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-   -   IAF F-16 with Stunner as AAM? (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/595391-iaf-f-16-stunner-aam.html)

ORAC 2nd Jun 2017 06:04

IAF F-16 with Stunner as AAM?
Alert 5 Ľ Israeli F-16I carrying Stunner missile - Military Aviation News

An Israeli Air Force F-16I has been spotted carrying the Stunner interceptor from the Davidís Sling air defense missile system.

Israeli Stunner: The future of US AAMs?



"....Operating at Mach 7.5 speeds and with a cruising range of 300 km, the Stunner missile is designed to intercept the newest generation of tactical ballistic missiles at low altitude, such as Iskander, using an on-board dual CCD/IR seekers to distinguish between decoys and the actual warhead of the missile, in addition to tracking by Elta EL/M-2084 Active electronically scanned array multi-mode radar. The multi-stage interceptor consists of a solid-fuel, rocket motor booster, followed by an asymmetrical kill vehicle with advanced steering for super-maneuverability during the kill-stage. A three-pulse motor provides additional acceleration and maneuverability during the terminal phase. David's Sling became operational in April 2017".......

T28B 2nd Jun 2017 13:27

Does it get to Mach 7.5 without the booster from the SAM system?

dead_pan 2nd Jun 2017 13:34

Where are we looking - the wing-tip mounts?

fleigle 2nd Jun 2017 14:54

It appears to be the white-nosed one, based on the fin positions on the body with reference to the ground-launched pic in the Wiki reference.
BTW, what are those "embolisms" behind the air intake?

Rhino power 2nd Jun 2017 15:40

Originally Posted by fleigle
...It appears to be the white-nosed one...

The white nosed missile is an AIM-120, it's the one on the other wing tip with twin rear fins

Originally Posted by fleigle
BTW, what are those "embolisms" behind the air intake?

Since it's an F-16I Sufa, the intake bulges, among others, contain 'undisclosed equipment' specific to Israel, similarly the F-16D 'Barak' has a number of intriguing bulges too...


Ewan Whosearmy 2nd Jun 2017 15:48

Originally Posted by fleigle (Post 9790322)
It appears to be the white-nosed one, based on the fin positions on the body with reference to the ground-launched pic in the Wiki reference.

No, it's the missile on the F-16's *right* wingtip (the missile on the left, as you view the photo).

glad rag 2nd Jun 2017 16:08

Where's the other half of the booster?

atakacs 2nd Jun 2017 16:59

Ok I really don't know much about military hardware but are we to believe that these small missiles can do Mach 7 over 300km, complete with steering, integrated warhead etc ? They seem quite small to pack so much capacity

walter kennedy 3rd Jun 2017 02:06

good point - Hollywood syndrome?
BTW is that an arrester hook? - who's carrier would they be using?
I think those bulges are for the pilots balls.

Rhino power 3rd Jun 2017 02:34

Originally Posted by walter kennedy
BTW is that an arrester hook? - who's carrier would they be using?

Yes, it's an arrester hook, used on runways with a RHAG or similar arrester gear during emergency/precautionary landings (hydraulic failure etc) , most FJ's have one, they're not the exclusive reserve of carrier based jets you know...


ShotOne 4th Jun 2017 05:37

Atakacs has a point. How does it do all that with four times the published range of the larger AMRAAM...and why does it look like it's been dropped?

ORAC 4th Jun 2017 06:43

Israel Is Testing An Air-To-Air Variant Of Its Dolphin-Nosed Stunner Missile - The Drive


".... Stunner has a three-pulse motor that outputs different thrust levels during different portions of its flight profile. In particular, it provides added acceleration and maneuverability during the missile's terminal attack phase. The Stunner carries no warhead, instead it is a hit-to-kill system, so the missile can be built more compact and lighter, and more of its internal space can be used for fuel than a traditional anti-air missile that carries a heavy blast fragmentation warhead.

Above all else, the Stunner is unique because of its guidance system. The missile uses three major sensors to guide it toward its target and to pulverize it. A data-link provides the missile with mid-course updates so that it can come within range of activating its novel dual-mode seeker. The missile has a unique, canted "dolphin nose," which came to be as the result of the demands of fitting both an electro-optical/imaging infrared sensor and a active radar sensor in the compact nose section of the missile.".....

ShotOne 4th Jun 2017 08:37

How unusual for ppune, a complete straightforward answer. Thank you, ORAC

dead_pan 4th Jun 2017 09:20

So basically we're looking at the terminal phase portion of the missile? As others have noted I struggled to imagine the missile pictured reaching out to 300km on its lonesome.

What's the range of the F16? ;)

ORAC 4th Jun 2017 10:43

We are looking at the mid-flight cruise and terminal component of the ground based missile. The question being how much, if any, range is lost by replacing the boost motor with the kinetic energy provided by the launch aircraft height and speed.

If you half the weight by eliminating the warhead and shrinking the size of the missile, but keep the same fuel load, do you double the range over a similar missile - or does reducing the overall drag give you even more range? If I remember correctly, for every pound of primary structure saved the overall weight of an aircraft or missile can be reduced by around 10 pounds. The weight of the equivalent AIM-120 WDU-33 warhead is 50lbs, out of a total weight of 335lbs. Lots of room for additional fuel.

Of interest in the article I link to above which suggests that the smaller size of the Stunner and its lock after launch make it a match for the F-35, with 6-8 being able to be carried internally, doubling its air-to-air payload.

Just This Once... 4th Jun 2017 18:56

The joy of all that fuel and little else beyond the guidance package, is that it dumps the majority of its weight during flight.

The range will still be a fraction of that achieved in its original role as the target will not be doing so much of the work. Still, a multimode missile that goes quite far, quite fast and has significant end-game energy is nothing but reassuringly nasty - if you are on the correct side of the trigger press that is.

Lordflasheart 5th Jun 2017 08:34

Perhaps the Slammer doesn't have a ballistic mode ?

BVR to become BRR ?

beardy 5th Jun 2017 12:52

Can we stop calling it a missile, this is a hitile.

ORAC 5th Jun 2017 14:59

Designed to hit rockets only slightly larger than itself fired from Gaza and Lebanon. An aircraft should be a doddle..

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