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RAF AT to the Philippines?
A very small snippet on BBC this morning says that Dave C is dispatching RAF AT to the region. Sky News says a C17 is earmarked.
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Well it won't be a C130K.
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To do what exactly>
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I read the title as RAFAT and couldn't for the life of me see what use The Red Arrows would be....
Time for glasses methinks. |
From the BBC website
The UK will send a Royal Navy warship to help deal with the storm disaster in the Philippines, Prime Minister David Cameron has announced. He said HMS Daring would travel "at full speed" from Singapore and an RAF C-17 transporter plane will be sent. Mr Cameron, addressing business leaders in the City of London, added that UK aid following Typhoon Haiyan would be increased from £6m to £10m. Up to 10,000 people are feared to have been killed. Meanwhile, millions of survivors of the typhoon, which struck the Philippines on Friday, are waiting for aid with food shortages increasing. A huge international relief effort is under way but rescue workers have struggled to reach areas cut off since the storm. 'Powerful help' During his speech at the Lord Mayor's Banquet, in which he outlined the coalition's foreign policy commitments, Mr Cameron said: "We continue to help around the world - as we are today in the Philippines, where Typhoon Haiyan has wrought such appalling devastation. "Britain is contributing £10m and HMS Daring, currently deployed near Singapore, will shortly be heading at full speed towards the disaster zone with further support from an RAF C-17 which will be a powerful help to the relief operation." |
Just what help will an air defence destroyer be able to give ?
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HMS Daring and her crew will provide humanitarian assistance, helicopter lift from one on-board Lynx and engineering and first-aid expertise. The Type 45 destroyer also carries equipment to make drinking water from seawater.
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Aah -not the Reds then!
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What they've always done: provide trained and well drilled bodies to make, move and mend stuff and help with food and fresh water supplies.
That's the problem with sending a Rolls Royce and not a Ford Escort; nobody believes that it can contribute anything. |
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Without wanting to sound negative, what does it cost to send a warship? Serious question and not to denigrate the training and flexibility of the good people on board but surely that's an expensive way of deploying a single helicopter. How many Antonovs could we charter for the same money?
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The people of the Philippines need all the help they can get - only someone who has experienced a typhoon can visualise the death and destruction that has been caused. It is a beautiful country with some of the friendliest and hard working people you could wish to meet.Although I am Scottish I have long connections with the Philippines and have a house there which fortunately was outside the typhoon area. Can I urge those of us more fortunate to be generous when requests for financial help are made.
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Shotone - the question is what is the marginal cost. Some fuel, basically. Almost everything else is a fixed cost.
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Without wanting to sound negative, what does it cost to send a warship? Serious question and not to denigrate the training and flexibility of the good people on board but surely that's an expensive way of deploying a single helicopter. How many Antonovs could we charter for the same money? PS I live in the Philippines and am fortunate not to have been in the path of that havoc. A warship may have more uses, over and above those already mentioned, than first meets the eye proving a self-contained sophisticated command and coordination infrastructure where all land based facilities have been simply wiped out; obliterated. While by background and inclination I’m Air Force through and through, I believe Jack Tar has much to bring to the table on this one. |
I am surprised they are not sending Illustrious, which has only just left Karachi
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Illustrious is committed to Cougar 13 | Royal Navy, and taking her out would leave a huge hole in the plan.
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Hmm, sounds like the perfect group of ships and units to send to help with a humanitarian disaster?
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How many Antonovs could we charter for the same money? |
Send troops by air and you also have to send accommodation, food, bedding, water, medical support, communications, C&C, etc, etc, etc.
Send a boat and you provide all the support services needed in a complete package, as well as modern facilities for the injured - should they be needed. Makes total sense to me TBH |
How many runways in/near the disaster area are both capable of handling an Antonov and currently serviceable? |
I agree with your point, QRTF about marginal cost...but we're talking marginal benefit too. The issue isn't the skills or willingness to help of the crew, simply one of scale. 500,000 homes have been destroyed. They need thousands of tons of food, construction materials and equipment. No doubt there will be some nice recruitment pictures, and yes, she has a watermaker but how much aid can Daring carry?
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Aid can be helo'd in, as can water but easier to have water made on sight.
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I just heard on the news that the Marines are bringing in lights and Radar to make
one of the airports a safe 24 operation where they can bring in large aid aircraft. |
C130K
Where are the C130K's? Can they not be deployed . Surely there are still current crews and engineers. This seems a huge disaster and the UK ought to be deploying as much as it can.
Why not cancel the naval exercise mentioned on an earlier post and send all the warships to the Philippines. The combination of a number of C130's and a decent task force at sea would surely make a huge difference. ACW |
i would have thought that the benefits of deploying the worlds biggest Air Traffic Control radar to a country that has had most of its airports knocked out would have been blindingly obvious...
that it can also provide power, food, drinking water, C3, ISR, med support, fuel and run its own heliport might also prove marginally useful . |
Cokecan
I presume you are talking about the USS George Washington and not a tiddly T45 :ooh: |
Originally Posted by ShotOne
how much aid can Daring carry?
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Originally Posted by ShotOne:
how much aid can Daring carry? Here you go: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/royal-navy-warship-heads-to-philippines Hope the URL doesn't b*gger up the formatting of the thread. Given that Daring was relatively close at hand, strikes me as a very worthwhile use for the asset. Criminal if we didn't. |
Can 20,000 litres of water in 24 hours.
That's not bad at all. |
Originally Posted by bcgallacher
(Post 8147609)
The people of the Philippines need all the help they can get - only someone who has experienced a typhoon can visualise the death and destruction that has been caused. It is a beautiful country with some of the friendliest and hard working people you could wish to meet.Although I am Scottish I have long connections with the Philippines and have a house there which fortunately was outside the typhoon area. Can I urge those of us more fortunate to be generous when requests for financial help are made.
bc, Share your sentiments. Take heart, I'm very confident we will respond generously - we have already started fundraising at school and I believe the DEC and the various church and charity requests have gone out. Listened to the radio interview yesterday where a medic was desperately imploring the world to respond and to do it quickly - truly heart breaking. God speed the Navy I can only imagine the boost to spirits never mind the material effect of seeing help like that arrive. |
Its nice to see that "Albert" is still alive and doing its job in this catastrophe (As evidenced on the news tonight), Whatever livery it wears the aircraft is synonymous with emergency relief and rescue. This one is bad, but I'm sure all who become embroiled will do their best. Good luck to Royal Air Force personnel involved.
Smudge |
Shame, but if we still had them the 'Round Table Class LSL' would have been perfect for the task
Able to carry and land vehicles, stores etc straight onto a beach. Take off people directly from beaches. Can be rigged as a temp hospital/aid ship and had two helicopter decks. Add the ability to carry out replen at sea they would have been perfect for the job. What, if anything did the RFA replace them with? HMS Daring could do the inshore command and control bit and provide additional crew for the RFA. The George Washington can stand off shore overseeing the whole shooting match and providing a base for the helo's etc. |
lift to top of thread
get them in there as soon as possible.
glf |
Mr Cameron, addressing business leaders in the City of London, added that UK aid following Typhoon Haiyan would be increased from £6m to £10m. I wonder if Dick Cheney gives one of his own companies the reconstruction contract, again? |
In my time in the Philippines I have experienced Typhoons,earthquakes,volcanic eruptions and military coup attempts,the Filipinos are the most resilient people on earth - they live under the perpetual threat of natural disaster.Given a little help they will fight their way back from this.
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Did the C17 take much into the affected area when it deployed? they certainly appear to be camera shy at the moment. Seen coverage of an EK charter jet 'flying' the flag for the UK.
I remember arriving in Mexico City on a 'K' back in 85 post mega earth quake, with a shed load of RE's. The door went up, the ramp went down. Stood all expectantly was the BBC's own Brian Baron and camera man. "stop" shouted Brian, as the initial view of the British aid effort was the beer/NAAFI stack on the ramp - for the 'engineers obviously! Got dissed by the Argentinians when the crew bus driver slowed down as it rolled up in front of their 707 on a very busy ramp - no shocks and they would never have been let on anyway. Got moaned at by the Holiday Inn management when team GB used the swimming pool as a bath, there being no mains water running, but plenty of shower gel to hand. An interesting 24 hours that was. I still have the certificate of thanks from El Presidente of Mexico on my wall…. |
Originally Posted by Shot1
Without wanting to sound negative, what does it cost to send a warship? Serious question and not to denigrate the training and flexibility of the good people on board but surely that's an expensive way of deploying a single helicopter. How many Antonovs could we charter for the same money?
Originally Posted by gr4techie
I'd love to know where the £10m is coming from? When we at home are subject to cutbacks, pay freezes, redundancies, scrapping of equipment, because there isn't enough £'s...
Originally Posted by House of Commons
...DFID's budget in 2013-14 will be £10.765 million....
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Just what help will an air defence destroyer be able to give ?
Judging by the number of awards of the Wilkinson (now Firmin) Sword of Peace to HM Ships and RFAs involved in disaster relief over nearly the past 40 years, the answer is that they can take on just about anything they are asked to do.:ok: Jack |
Just what help will an air defence destroyer be able to give ? All you need is the token Wren holding a rescued baby in the foreground. |
Wow the cynics on here are real rays of sunshine. Love them to be on my side in a state of adversity - NOT.:ugh:
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