Mr Petter's Baby Jet - The Folland Gnat
 

Having seen the interest (not to mention thread drift!) on the F-104 thread, regarding the Folland Gnat, I would like to launch this thread, dedicated to my first 'real' aeroplane as a rigger youth at 4FTS in the early '70s.

I'm sure many pilots/groundcrew out there have recollections to share about this demanding jet!

HB

The Gnat gave me three of the most cheerful years of my time in the RAF. Improved my flying a lot, too.:ok::ok::ok:

I was lucky enough to fly the Gnat in 1966. I also instructed on Hawk in the 80s. Chalk & cheese.

Sharpend - 22 Course or 23 Course? I was 22

Much loved in the IAF (and by the general public) after its performance in the '71 war, earning it the nickname 'Sabre Killer'. My great uncle retired a year before it was inducted in the IAF. He told me his single biggest regret was not having flown it.

'Twas always said you don't strap into one, you 'put it on'.:) (and it always fitted so beautifully).

Halton Brat, just type 'Gnat' into the advanced search option and you'll find plenty of tales of the Folland Pocket Rocket!

Don't forget that well-known Ynys Mon firm of solicitors - Speed, Trim and Unlock.

I'm convinced that the chap who designed the Gnat's longitudinal control system knew he was going to be fired, so decided to get his own back by designing a system of such fiendish complexity.

http://pittenweem.co.uk/weexp506a.jpg

Some of my best memories of being in the RAF are associated with this aircraft.

http://pittenweem.co.uk/southstack1.jpg

http://pittenweem.co.uk/gnatline.jpg

http://pittenweem.co.uk/gnat47.jpg


http://pittenweem.co.uk/5.jpg

BEagle

Thanks for the tip - doesn't XR538 look fantastic! Great paint job.
Oh dear, seem to have a speck of dust in my eye..........

HB

Flew them as a stude in '66 on 25 course and then QFI on them from 73 - 77. An ideal aircraft to learn about swept wing handling characteristics but remember spending an awful lot of time practising flying in manual reversion mode in case of an hydraulic failure which I didn't suffer in 1300+ hours on the pocket rocket.

any truth in the rumour that there was a suggested swing-wing version? Allegedly drafted by Barnes Wallis? Or is that total rubbish?

James D

The machine you are referring to was, of course, the Mk2 Wiggins Aerodyne.

HB

thanks
that explains the confusion

the Gnat - best fun I ever had with my clothes on

When I was a Hawk tech instructor in 4FTS Ground School ('83-85), the DCGI (Flt Lt Tony D-----) related an incident to me of his early days on the Gnat as a QFI. I can't remember the precise details, but he ended up at night circling overhead the Menai Straits with the stick planted hard in the dashboard, due to some bizarre configuration he had got himself into with his pitch controls. An emotional radio chat with the Duty Instructor in Valley ATC resolved the issue, fortunately.

Any opinions on the likely cause?

Are you out there, Tony D?

HB

If you mean Tony D**le yes he is - I had a beer and lunch in a pub with him a couple of years ago. I had a great time instructing at Valley (64 - 66). Loads of aircraft, 3 students and no poxy secondary duties! I got 440 hours in one 12 month period, basically 50 minute sorties, and I was beaten by the late Bruce Latton. I have lost touch with my main students Marcus Wills, "Taff" Hughes and Tony Ellender. Any ideas anybody?

Cocked up STUPRECC drill with a simulated HYD fail? Use an excessive nose up TPI value and you'd probably run out of 'unlock' elevators to maintain level flight as speed increased? In the early days, the Gnat didn't have a feel trim gauge, so setting the correct tailplane and feel trim position values would have been much more difficult - you had about 30 sec before the TPI froze, after which you could only move it nose-up from the failure point using standby trim.

Slow down until the stick was 'load free central', reselect the HYD power cock ON, relock the elevators and it should be OK?

Please would a Gnat QFI comment - I was a mere struggling student! But I'd been advised that it was vital to understand the longitudinal control system fully and to know the STUPRECC drill so that you could recite it word perfect at any time of day or night. Screw it up and at best you'd have to eject......

I'm sure I remember someone from that era telling me that the Lightning was a good lead-in trainer for the Gnat...

Much as an ETPS preview assessment student concluded about the C130 being a good lead-in trainer for the worthless Jetstream!

Wander00

I started in June 66. Think it must have been 25 course?

Aah, so we did not cross; I was the student on 22 Course with the most hours and who was going to be streamed to the Canberra, so completed the course a a month early, in June 66.

I wound up in a similar situation once, by varying the routine "hydraulic failure" emergency in that I turned the power off after the gear had been lowered in the ILS pattern; the 5º "up" tailplane datum shift had of course been activated by this time.

My student fell completely for my cunning plan and selected wheels up immediately after the go-around. When pushing the stick up against the dashboard didn't stop the aircraft from pitching up quickly even further, his "You have control, Sir" was overstating the case a bit

The nose was a bit high and the speed uncomfortably low to restore normality by lowering the gear again, but rolling to a very large angle of bank meant I could let go of the stick (no hands = load free) so I could put the hydraulic power back on before we ran out of IAS completely. ATC were highly amused by this performance, but fortunately didn't klype to the Thought Police in Standards, who never heard of the incident.

PS I didn't do it again, ever.

The Folland Gnat / HAL Ajeet

Spirit of Hamble. Folland Aircraft by Derek N. James, Tempus Publishing Ltd., Stroud 2003 has drawings of the Fo.148.

Yup, I too went to Canberras, but so did hundreds of others. In those days there were Canberra Sqns in UK, Germany, Malta, Near East, Middle East & Far East. I went to just one of the 4 Canberra Sqns at Akrotiri, No 73. I suspect soon that the RAF will have less aeroplanes than Akrotiri had in the 60s. Four strike/attack Sqns, 1 fighter Sqn, 1 helicopter flt and a transport Sqn.

For more 'what ifs' - not just the Gnat, try to get hold of a copy of Project Cancelled by Derek Wood. As a young teenager I borrowed a copy from my local lending lending library in the late '70's. Sad reading.

NutherA2, I wonder whether the STUPRECCC drill was changed after your event? 'T' stood for 'trim to the safe/ideal sector on the FTPI' rather than 'load free' and 'E' included exhausting the tail accumulator 1½-2½ (gear up) or 5½-6½ (gear down) - I think?

My QFI gave me a HYD failure just as we broke into the circuit once from 500ft and 360+ KIAS - the clangers went off just as I pitched into the break. But the STUPRECCC drill worked fine.

I'm sure that QFIs watched student antics very carefully under such circumstances - but you knew you were doing well when your QFI was brave enough to let you fly a night manual roller....at Mona!

However, mistakes were still being made. Stn Cdr 'Tojo' had a HYD fail on take-off just after retracting the landing gear. He then closed the throttle and put the gear down without doing the STUPRECCC drill first. No Datum Shift, so the jet immediately plunged towards Treaddur Bay....with an innocent passenger in the back. Fortunately as it accelerated it had just enough pitch authority to level out and start to climb before he remembered the Stby Trim...:hmm: Tojo flew the Hunter by preference thereafter.

Great little jet, STUPRECCC and CUBSTUNT notwithstanding!

:D:D........

I still have my copy that I bought in my late teens.:ok:

Don't give it to anyone- 1st edition now at least £42 on that South American river

Still have mine. Can't remember the chapter but in there somewhere the book describes a plan to hang 3 Gnats under a Vulcan and use them for strike missions, I think.

AGnother Gnat Gfactoid
 

The contributor who said 'you put it on' was exactly right. My guilty 'secret' which of course was the same for almost everyone else was that I would give myself an illicit thrill by pressing the test button (on the right console?) to inflate my turning trousers while taxying out.

Not to say that the Pkt Rkt was unreliable, but on my course of 12 students (86, 1965) we had 12 major incidents. Mine was a full display of warnings while IMC, climbing solo out of low level - made a precautionary forced landing at Church Fenton, bollocked by OC Eng because I "should have known" it was a false alarm caused by an electrical fault. I wished he'd been in the cockpit with me to help me make that call.

Trophy for our course must go to Dave A***e, who suffered fuel pump failure just before low key while doing a practice glide approach. I was sitting at the take-off point so can witness that he disappeared behind the hill on the approach to 14, still in the cockpit (still going through cold relight drill, according to Dave). First thing to reappear was the canopy, followed by Dave, followed by a bouncing Gnat. Happy days!

At the time of the incident I was a Sgt ATechA on night-shift in the Gaydon Hangar and we carried out a hyd pump change on that aircraft. It was SOP at that time to just carry out a quick ground run to check the pump came on line and for leaks etc. Came in the following evening to hear all sorts of kerfuffle and accusations had gone on following the incident until it was revealed that the pump's quill-shaft had sheared when the engine reached full-bore. As a consequence, a requirement to carry out a full bore run after a pump change was introduced.

'73 to '77 happy days on 4FTS.

Copies here from £25 + P&P

Derek wood - project cancelled - AbeBooks

Now that I am old and grey - well, what's left is grey - I wish I had realised when I was 21 what fun I was having in the Gnat.

A lovely aircraft - and I would love to fly one again!!

And, on my course at Valley, some great instructors who helped to make me enjoy the aircraft.

The A-5 pass will be in my dreams......................................

Lyneham Lad

Pls check your PM's

HB

One of the most interesting aircraft I have flown – as a student for 67 hours in 1964.

Didn’t enjoy the unique feeling of rolling down the runway in a strong crosswind feeling that one’s ear was likely to scrape the runway sometime soon but enjoyed the joy of aerobatics in the tiniest jet I ever flew. Enjoyed the ‘first one off the ground’ beat up of the airfield every morning – and the Stn Cdr’s face when he came out the SECO huts after met brief and saw the first one off below the level of the line of fins of the line a few feet in front of him. He grounded the pilot for a week – after landing a private aircraft departed for a visit to the girlfriend that lasted just a week – back on the programme on return!

Was instructed by one Bruce Latton – reckon he learned much about instructing in that period. Fire ext in front cockpit impacted and bent the throttle lever during an excessive G recovery from a spiral dive – preceded by a c**k-up over who had control. On the way back to Valley I thought pulling the hyd cock off whilst I was holding the fire ext in one hand, the stick in the other and trying to work out if I could still move the bent throttle was just one step too far for a student like me.

Remember the unpopular PMC who never worked out why his radio controlled boats kept failing out in the lake outside the OM – he never saw the students with the air rifles leaning out of the windows on the first floor but he spent a lot of time in waders!

My Flight Commander was one Al Poll**k – and he later joined our Hunter course at Chivenor having had to arrange a quick posting out of Training Command to escape the aftermath of his inverted flight at an airshow during a temporary ban on neg G. Punch-ups in the cine’ room after an air-to-air sortie were another story.

Very grateful for the lessons learned from that little aircraft-lessons that surely helped later in Hunters, Lightnings and Phantoms.

Gnat spotted in Clyde Valley
 

Good choice for the hotel. The Gnat would be somewhat cramped.

HB

Sure did with Frightening, but only when I converted to the F3.

OR946 'an all that.

Yup, I remember Bruce Latton, made me do steep turns at 50 ft over the sea, ON INSTRUMENTS!. Sure sharpened up my IF. Sadly Bruce died a year or so ago.

I never had any technical difficulties with the Gnat, but do remember one solo Hi Lo Hi to Scotland. I elected to continue over the Irish Sea, IMC at 250 ft hoping to break cloud. Must have screwed up my DR drift calculations as I broke cloud just abeam Blackpool Tower, only 20 miles off track. Would have been famous if I had hit it!