Norfolk
 

Hello

I've recently been on one of my regular jaunts to the delights of north Norfolk, and rather perturbed to discover the skies being remarkably devoid of aircraft.

I realise that since the heady days of the 80's a succession of increasingly short-sighted and penny-pinching politicians have decimated the numbers, but surely a couple of squadrons of Tornados and the Typhoons at Coningsby, plus our colonial guests from Lakenheath, should make more jet noise than I encountered.

The few fast pointy things I saw were all above 8,000ft, whereas they used to regularly cross the coasts of Cley, Salthouse and Holkham around 250 to 1,000.

Anyone able to say why the lack of low flying in this region now?

Having said that, there was a high-ish Typhoon over Felbrigg on Friday with a lovely noisy climb and wing-over! Fantastic sight through binoculars!

Possibly due to the number of offshore helicopter flights to/from Norwich and the GA traffic that frequents the coast and the minor aerodromes. There have been some airprox between FJ and hello/GA over recent years. You might say airmanship is playing a part.

What you probably saw in days of yore were jets transitting to and from the Wash air weapons ranges. Since we don't practice many low level weapons delivery profiles any more there is less requirement for low level transits.

There is also one less Wash weapons range now and Coltishall used to provide a fair amount of trade.

Rest assured the Air Forces of all hues are still able to bomb and strafe the bad guys as accurately as ever (more accurately in many regards). You just won't see them as easily.

BV

Great to hear. I will feel safer than ever using the toilet in the Prussian Queen.

In recent years Norfolk has been reclassified as part of the rotary region of the low flying system. This change takes effect from about 5 miles east of Marham. As a result you will not see much low flying by fixed wing in Norfolk other than for occasional specific exercises.

That's only true at night. Fixed wing LF is still possible by day but for reasons already given it's been on a long-term decline. Another factor is that with LF being further down the priority list of things to train for, crews try to do what little LF they have time for in rather more challenging terrain.

I've recently got into watching one of those on line radar sites, and filtering out all but military movements, there isn't a lot flying most days.

There isn't alot on the ground these days as well!

They have made some lovely bird sanctuaries on the N Norfolk coast and a US helicopter was downed by a goose a few years ago at Cley with multiple fatalities, since then low flying over the wash seems to be less.

Memories of Eastern Radar in the 70s, when the skies were solid aluminium. But times change.

What did I have to deal with back then? Coltishall, Wattisham, Bentwaters, Woodbridge, Lakenheath, Mildenhall, Honington, Wethersfield, Sculthorpe, Oakington, Wyton, Alconbury ... and feeding the stack for Upper Heyford. Did we do CAC to Coningsby as well?

One weeps, nostalgically.

Thanks for the replies chaps.

@MPN11 oh for a return to those days! Warthogs, Jags, F-111s, Canberras, Phantoms filling the East Anglian skies with the sound of freedom.

I guess the odd high flier and a few helos is the best we can hope for over north Norfolk these days then.

Lord Riot, you've hit the nail on the head. The shrinking nature of inventoried RAF aircraft is the reason why you don't, more often, hear the 'sound of freedom' in the skies of much of the UK.

It was mainly F-100, F-4, F-111, Lightning, Canberra, Varsity and the assorted Mildenhall collection in my time! Jaguar and A-10 came later!!

I remember the F-100 had some nasty failure mode that required an immediate diverse recovery. Details lost in memory cell somewhere. Something akin to Hunter 'turret drive failure', but worse? Oil issue?

Move to Downham Market. Eagles from Lakers and Tiffs from Coningsberg doing doggers several times a week, plus Tonkas (not doing doggers).

Working at NWI, as I do, the place was drowned in F15 noises for what seemed a good portion of last week. Could hardly hear the ratchets on our socket drivers!
We get the (very) odd A400M pass by but haven't even heard a tonka or tripehoon for ages.

Northumberland and even the Scottish Highlands are the same these days - back in my youth you would see several aircraft per hour. These days, lucky if you see one a day.

As Rigga rightly mentions, F15s doing ACT over the top of a major regional city is not uncommon. Seeing the odd Tornado and Tiffie do approaches into NWI (I have a nice line office window to see them Rigga, you back on the shop floor in 3,7 or 8? Need to eyeball some time). The 15's may be angels one five, but by hell the F100s make a racket at max dry. Not uncommon up at Wells-next-to-the-sea to similar and Tornado/Tiffies at medium level. Haven't seen a low level pass by anything in Norfolk for donkeys..

I bet the skies were busier when this film was made >>> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...ng_to_Wing.ogv

Loved the video link. Conked out at 7 minutes 55 seconds though. The jet sound effects were obviously added by a beginner. :ok:

And I do wish that, sometimes, they would go and play over their own homes when turning fuel into noise, nice to watch but not so nice to hear when trying to hold a conversation... now if them engines were merlins...

The joys of being in Quarters at Waddington ... you could hear, smell and feel the Force :)

Was putting my little bird to bed a couple of weeks ago in Sth Norfolk (an ex B24 base), when the sky was suddenly full of screaming - 2 x F15s or Tiffies in a turning fight for 5 mins. Good entertainment.

I've been told by one 'in the know' that Lakenheath's F15 and Coningsby's Typhoons will come and play over Norfolk if the weather offshore is above certain limits. All to do with survivability if they had to jettison the jet.
Maybe it's also got something to do with the distance between the new SAR bases, now Her Majesty no longer supplies the service?

All the same, we still get F15's and heavies inbound to Lakenheath and Mildenhall trundling overhead. Long may it continue!

I loved the sonic booms heard when sitting on a quiet North Norfolk beach. Obviously training over the North Sea.

Can these 'booms' still be heard frequently these days ?

North Norfolk coast, the best in the UK :)


coldair

There was a time in the 80s when the RAF seemed to spend much of its time dumping aluminium over Norfolk.


Mind you bliss was living in Lt Snoring and having my dayboat on a £10 a YEAR mooring in Morston Creek

"There was a time in the 80s when the RAF seemed to spend much of its time dumping aluminium over Norfolk."

Also in the 50's when the Sabre's were there. My father used to collect some of it for re-use.

I've just arrived home from several days away in the area of Kelling - Nothing over the weekend, obviously, but a few observations for Monday.....

Constant (F15) fast jet noise from 0830L. Saw one or two...

While crabbing at Blakeney, a US (it had aux tanks?) C130 flew east to west and orbited Blakeney.

Walked from Kelling to Weybourne in the afternoon. The whole time a Typhoon was in a holding (CAP?) pattern at about 5-6k before departing east.

0045L Tuesday morning a helicopter, assumed to be military (nowt on the tracker for offshore or coastguard) overflew the cottage and made the windows rattle. Returned at 0130L.

I hadn't been to Norfolk for some years, and it cheered me up no end.

DH

I wonder how much of this is down to simulators?
I heard two rumors. One that Challenger 2 tank crews were going to mothball their real tanks and do the majority of training in sims, the tanks would only come out for a war. The second rumour was that you could now fly an entire OCU course in a sim ?

Sounds like I picked the wrong week! Good spots those old chap, though 5-6k is still rather high.

I remember many moons ago walking along the shingle beach at Salthouse and 4 A-10s circling and carrying out mock attacks over the slacks down to about 400ft. And three 56 sqn Phantoms in loose v-formation low over Kelling Heath. Miss those days.

Have a look at the Notams for this area on weekly basis. Exercises at Sculthorpe USAF C130 and Ospreys many days into late evenings. Often Hawks etc involved with mock attacks on Sculthorpe at other times. Also tactical refuelling practice for Lynx, Chinook etc at Little Snoring from time to time and helicopter exercises at Weybourne. Live at Little Snoring and pretty busy most evenings. What happens when USAF moves to Germany from Mildenhall is another question.

Thanks, that sounds great!

Last night UH-60 Black Hawks (pair) and also Apache. No Osprey for a few days.........

Also Atlas during the day (high) and a pair of F15's doing ACM over Dereham.

Definitely not as much fast jet at Low Level nowadays though IMHO.

Arc

Eastern Radar
 

If I remember, Coningsby wasn't active during my time at Eastern (1966-68). I'm not sure if it was when I returned from Tengah to Marham in '71 either. But I'll never forget the skies filled with shiny Aluminium from EGUN and EGUL recovering through the battle area. We had to use remote type 82 to see through Eastern's overhead.

C model eagle being giving a bit of birch just now north east of Swaffam. Looks like a gh sortie, lovely views through bins of spiraling dives, climbs, and general aviator enjoyment...

..just had a pair of strikers transit at @500'due South and now tommy Tornado is doing aeros over M'ham..do hope it's not someone's last trip...

Spend a lot of time in north Norfolk and not a lot happening other than the McAully Flight at Little Snoring.

That's why your name rings a bell, although I didn't go to Watton (from Tengah via Sopley) until Spring 70. You must have scratched your name on the crewroom wall :)

Now ... you had a remote T82 display at Marham? Obviously Midland's, but never heard of that facility!

robertfauchon
 

Re Coningsby,

I was sure I'd been there in '70 - checked my log book, 3rd May positioned from Fairford, 4th Coningsby to Akrotiri, 5th did the return, 6th Coningsby to Akrotiri, 7th Akrotiri back to Fairford. We were moving ground crew and equipment for a Phantom squadron detachment to Akrotiri.

Many years later I was reading "Bugs'' Bendell's memoir and he mentioned the same detachment while a Flt Cdr on 6 Sqn. Just taken his book off the shelf and he was on the 1st OCU course which started at Coningsby in the autumn of '68.

A Vulcan wing ( 9,12 and 35 Sqns ) had been there until Nov 64 when it moved to Cottesmore. I don't know if Coningsby was active between Nov 64 and late 68.

Lived at Lt Snoring in the 80s, next door to the old chapel. My friend and much lamenter Peter Charles was air farming still and fettling older aeroplanes and Henry Labouchere would drop in in his Tiger Moth. Now the Light Aeroplane Company is operating from there. I wonder if the church still has the boards commemorating the wartime Mosquito squadrons that operated from the airfield

Seeing as Norfolk has now extended into Lincolnshire, can anyone claryify the history of Coningsby?

I was posted in to Coningsby in October 1956. The station had been closed for upgrading to V-Bomber standard.

We had 57 Sqdn posted in with B2 Canberra's, to 'work up' the station. In the following 12 months I, a Radar Fitter, attended a Victor course at Gaydon and started doing 'V-Bomber Equipment' courses at Yatesbury.

On return from the 1st of these courses, I was posted to Transport Command!

This was to RAF Liaison Party Istres, so I was real chuffed and didn't care what was happening to Coningsby.

I later returned to Bomber Command, 214 Sqdn Valiants at Marham, and Coningsby had dropped of the map.

After some sort of gap, I heard that Coningsby hosted various a/c from Lightnings to Vulcans, what happened while I wasn't looking?

Coningsby was upgraded and extended to a Class A V bomber base in the late 50’s with the standard 9,000 ft runway, standard H shape dispersals and a Gaydon hangar. A Vulcan B2 wing was formed in 1960 with 9, 12 and 35 Squadrons. The station was selected as the UK TSR2 base and the Vulcan wing transferred to Cottesmore in 1964. Coningsby then went on care and maintenance as it was prepared for the TSR2. It was during this period that the large Aircraft Servicing Pan (ASP) was built in front of the Gaydon hangar.
When TSR2 was cancelled all work stopped until it was selected as the UK F-4M Phantom FGR2 base, the OCU arriving in 1968 and the three squadrons 6, 41 and 54 the following year.