Are the G103 Twin Astirs suposed to be grounded? FLARM shows one has been fling from Ternhill today, but I didn't think they had a winch at Ternhill?

I enjoyed my 1500 or so launches in T31 and T21s at Hendon and Bovingdon as a Cdt, Staff Cdt and CI prior to an RAF career spanning 39 years as a pilot. A bit of research ( https://members.gliding.co.uk/wp-con...312150_t31.pdf ) shows that, officially at least the T31 is non aerobatic and prohibited from cloud flying. I did witness some sporting wing overs and steep turns but never saw a T31 looped. The Barge However
was a different story!

was a different story!https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmf...cd842c9d91.jpg

I once watched a certain staff cadet who became a BGA National Coach (CR) do 14 consecutive loops in a Sedbergh.
We were told definitely no rolls in the barge - too much chance of negative 'g' and the struts appearing on top of the wing - but a chandelle was permissible.

Looping a T31?

Dave Unwin asked
Vne 70kts - with the drag of the Cadet Mk3 - I'm afraid not. There was some spirited flying by the instructors on hangar flights for cadets who after A&B were found not to have done the 20 launches 'required', and to keep the books straight, formative experiences, but then again we didn't have enough experience to know what was sensible.

I agree with Fitter2 and others in that T31's should not have been looped,they are 'Normal Category' gliders.The T21 was classified as semi aerobatic and as previously mentioned - it was the fun glider.

I know this is from a slightly more recent BGA publication but it is exactly as I remember the cockpit placard.

BGA glider data sheet - T.31 (Tandem Tutor, Kirby Cadet Mk III)

https://i.imgur.com/LfuNxaF.jpg

I certainly agree that a 31 shouldn't be looped, and a -21 is much more useful. Could one have been? Possibly, it would've been untidy but I think do-able. TBH my mate's recollections are from 60 years ago, and its quite possible it was a sporting wing-over, chandelle or stall turn (yes I know these shouldn't have been done either, but it was a different time - see Pobjoy's story!)

Anyway, we digress. The point of my mate's story was how a week's gliding set a hook in him so deep, its still there. And I really think the RAF/ATC/VGS or someone has let a lot of kids down. IMHO of course

For anyone interested, there is a discussion running in 'Private Flying' regarding the use of microlights for cadet AEF which I have mentioned in this forum.

I'm sure 2 FTS will be able to put a stop to any such wild and dangerous outbreak of aviation...!

Centre Instructors
 

Dave The No I GC (Swanton) instructors were mainly ex war time in the early 60's and between them had been operational on most of the single engine fighters.
How they managed to suffer the weekly 'up round & down' in the fretwork fighters amazes me but they did so with great effect and really looked after any Staff Cadet that managed to get up there to help.
One thing for sure; they knew how to get the Cadets enthused in that week, and it was the norm that all the course members made the required A&B solo's. Cold weather jackets were the normal rig with the odd 'soapy hat' and wellies.
If you were up at Swanton helping and all the Cadets had finished you could be 'given' a machine and told to get as many launches in as you can before the end of the day, and if you had a P2 you were expected to fly the AE trips on Wed 'sports days'. Such was the 'leadership' and example from those at the 'coal face'.

I did my gliding course at SM, over the period of the Cuban Missile Crisis. Arrived with shiny PPL from flying scholarship, told I would have A&B on first day, which I did, from then I was a helper not a flyer, except for sitting in on hangar flights. Great week. 50 years later when I finished gliding course in UK, BGA found my documents and issued a replacement for a fiver, not a new A&B cert for thirty odd quid or whatever it is now.

Actually they struggled to provide me with any boots over the last 5 years! When they did they then informed me I couldn't fly in them as they lead to inadvertent application of the toe brakes.

Boots and 'light Aircraft'
 

In the Tiger Club (Redhill Days) all new members HAD to check out to solo standard in a Tiger Moth as the initial entrance to the 'sweet shop'.
Came the day when they decided that having a putter around in a Turbulent looked like being fun, and they would 'clump' over in the classic WW2 boots and Irvin Jacket.
I would get them to lift the Turb by the tail thereby demonstrating how light it was, and easy to nose over if not careful. This then rather made the case for removing the boots and flying in socks having of course also removed the Irvin Jacket so they could actually fit in.
Finger and thumb only on the stick and only 'feel' it to control then it was off to discover another 'realm' of aviation unknown to most.

The Honourable Company gave a Master's Award to the arch-charlatan Tracy Curtis-Taylor if I recall correctly.

The Master's Commendation for Flight Operations. Operations? Movements can barely be in the hundreds yet :suspect:

A Master's Commendation? That's truly amazing. Perhaps this 'company' isn't as honourable as they claim to be?

Is there much of a difference in court, between libel and slander?
Just because you are angry doesn't mean you are right

I'm intrigued now. So Beardy, are you saying that this 'Master's Commendation' is warranted? Well-deserved even?

HAC Award to JM
 

Its a joke; who cares!, and I doubt promoted by the VGS volunteers who were given such poor leadership or support.
Hardly a testimony to a thorough understanding of a contribution to aviation.

​​​​​​Read my post again, it's still there. I didn't say that.

This might be for the new nest he's feathered with the Aviation Skills Partnership rather than the current bed he's messed?

Award in FLIGHT OPERATIONS
 

Clearly the award states FLIGHT OPERATIONS, so just confirms total lack of knowledge on the HAC part (or suspect input from HQAC)
Either way just shows how easy it is to rewrite history with a bit of bling.
No one is fooled by this, and the posts on the Air Cadet forum show how those still involved have very little regard for the current leadership capability.

Well the ACO is about to undergo upheavel again, at the end of the year there is the publication of a 'strategic review' by the Dawninator and her team and with the new T&Cs being implimented may really set a storm going. The new T&Cs are really a sign it or out for all CFAVs and Civ Coms. No wonder oc 2FTS is going, pity help whoever takes the post.

Someone has got creative with a 'Downfall' parody of a meeting about the 'strategic review' and the potential for staff losses of people who won't sign the new T&Cs, squadron closures and mergers by th end of the year.

https://www.captiongenerator.com/1100812/Reviev-2018

Sorry Beardy, what exactly was it that you were trying to say? Apologies for any misunderstanding, I would welcome further clarification of your post.
It certainly is somewhat ironic that somewhere along this huge thread didn't someone predict that - far from being censured over this debacle (for that is clearly what it is) those responsible would actually end up being rewarded? Quite remarkable.

That happened last December with the publication of the RAFAC Adult Volunteer Agreement and the creation of the Cadet Forces Commission.

"Is there much of a difference in court, between libel and slander?" (Insults are no way for civilised people to conduct themselves, we have laws against this, I just don't know which apply here)

"Just because you are angry doesn't mean you are right" (self explanatory really, you could be wrong)

Still baffled;- in my post I asked a question, I didn't make a statement.

There's a difference. I'm no lawyer, but very much doubt that asking a question constitutes either libel or slander.

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but although the original posts were sequential, I wasn't referring to you, or your post.

But the strategic Squadron review si being published next month.

Sorry - wrong thread, please delete!

>In sum, John Middleton has made an indelible mark on the RAF and its Cadet Force<

That's certainly one way of putting it.

First time I have seen of someone going from a front of house seat to the back

His applause was distinctly muted. This is the second time I have been embarrassed by the selection made by the committee, and it causes me to consider my continued membership of HCAP

50+Ray:-
It seems to be a trend. The RAeS threw its hat into the MOD/MAA ring when it was announced that airworthiness was not its business! Sic Gloria Transit...

I understand your feeling, 50+Ray and I am beginning to think the same. Which is one reason why I didn't attend the T&A...

Now we are at the point of sign up or ship out.

The other is Squadron Leader Phil Leckonby, Vulcan pilot, major car smash on a instructional tour at Cranwell, fought for an age to retain flying status due to an eye injury, later became a nav on Buccanners. (12 squadron film fame).

The last para of the 'citation' covered it quite well (but not the way they meant it)
JM 'inherited' a large fantastic volunteer based FLYING TRAINING UNIT.
It was quite obvious that he never really 'bonded' with this idea that volunteers could be doing all this so well with very little back up from its parent, and really never understood where the CAPABILITY lay.
It is unfair to lay blame on him for the previous regime that allowed the airworthiness issues to escalate as it did, but I do consider his handling of the situation with the staff, and the complete lack of leadership dealing with the 'recovery process' made the situation far worse than it needed to be.
The right person in post at that time could have led a recovery situation with far better management skills, and also kept the organisation together at a time when it needed it. He obviously had another agenda re the staff (volunteers) and failed to see the big picture of what they were losing as an organisation. This thread title is his legacy. AIR CADETS GROUNDED It could have been handled in a much more practical way with the leadership it deserved, especially as it was a well paid resourced post that headed a fine operation that had decades of 'handed down' capability.
They had the expertise within the GSA to assist and advise (if asked) but were too busy facebooking, twattering and a... covering to deal with the real job.
of keeping a limited no of machines going whilst dealing with the situation.

OC 2FTS has left the building, all roles handed over to 3FTS until a new OC is appointed.