long drag from the Airmens Mess to the hangars. Hundreds of happy airmen walking (smartly) to work past the Guardroom.

One young airman minus beret.

SWO JW "YOU, AIRMAN. STAND STILL"

100 Airmen freeze.

SWO JW "WHERE IS YOUR HEADGEAR?"

99 Airmen sigh in relief.

Guilty Man (in quavering voice) "Sir, I have a chit from the MO"

SWO JW "THEN WEAR THE FU**ING CHIT THEN"

99 Airmen convulsed with laughter.

I didn't realise that although my undershirt for No 6As is exactly that - but worn collarless. in fact, anyone wanting to buy a set of No 6As? Posh white ice cream suit with gold epaulettes, aiguelettes, gold single wing brevet and becketed for 10 medals? Also 3 white meas kits, 2 Khaki service dress, 1 bush jacket,2 x No 1s.....and some blue cotton long sleeve shirts?

Sorry, I think Idi Amin retired a few years ago.

So you if you didn't mind ironing and wanted to be comfortable whatever the weather why oh why did you join the RAF? Can't have been for the uniform as you clearly don't like it. Normally the air-conditioning in the 5*Star deployment hotel would have resolved both the ironing and the discomfort, but perhaps you are SH or dare I say it SARF. Bu then you wouldn't need a short sleeve shirt as either combats or a growbag would be de-rigour. And clearly not fast jet master race as the only possible daily uniform is the already mentioned …… grow bag. So what branch of RAF do you come from ?? Tongue very much in cheek :)

But who would notice! I wore through the seat of my last pair of RAF No 2 trousers a few months before I retired (now that was an office job) and rather than buy a new set which would be gone a couple of months later, I bought two pairs of blue/grey trousers from M&S. As expected, nobody noticed and they were much more comfortable (and washable, kept their crease etc).

I was quite long in the tooth before I discovered that short sleeved shirts were regarded as naff by those in the know (I am talking civvie shirts now). Naff or not, I couldn't give a damn. This summer I have been wearing short sleeved shirts every day for weeks (cant abide tee shirts, polo shirts,etc) and couldn't be bothered with the faff of rolling up sleeves all the time, particularly as the damned things always come down at some stage and have to be rolled up again.

I remember my first Van Heusen collar attached RAF shirts with epaulettes bought in a shop in Cirencester in the summer of 1965 for 42/6d. Much relief that I could get out of No 1, even though we still had to wear the tie in those days.

More like the Lord High Admiral of Ruritania...

TTN, in our club I noticed a few members wore short sleeved shirts. They tended to be office wallahs. Doctors in hospitals also favour short sleeves. OTOH the retired members favoured long sleeves with many with double cuffs.

I think short sleeves are becoming more common.

You will remember however that officers had to wear long sleeves in the tropics after 6. In contrast dark blue would wear white shorts sleeves - no mozzies.