@ Nugget90 ... a senior RAF Regt officer of my acquaintance did his full career to 55 without a single medal. He was either 'wrong place wrong time', or 'not long enough' ... missed the Silver Jubbly, gone before the Golden one, etc etc. But then there Air Officers back then with nothing, so I didn't feel left out ;)

@ Old-Duffer ... indeed, an officer's Good Conduct is implicit, as I noted earlier.

Being involved with the RAF post-retirement in 94, I was staggered to see the collection of medal/ribbons people has earned. There was a 'sea change' in Military involvement that many of us avoided, or were too old to participate in. The guys earned theirs the hard way - I did nothing special for 30 years, but I got my Vet Badge.

SL, of course, brain fade, Kuwait was '61, likewise Greece and Palestine were also pre- '62.

I mentioned Belize from a briefing by the guy on Ascot Ops that night when it blew up. The initial reaction was Where? Same with South Georgia I guess.

Nugget 90 It seems others - in particular RAAF - were awarded the clasp, but they subsequently had it removed :eek: and replaced with the Vietnam Medal, leaving only AATTV as recipients.

Wiki (usual caveats!) has it thus:

MPN

One hates to disagree with Old-Duffer, but one knows of a number of officers who have been Court Martialled and yet not dismissed the Service. Surely they would not qualify for a LS&GCM??

I was privy to quite a lot at that time and I recall an edict that said something along the lines that 'It's now about getting medals on chests' when the NATO Balkans medal was authorised. That mentality has grown and there has been some unfortunate medal collecting over the last decade. I have witnessed considerable rotation of Army personnel through theatres for just over 30 days which made sure that the rear party never had to look out of place. RAF Sqns were not immune either. Various 'studies' always seemed to need to last just over a month in theatre too. IMHO it rather degrades the value if some of the rows of campaign medals we see today have been awarded for 31 day stints. Too many people judge by the number of medals not by the way they were earned.

Oh Goody! Another round medal (LS& GCM) to add to the constellation that I have. Bloody expensive to get both sets mounted and 5 - yes 5 - sets of ribbons to be updated on uniforms various. And in my last tour, too.

Actually, irrespective of the large number of medals SP have these days (and the churn of SP is such that the numbers of those with medals form the Balkans, for example, is rapidly diminishing), I think a Long Service medal for Officers is, err, long overdue

Ah yes Rarely,


I recall a line in the book '101 Nights' by Ray Ollis. A pompous career sqn ldr says to F/S navigator, something about the amount of flying. The nav, who has a BEM for gallantry, replies: 'Sir, it's not how many hours you've got but what you've got in to the hours'.


Returning to the post above and TTH's comments about officers who have been court martialled but not discharged, perhaps a medal based on 'good conduct', rather than exclusively service, needs to differentiate between disciplinary action for a 'technical offence' and something which calls the officer's honesty/integrity to be questioned. Thus Flt Lt Buggins is guilty of - say - a low flying offence. However, Flt Lt Snooks makes inaccurate claims for boarding school allowance. The former says a lot about Buggins maturity but Snooks honour is shot to ribbons. Snooks would not get the medal but Buggins probably would. Someone will mention 'rehabilitation of offenders' but part of t he punishment with which Snooks must live in the service is not getting the gong. Hence, my personal preference is for a service medal and not a good conduct medal. This avoids the argument about arbitrating in individual cases.


Old Duffer

Whenurhappy

... damn' cost of miniatures too...

But, as I have heard said (tongue in cheek) at the Secret Hampshire Helicopter Base (where there are many of another shape)....:ok:

TTH,


My thoughts exactly. If a casual observer couldn't determine from my rank, thinning and greying hair - as well as a collection of campaign medals going back 20 years, and another awarded in 1987 - that I'd served for quite a long time, well, what's the point? At least it will be a proper medal - silver, the Queen on it, etc. Not like the NATO medals...

Tongue in cheek my @rse. Next you'll be telling me Chinook drivers are not w@nkers........:)

Indeed. I had the misfortune, as his Sqn Cdr, to charge and then refer to the Stn Cdr one of my JOs for Court Martial. But then has was a former cpl. ;)

Survived and made sqn ldr, to my amazement, given the offence (which I shall not reveal, but which was most inappropriate behaviour).

Not trying to sound too eager, but has a DIN or somesuch been issued about a Hofficers' LS&GCM?

After an email from the Worcester Medals Service I looked up the Government website to find the criteria for the extension period for the South Atlantic medal.

Surprisingly they have cocked it up. The extension is to 21 Oct 1982 when Mount Pleasant airfield opened.

As the nav on the first aircraft to land at MPA on 1 May 1985 I know they are wrong.

They probably mean Stanley airfield.

Don't think you were on the first aircraft to land at MPA, went there many times before FW in a CH47!

Went in with nothing - came out with nothing.

Over a period of several months, being almost crisped up by some decidedly unfriendly nocturnal visitors. Filling and stacking mags so fast my fingers were raw just before being told by a (smart) Wupert, "your position is untenable and we won't be coming back for what's left - I suggest you leg it back to camp chop-chop and answer the challenges carefully".:eek:

Made me think that a few months in central stores for a gong would have been far more relaxing.

Imagegear

Quote:

---

Cyprus 1963-64
Those servicemen who served in Cyprus during the period 21 December 1963 to 26 March 1964 will be awarded the General Service Medal with clasp “CYPRUS 1963-64”.

---

I can't remember what happened on the 26th March 1964, but I do know why they have chosen the start date.

'Cos I was Orderly Cpl at Akrotiri that day. :ok:

It was the Saturday before Xmas, and Cpl's Club Xmas Dance and Draw. An event that usually went on into the wee small hours. But I was tasked with shutting it down at 23:00 so that all the LoP's could be home in Limassol before 23:59.

It was the day the Greek Cypriots & Turkish Cypriots started violently disagreeing with each other.

Now a question that TTN might be able to answer, will my wife qualify? She'll be really narked if I get a GSM and she doesn't.

Well now Ian, that depends if she was serving in the armed forces in Cyprus during the dates stated, or not. Obviously she wasn't your wife at that stage if she was serving, as those were the days when women had to leave the service before they got married (as Mrs TTN will testify!) But as far as I know, the qualifications for the award of campaign medals apply equally to men and women.

One interesting case is the award of the Naval General Service medal, bar "Trafalgar" which was awarded to a Jane Townsend, who was on board HMS Defiance during the battle. Presumably she was overlooked when the order "show a leg" went out before the ship sailed! Another is the award of the same medal with the bar "1st June 1794", which was awarded to Daniel Tremendous Mackenzie, who was born onboard HMS Tremendous at the height of the battle. The medal was not awarded until 1848, when he was 54, but it was backdated to the day of his birth! Again, what his mother was doing onboard is unclear!

TTN

She was 'a dependent of a member of the force in Cyprus', so obviously won't qualify, but ironically she heard more gunfire then me!

I used to leave her in the hiring in Limassol every day, while I went to the safety of the SBA.

In my present location, hot and humid, the slack handful of Army officers wear their ribbons on broaches on their Tropical Dress, on a daily basis. I've spent a few years in warm and sunny climates, but this is the first time I've seen ribbons worn on shirts. I suspect it's a local thing...has anyone else encountered this? Personally, I think it looks quite smart, but the RAF would then need to introduce a metal brevet...cue new thread, I suspect.

Everyone on exchange in Oman does that (or did anyway).

Well, that's interesting. As SRAFO (single RAF officer) I might introduce it...to myself!

They were wearing Omani uniforms though.

Ah, OK - of course. Hmmm. Might seek higher guidance.

Sorry, probably should have made that clearer in the first post.

TTN, further to Ian's, I was in a little village near Limasol, it is in Limasol now, in 1973 when the Greeks had a dress rehearsal for the invite to Turkey for round 2.

After the first couple of bombs we just used the excuse of the disturbance and then went to sleep.

Next day we drove round town rubber necking :)

Replacing LS&GCM
 

As ever our French friends set us an example we might wish to follow. 20 years military service is recognised by admission as a Chevalier of the Legion d'Honneur (titre militaire). This would equate to something like MBE (military division). Of further note, all must enter through this 'door' : ie you can't be a officer (officier) or commander (commandeur) until you have been a chevalier.

Admission is normally based on a simple application stating that one has completed the necessary 20 years. If your conduct has been good enough to still be in then award follows. Subsequent promotion requires a citation of some further merit which might include time or specific action, or both.

It would not be difficult to adapt the Order of British Empire (Mil div), replacing the LS&GCM, including officers (and getting more ORs into the Order).

Regards
Batco

medals on shirts
 

Wearing medals on shirts is nearer to us than Oman.

Firemen wear their Long Distance medal (and presumably any others they are entitled to) as an enamel brooch on the working shirt. Clearly the normal ribbon would not stand up to a daily soaking.

Chinook, ok, I do know the C130 flight checker was not allowed to dirty the tarmac with mud or rubber.

As we were the proving flight before the 'official' first flight and opening I didn't see the point. The captain even did an autoland even though it was not cleared; the same captain that did a short landing at Lyneham.

I really don't think so - not in military uniform. Next step would be to cover the ribbons in clear plastic, as some republics do. Terribly outre, I'm afraid.

Given that the locals here are dressed up like, err, Christmas trees (if they had them, of course) I might go along with local British Army practise and wear ribbons on my shirt. Sadly the Bush Jacket is an obsolete piece of kit; I soooo wanted to dress like Roger Moore...

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/n...litary-service

New LS medal to be auth'd for all ranks....

Mum ... that says 'Nice for the VR' after 10 years.

Oh, and possibly 15 years for Regulars?

What about the regulars after 30 years full-time commitment? Will I get a gong after all? Or TWO???

(I bet it won't be backdated, so neither of us will qualify)

Bu&&er!!

Next week I pick up 2 x No 1 tunics; 2 x No 6 tunics and a ribbon bar for No 6A (yes - look that one up); as well as remounted full size and miniatures. At not an inconsiderable cost. Which I will have to repeat when this turns up in the post. So back to the tailors (who must be jumping for joy now that campaign medals have dried up a bit...).

Certainly won't be two, just a second award bar as currently happens when an OR reaches thirty years or, if commissioned after seven years in the ranks.

Whenurhappy,

I wouldn't be too despondent just yet. A very welcome move in the right direction, but there were rather a lot of 'mays', 'coulds' and 'will seek agreement' in the press release. At the moment it sounds aspirational, and whilst I have no reason to doubt Mr Fallon's intent in this case, the small matter of cost might be an issue. I'm hoping that the cost has already been factored in and the announcement was made knowing that cost isn't going to be an issue, even in these tough times.

Medallic recognition is one of the few areas left to us that visibly recognises loyalty and achievement, service and sacrifice and contributes directly to ethos and esprit de corps. I really do hope they manage to get this through the various staffing and budgetary chains in a timely manner.

Melchett

This has already been heavily staffed, I believe, but if it is anything like the inter-Service fight over the criteria for the Elizabeth Cross (the Army was, err, dead against recognition of training deaths, for example), there will be delays. At which point I shall have left the service and selling Big Issue or playing an accordion.

Good Lord! Does this mean that after nearly 28 years of commissioned service - which ended 19 years ago - I am finally going to get a gong next year?

My cup runneth over!!!:)

A great moment in my career when they forgot to award my 30 yrs LS&GC "Pip" and I had to go and pick it up from PSF........thrown across the desk to me by an SAC admin clerk with a "sign 'ere":rolleyes:

Snippy

Off course!

A story of long ago.

When 214 Sqdn did the In Flight Refueling trials, we initially only passed fuel back and forth between our own a/c.

When the trials were deemed to be successful, and we became the RAF's 1st operational Tanker Sqdn, we started training other Sqdns in the black art.

As a result some desk bound Group Captain in either Group or Command, whose purpose in life was to audit Avtur consumption noticed that 214 Sqdn Valiant's were 'consuming' more Avtur per hour than the other Valiant Sqdns.

He phoned our CO and when it was pointed out that we 'gave away' thousands of gallons of Avtur, his immediate response was; 'But who signs for it?' :ugh:

Sounds about right, in comparison with the Army I've always found the RAF to be very hit and miss on these things. My TELIC medal was delayed a year after a batch of applications were 'forgotten' about in Handbreak House. My HERRICK medal was processed inside a month but sent to Leeming for some reason I have yet to fathom as I've never been posted there, whilst the accompanying NATO keepsake was tossed across the desk in a broken box. As for my QDJM, I was told to pick that out of a carrier bag taped to the corner of the desk on the way out of the office!

My UNPROFOR gong turned up nearly 5 years after my first day of qualifying service - in my Sqn 'pigoenhole' with a crumpled certificate! I always imagined it had done a tour of all the NATO/UN nations before it finally arrived.

My NATO FRY was properly awarded but both my OSM Afghanistan and GSM air Ops Iraq arrived in the post. Her Majesty's celebratory medals arrived in the post as well.

As for the LSGCM, will this go to FTRS as well?

LJ