goldcup, I can assure you (as can the 747 captain in question), that I'm telling the truth. I was astonished that ba should have poked its nose in to the site in question.

But keep posting your malicious slander as you wish - water and ducks' backs spring to mind...

Hueymeister, I invite you to swivel on your extended digitus secundus!

I will defer to the Aircrew Handbag Squadron and unsubscribe for this Thread.

Honestly, girls :(

BEagle,

On the subject of "malicious slander"', would you care to explain why you think it is accpetable to repeatedly use the term "mercenaries" to describe serving members of the reserve component of HM Forces?

Aìr Cadet Visit Bitch duties ? Nice to hear the young are thought well of.Dude.

Well I started this thread as a light hearted attempt to maybe offer my services again should the RAF find themselves short of pilots! I would of course need time to be wheel chaired out to the aircraft!! Seems I stirred up another hornets nest.....most of which I don't even understand! So nothing changes 😎

If you search for UK Armed Forces Personnel Statistics you'll find the official numbers for at least the last two years. Worth a read, we are losing aircrew and ground crew at a rate great than intake. If you remember that it takes a few years to gain appropriate experience then all three services are in the pooh.

If the Voyager force keeps haemorrhaging pilots at the rate I'm told it currently is and is forcast to, "mercenaries" will be the only ones left to fly the aeroplanes.

At least the RAF will then have one fleet manned by experienced pilots who aren't hacked off by meaningless "career enhancing" secondary duties, get paid an industry standard wage, and are employed to first and foremost actually fly aircraft.

Perhaps if those Ts and Cs could be extended to full timers, less would leave.

The stats kindly published on the .gov.uk site don't go into such detail as pilot numbers, but may be of interest if you haven't seen them already.

Bob (V)

Late to thread but just wanted to say nice post and repeat an anecdote that I've posted before. Going through SNCO rearcrew (Nimrod OCU) training in 1976, I was cornered in the scruffs bar (Sgts Mess, RAF St Mawgan) by a FS Air Eng (he wasn't even that old) and lectured for hours on end about the state of the RAF and how it was all going to ratpooh.

It's just something some people have to do.

I was in 27 years (75-03); some stuff never changed, some changed out of all recognition.

It was **** ing great though...and I bet it still is.

Not so grumpy, old fat ****er.

Setting aside the rose-tinted glasses for a moment, perhaps the biggest observed change from the days when the more senior personnel moaned about it all going wrong before eventually leaving, is that the more senior people are now watching the new blood haemorrhage well before they ever become the old and bold.

The young should be having the time of their life (as I did) but are just beating a path to the door. That is quite a change.

JTO,

An element of what you mention was an intended result of the run up to NEM and AFPS 15. The guys are inculcated through training with disparate sign on periods that the military is not necessarily a job for life, and many see an initial option point as just that, especially those with marketable skills outwith BRITMIL. An unintended consequence is probably that conditions of service, NEM becoming a reality and the plethora of other 'changes' have encouraged individuals across a swath of trades/occupations to leave before the system was expecting them to.:(

So glad you didn't use your ATPL, too. It is just possible, although unlikely, ( my company was very choosey in its pilot selection) you might have been my whinging F/O ( the vast majority of our f/os we're far from whingers) on a 10 hour sector to MCO often followed by some free time in the sun, with a very nice hotel, breakfast included, excellent allowances and a guaranteed seat for my wife when she chose to come along ! ( In a very pleasant 767 or a , then, brand new 757 with their superb flight decks). Oh yes, and a salary comparable to an AVM and a pension FAR better than that of an AVM!

Having PVR,ed many years ago life just got better and better, you don't know what you missed !

The issue is are that pilots are pilots wherever they work and pilots are in short supply. My company have some of the best terms and conditions in the business, but we are losing pilots almost as fast as we can train them and we have a 10% expansion planned for the next 9 months. At a meeting about this earlier, I had to show some of my colleagues an e-mail I received this morning from on of the contract agencies offering a package just short of half a million US dollars a year. The shortage has created a bidding war. The RAF will not be immune.

Cash talks, BS walks.

Retired BA,

I'm pleased your choices worked out for YOU. Such choices have not and will not be as applicable to many others. Money isn't everything; TOS are relative to one's circumstances; motivations vary (the thrill of flying a helicopter on ops, intercepting a potential air threat etc).

Peoples' reasons for not joining an airline are just as valid as those for and should be viewed as their point of view and not whinging per se.

I sincerely hope your health remains for long enough to enjoy that pension....

ISTR that a shortage of pilots around now was predicted a few years ago..................

Agency based in Nigeria perhaps? Did they ask you to send US$50,000 in advance to sort out contract and visas, refundable once you start work?;):ok:

Probably not. There are plenty of Far East contracts of high value. I recently walked away from a perfectly respectable job application worth $25000 pm. This included everything - salary, housing and travel allowance, but tax free and 4 on 2 off.