Pregnant RAF officer awarded £16,000 for discrimination
 

A female officer in the Royal Air Force (RAF) has been awarded more than £16,000 after she was removed from her post because she was pregnant.

An employment tribunal found the officer - who chose not to be named because she still serves in the RAF - suffered discrimination, and the force had unintentionally created "an intimidating, degrading, hostile or offensive environment for her".

Link

Pregnant RAF officer awarded £16,000 for discrimination

This article explains why in a bit more detail.

Jeez, you really would have thought that the Armed Forces should have learned by now! :rolleyes:

It would be interesting to know the thinking behind the decision to return her to the UK.

Wonder if her work had suffered due to the pregnancy? Might have been some good intentions there.

As written , the article makes the MOD/RAF look very wrong.

They have.. 16 grand to get rid of the fat waddling bint and replace her with some normal shaped totty seems like money well spent :ok:















OK, OK.... It was a JOKE!!

Falklands is classed as operational - pregnant is not compatible with ops and the default answer is to be sent home - the default answer since I can remember.

From another angle - how could the MoD possibly ensure the proper antenatal care for the individual when deployed? It is a part of life when non-military medical care takes the lead and therefore outside the normal deployed med centre.

I don't think this makes the MOD look bad at all, as the judgment says they "unintentionally created a situation..." I think we have a situation where the MOD has done what it thought was best, removing the officer from a remote base back to the UK but "unintentionally" got it wrong as it affected her promotion opportunities...

If this was a case of the MOD being outright in the wrong the damages would have been a dam sight bigger that 16K!

I think the judgement is correct when it says that each case should be assessed on it's merits, I couldn't see this judgement being made if said officer had been in Afghanistan as removing her from the war-zone would be proportional... no employer will get it right, and with the MOD's glacial rate of change it's nice to see that they are at least heading in the right direction and trying!

As a side note: if the MOD hadn't stationed her with her husband I wonder of this situation could have been avoided.

Probably not, as you don't need your husband to get pregnant.

I can't help but think that there must be antenatal care in the Falklands for the local population.

"I can't help but think that there must be antenatal care in the Falklands for the local population."

There is.

Its called a Vet. :E

Nice one, Jabba! Made oi larrff....:)

Hardly rocket science to consider individual cases individually, one would think. Far more 21st century than some dumb 'befehl ist befehl' so-called default reaction.

Mind you, any preggy lady travelling in a LandRover to Stanley from Base Area Gringo for ante-natal care would probably find the birth induced before she got half-way.....:ooh:

NICE ONE JABBA :D

This means that just about every aircrew mate in the RAF must be owed a promotion and if so, how exactly did it delay the process ?

I think its a bit strong to have to take leave to go back to the FI, but I would love to know the real story behind this...

At the end of it, FI is an operational det, so I pity the MoD on this one as you can just imagine the headlines if they had retained her and she had lost / delivered the baby.....

Mr Hinecap - The Falklands may be classified as an operational det but the FACT that they have married quarters there, and have had for years, suggests that the 'operational' threat is deemed low. Service wives have given birth in the Falklands at the local hospital described below. The only difference (that i can see) in her being at home base and pregnant, or the Falklands and pregnant - is the classification of 'operational' to the det.

Primary and secondary health care facilities are based at the King Edward VII Memorial Hospital (KEMH) in Stanley, the only hospital in the Islands. It is a 27-bed hospital with a small accident and emergency department, an acute ward with a two-bedded intensive care unit, an isolation unit, and a maternity bed. KEMH has a full range of medical, dental, nursing (including midwives and community nurses), allied health professional staff and engineering, qualified to UK standards or recognised equivalents. Wherever possible, the hospital adheres to UK standards/guidelines for medical practice - So all good there then.

As a serving officer, she would be on short notice to move, along with everyone else on strength Down South, in the event that our South American cousins want their share of the oil and fishing rights. This is not compatible with being pregnant. So the rules say she has to go back to the UK.

One size rarely fits all, however. She is on an accompanied tour and, presumably, in OFQs with her hubby. So a considered solution might be:

• Put her on a career break unitl she starts maternity leave and leave her in theatre with hubby, like any non-serving spouse Down South.
• Provide ante-natal care locally.
• Mobilise her nominated replacement, who would be going there early if she were non-effective for some other reason (run-over, burst appendix, unidentified drinking injury, etc) and is already warned off for that purpose.
• Write her det report based on what she has achieved so far. MOD 2020C replaces OJAR for the period and, when she gets back to work from maternity leave, her next OJAR picks up the slack.

She gets to stay with hubby, gets looked after, hubby doesn't end up finding solace in the nearest WRAF ops clerk whilst drinking himself inside out, and she still gets presented to the next promotion selection board. The only costs are the replacement's early deployment and her slightly thin report. Job jobbed.

That sounds like the sensible solution....

tell me, are you still serving?! :ok:

What we don't know is when she was due to return to the UK? She might have been too far gone to fly and then would have sued the MOD for making her have a benny!:E

The bloody Service went to hell in a handcart once they decided that WRAFs couldn't be chucked out when they got themselves up the duff.

She'd probably spent the time since getting rooted whinging and moaning about morning sickness etc etc etc and not doing the job that she was paid for (despite all the PC leaning backwards) and her bosses got royally p*ssed off with her.

If they want to play in a man's world then they should play by the rules. :}

Thanks to C Hinecap for his earlier reply.

As someone else said, the real story would be interesting.

Are there any female civilian desk workers at the base? Wonder how might they be treated in a similar situation?

This is ridiculous and frankly she should be ashamed of herself for suing the MOD. I can't believe that taking leave affected her promotion prospects and if it did then she wasn't forced to take leave.

My wife also serves in the RAF and was due to go to the FI when she found out she was pregnant, she was very keen to get an 'operational' tick done but the call was that she couldn't go. Whilst there is a level of care in FI it isn't to the level available in the UK, particularly for complications or emergencies, and what is more important than the health of your growing baby!!!!

She now hasn't been OOA and will only have a year left on her return to work, so her chances of a PC or any other form of extension in the leaning RAF she will return to is very low - perhaps we should try and get some quick cash that could be buying body armour or a desperaty needed extra flying hour for someone trainging for ops..... Of course not. The lady in question was not disadvantaged, the RAF ensured that as soon as it knew she was pregnant it protected her and her unborn baby - even if she chose then to fly for god knows how many hours to somewhere with limited facilities to care for emergencies with very young feutous's (sp?)

I'm sorry if it sounds strong but I think the RAF put my wifes needs first and has been very supportive with excellent provisions compared to many other companies. This is a very similar situation to my wife's, almost identical so I feel pretty entitled to my view- it makes me angry when I think peole are just out to get money!
:mad:

This is a very similar situation to my wife's, almost identical so I feel pretty entitled to my view- it makes me angry when I think peole are just out to get money!http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...s/censored.gif

So, you also lived in a married quarter in the Falkland Islands and the RAF ordered your wife to move 8 000 miles away from you against your wishes, Geez, small world....

Damned if you do, damned if you don't
 

Sounds to me like the MoD was buggered either way.

They moved her for what they thought were the correct reasons (operational service when preggers, reduced standard of ante-natal care etc).

If they hadn't removed her and something went wrong with her pregnancy, she may well have sued for even more.

She was lucky enough that she got a posting with her husband in the first place, many more service people don't (not saying it shouldn't happen, but just that she should be grateful for it).

As for missing out on promotion because she was on leave and didn't receive a performance review 2 things spring to mind.

1. Why is it so difficult in this day and age to sort out the review irrespective of where you happen to be?

2. Even if she had the review, was she 100% guaranteed promotion or was it just that she missed out on possible promotion?

Makes me wonder if the chap representing MOD at the tribunal was really up to the job. I thought the appraisal system was built around an annual cycle, so how does being on leave affect that, surely it could have been done a few weeks late when she came back off her holiday?


does this ruling mean that everyone else whose appraisal is too late will also be 'compensated'?

Someone must know her - put her name up on here.

That way I am sure there will be a long line of people in your Royal Air Force willing to work alongside her in the future given her loyalty, leadership and lack of spine.

G:ok:

As no doubt there would be a bunch of people just lining up to give her the benifit of their bitterness, the fact that she has not been outed makes sense just for that reason alone. Maybe she should out herself ?

That said, it's a small service and how many pregnanat officers are there in it.....

Maybe if she gave the 16k to H4H or the RAFBF then max respect to the lady:ok:

But as I said before, I would love to know the real story.

I wonder if the Russians used that criteria on the Eastern Front in WWII . . . a lot of their soldiers were women.

Surely it's time for us to grow up - pregnancy is not an illness and certainly in the earlier months it will not incapacitate the lady (it may alter her demeanour temporarily).

Surely it's not beyond the wit of man (sic) to discuss her 'disposal' with HER?

One can almost picture her husband (who probably looks at this site) covering his head with his wooly pully and muttering "Fer Chrissake, make it all go away - please"

I am aware they have some odd medical limitations in FI. ISTR you have to be G2 or G1 even to go there. I don't know whether the same applies to those finding themselves with child.

I also remember when I was down there a few years ago that one of the locals had an ectopic pregnancy that was dealt with in the local hospital. She was was then sent to Chile to a 'proper' hospital, but not surprisingly their facilities were worse than those on the Islands!

anotherthing is spot on. The MOD was damned either way.

I have to say that in every instance I have come across, pregnant members of my Service have been given every consideration, irrespective of rank.

STH

Thankfully we have moved on a little bit since then airpolice.

I still feel it was a little harsh to boot her out of her quarter at MPA and her posting for being a little bit pregnant. As far as I was aware the only sure-fire way of not becoming pregnant is by not having sex - or are we suggesting forced abortions too?

Hang on, whether you agree with her or not this officer OBEYED the rules in every detail. All she has done to offend you so greatly is to seek redress within the Service system and then to seek to exercise her rights provided by Parliament and recognised by the Ministry of Defence to take her case to an Employment Tribunal.

Further comment superfluous.

Hmmm interesting one if pregnant would I want to risk my unborn babies life on a posting to the Falklands with a less than adequate hospital to deal with any pregnancy comlpications. Would I want to be a heck of a long flight back to the UK or would I want to rely on the AT system to get me back to the UK/South America to a specialist baby unit?

No option really........ un-fair discrimination my AR:mad:E!!

Selfish, money grabber springs to mind.

I think most of the recent comments mentioning a pregnant women in an Operational zone is not very sensible have got it absolutely correct.

No wonder she hasn't been named - her career would be over (I hope it is anyway).

A fair call I think. However, in this case we are talking about someone living on the married patch in the Falklands. It's a few years since my last 4-month session in the FI but I would hardly equate it to an operational tour. For the Chinook dudes (who moved out halfway through my last tour), AT/AAR dudes, Signals, RIC, ABMs, Medics etc it felt very much like a respite tour from the operational theatres of Iraq & AFG. Only a very small % of F3 chaps tried to pretend otherwise.

Irrespective of whether someone who has served in the sandpit and other taxing theatres believes that the FI is not a 'real' operational tour, it remains the case that it is deemed to be operational by the powers that be.

This brings with it the rules/regulations that other operational tours bring with them; rules and regulations that any member of the RAF should be aware of, let alone an Officer.

It is maybe wrong to use the same 'duty of care' policy for FI tours as it is for other frontline tours, but that is what happens.

Becoming pregnant is a lifestyle choice - for both parents.

Accepting that it has an impact on what you can and cannot do in a figthing force is part of the duty one signs up for. Officers should be even more aware of this.

Maybe she will do something honourable like donate the £16000+ to a worthy charity like Help for Heroes!

After all, she has not exactly suffered too much grief or hardship and I doubt that they need the money with two wages coming in.

Wildrover - if your comments were expressed by anyone in her chain of command, and in anyway acted upon, you've just lined her up for an even bigger payout. Forget the rights and wrongs of the original claim, to be victimised for making a successful, legal claim will expose the MoD to a whole world of hurt....

Did she join to serve her country or for the country to serve her?

Unless I'm mistaken, the award was based on an adversely affected promotion, with the situation concerning her transfer back to the UK coming into play only as it set up the conditions that resulted in the adversely affected promotion.

My reading was that if her promotion hadn't been adversely affected, there would have been no award... and it is likely she wouldn't have even filed the grievance!


I strongly suspect there is more to how the evaluation vs leave situation developed than any of us knows... the transcripts of the court proceedings would be needed to determine exactly what happened there.

Just a thought.

Out there in civvyland, my Sister is a freelance fashion designer, damn well paid too.

She worked hard in her career, and made her choice.

Her choice was contraception.

Now she is established in her work, she is making babies, and working from home. Even got herself a house-husband.

No doubt your sister has worked hard in her 'well-paid' civilian career. So at what point can a serving officer make that choice available to your sister: I am established in my career now, so I can stop the contraception?

How do you square your comments with the RAF's advertising that "And being married, or having kids, doesn’t have to stop you having the career you want."

Just a thought.