@ZH875
 

Never mind the top of the tree, did you make it to the "nightclub"? :}

"They come at their own risk"? This is pure gold. Keep 'em coming. :ok:

Karma.....Having just buried an NZ SAS mate you are not the sort that could or would be accepted into the Regt. They are people who keep their occupation to themselves and do not try to high life themselves. So on that you sir are bringing my mate and the Regt into disrespect. They may come from different countries but the comradeship is the same. Please desist your lies and respect the SAS for what they are.

"Turning round with a loaded weapon during a shoot is stupid and very dangerous. In my experience, such behaviour met with a swift corrective boot or fist."

I was always taught to get control of the weapon - or at least the end of or close to the end of the barrel first so you could at least control where it was pointed - and then sort the soldier out.

I know of one instance a bloke turned around with an F1 and fired it, stitching a whole mag alongside the Sgt's leg. He got belted.

And wasn't General Patraeus shot in the chest in an incident on a range where someone turned around with a weapon and fired ?


I know swift justice via a Size 10 boot isn't the done thing now but sometimes it is the best method to save lives.


barnstormer1968

Thanks for the run down of units, I am reasonably up with UK SF units
but good info. (I must go and do some research on 49 Para:O)

The SAS / SF people I know wouldn't, AND don't feel the need to say it out loud and when they do, it is generally not "SAS" but something a bit more subtle - like in Aust, the common one is "from the West" (the SAS being in Perth, Western Australia).
.

Sorry but the best method of saving lives is by better training.

If you employ someone who will only learn if the information is punched into them you have got the wrong person for that job.

If you employ someone to instruct, apart from a boxing instructor, who can only get their point across by punching the information home you have got the wrong person for that job.

Some on here might argue that a good kicking might do me some good but can't think of a single time in my 30 something years to date where a learning experience would have been improved by a belt in the chops.

SFFP

I don't disagree re "better training" but recruits and junior soldiers still F#%k up occasionally, regardless of good training. I know where you are coming from.

Not much difference between a belt in the chops and running round a parade ground in full kit. Still has the same effect.
.

Being where you are in the world you won't have seen our tv news today, suffice to say not too sure the belt in the chops method, which would appear to have been Army SOP for many years is currently being considered as that acceptable.

re the range problem,
I've seen it happen, with a Rock range instructor using one hand to grasp near the muzzle (for maximum leverage), and the other hand, with the five digits grouped in a tight bunch, used to persuade the miscreant to immediately release the weapon.
100% effective and the safest way to solve the problem, which is the point.
The art of range instructing is not letting it get to this point, but in this case the Instructor had to take people he did not know.

500N, 49 para details here, courtesy of the Pongoes, but you didn't hear it from me, right ;)

49 Para - ARRSEpedia

24 SAS details at same source

Fox3
That is exactly how to do it. Primary focus on where the muzzle is pointing, secondary focus on, calmly if possible getting hold of the rest of the weapon and if not, as you said. never had to do it but have had to grab the barrel in the past.

I did know what 49 Para is, I was joking about looking it up. I have seen that
ARRSEpedia thread before, it is quite good.

Whilst I'm interested in the ways you can screw up a fuel supply, the B*llocks posted by Karma is much more fun. Interesting to read two threads on the same one, well three if you count the bullying parts.:confused:

On the fuel thread, I did hear of a Lynx in GWI that refuelled at a petrol station, the only mistake he made was use Petrol rather than Diesel, which would only have blocked a few things rather than crisp the burner cans in the engines.Having flown a helo that would burn just about anything made form Hydrocarbons, be interesting to find out.

Urban myth? anyone got any info?

Well I seem to have stirred up a bit of a hornet's nest there. I was simply trying to give an example.

However, it seems some see the range as an instruction thing, where others see it as practice.

If I could draw an RAF parallel, if you're in ATC, when you've qualified and on watch in the tower, it's not training, it's doing the job. You're expected to produce the goods. Same with a trained soldier on the range.