Mod Switchboard.
 

Hi, not exactly air crew topic, and I'm a civvy so excuse the intrusion.

Do you get annoyed by the MOD Switchboard? They never seem to have up to date numbers and their lack of knowledge is remarkable. Try asking for a RN press officer in one of the dockyards for example.

I rang today wanting to be put through to Ark Royal. "What is Ark Royal" came the reply from the call taker.

Dear God....

Dan

Yup, I recall having a nightmare some years back

Me: Hi, can I have 11 Sqn Crewroom, please
Doris: Sorry, I have no 11 Sqn listed.
Me: You must have, RAF Leeming?
Doris: Nope, sorry, I have a 25 Sqn - will they do?
...much later...
Doris: I do have an XI squadron at Leeming...
Me: PVRs

Things have evidently improved :suspect:

I asked them for the number for ATC at RAF St Athan once

'How do you spell that?'

'St At' 'No'

'8 T 3'- ATC !! Doh !:}

Me - Can I have the number for 5 Sqn ops, Conningsby pse?
Them - 5 Sqn doesn't exist.
Me - erm yes it does, can you check again pse.
Them - nope it definitely doesn't exist as we don't have the number
Me - I think you'll fi..........
Them - you'll have to speak up, I can't hear you.
Me - That's because 5 Sqn are flying over the top of me as we speak.:\

Good to see nothing has changed - and in answer to the original question, yes, they are bloody annoying and staffed mostly by people who have failed the Woolworths exam.

Some years ago, my request for OC 41 Sqn, RAF Coltishall

produced a phone number for OC C4I Sqn, RAFC Cranwell.

And when you call from an outside/civvy line the number they give you, 'for future reference', is a GPTN number.

There was one slight flaw in the plan - it was bo11ox!

Actually, I found the switchboards across the British Empire to be both efficient and cordial. I spent many a happy night in GDOC at Aldergrove dialling them randomly until a sweet sounding young lass answered... If you got really lucky phone sex was an option... It doesn't sound like much but 3 months in NI does funny things to a young man's hormones... :}

Ah, I thought this thread was going to highlight this story, no wonder there are problems:

Do the 'operators' still have the habit of 'dropping' you on to any old number just to meet their targets?:mad:

Dialled '222' once for the Fire Section ... only to be answered in Glasgow asking all sorts of crass questions - fortunately the Section reacted before our super efficient phone service could put me through!!!!!:uhoh::mad:

That was all over a decade ago ... hopefully things have changed?

No if you ring 222 still get answered in Glasgow ! and loads of questions are asked, during a practice fire it was quicker to ring the fire section first then 222.

Why are you only allowed to ask for one number! Needed to speak to 3 sections at one unit but was told it was MOD policy to only give you one number and I'd have to ring back for the other 2 numbers. Solution phone the first number and ask them for the other numbers - if it was a proper service you would not have to do that!

Awful, awful service of the absolute lowest order....
My personal favourite:
Me - "Can you put me through to HMS Raleigh Wardroom please?"
Op - "She's at sea"
Me - "that's surprising... she's a shore establishment"

Even more infuriating is trying to contact a ship at sea from a civvy line. It's almost impossible. A tip for anyone needing to do this though - call the Whitehall operator. They'll do it for you.

It's not all bad.

Some years ago I needed to contact urgently #2 son who was at sea chasing away all those nasty Spanish trawlers.

I rang the MoD to speak to the duty Commander who said he would get said son to ring me back. Ten minutes later I'm speaking with him via the ship's Satphone.

Pretty good, I thought.

Last week a colleague was trying to call in sick and her boss's phone wasn't taking voice mail so she decided to call me. She didn't know my extension so she rang the operator who said I didn't exist. I found this out when colleague came back to work so I thought I'd ring the operator....

"Hello, can I have the number for Mr xxxx at ABC, please?"
"There's no-one with that name there"
"Yes there is, me. I can see my details on the Defence Directory and I want to know why you can't"
"I'm sorry sir, what's the Defence Directory?":ugh:

'nuff said?

Mac,

Assuming that at least one of your questions is neither rhetorical nor sarcastic

The Defence Directory may be accessed on line through the Defence Intranet. You may search for a person or a post and it will give you the unit, telephone number and email address.

Or it should.

There is a problem with DD in that it is an individual responsibility to notify the centre of your new post when you move. A further problem is that one post can only be filled by one person; this causes a problem during handover/takeover. Of course you have to have an entry to correct it.

Sad to say, many people don't realise they are in the DD and many are down by post only and not by name and post.

Riskman's point I think was obvious.

Just ask to make a MENTOR service call. Then smirk with satisfaction knowing how much its costing the MOD!

Sad I know but.....

I used to know someone who worked for DCSA.

The reason they will only give you 1 number is because........

it's 50p per number that they give you (or it was a few years ago) so that is why they will only give you one number and make you ring back if you want another one

If you ask to be connected once they have given you the number the MOD is billed 50p for the operator to connect you.

Why? Yes you guessed it, it's in the contract. Another PFI marvel; is it any wonder we cannot afford decent kit.

Many years ago there was a great thread on PPRuNe entitled "Dial 192 and Speak to a Numpty" (IIRC). I know for a fact it was printed off and put in front of the Major General in charge of DCSA. It was full of wonderful gems, such as the person who was told there was no 'Empty Section at RAF *******" (instead of MT), however he dismissed it as exaggerated stories and that the system was working fine.

Also in the contract was that units could no longer produce their own telephone directories and the old RAF "intergalactic telephone directory", which listed all of the numbers on every station (remember having to amend that as a holding officer?) had to cease publication.:ugh:

Thanks for the tip-offs years ago about the Dumbarton dummies and their 'call dumping' ploy to increase revenue, Roly!

It did amuse me to try to call OC101 once, only to be told he didn't exist...:\ He was most amused when I told him.

Ah - the good old days at Brawdy (1975-6) when the phones didn't even have dials. You just picked up the phone and some aged Druid connected you to the appropriate extension.

Remember when cross-country calls involved a series of progressively fainter old biddies chatting to eachother ("Central...click, click, Rothwell Haigh please, dear...click, click...Machrihanish please....click, click...."Hullooo, RAF Machrihanish here....")? And the occasional screech of "ARE YOU WORKING??!!" if you dared to pause for thought in mid-call!

A mate using this system once got pissed off when it well went dead "Ah f*ck it, the bastard telephone's gone t*ts up. Bolleaux!" he muttered to no-one in particular, only to be chastised by some vexed harpy who retorted "There's no call for language like that, young man, I'm trying to connect you!".

Dial-a-mate worked fine in the 80s and 90s. But getting rid of station operators in favour of failed burger-flippers at call centres proved a total disaster.

Thank heavens for cellphones!

Incidentally, does anybody know what you dial to get MOD Operator these days?

Daft question I know, but 100 / 192 are both coming up as dead / disconnected and even the Comms guys here didn't realise that was the case. Has the number changed and the MOD just not bothered to tell anyone?

I used the Mil 192 system two days ago, didn't get the number I needed :ugh:, but they did answer, you may have had a local problem.

I think it's more worrying that your local Comms people was such little help.

Melchett

Not all stations have access to 100/192 because of the cost. ISTR a few years ago it simply just stopped working at a unit I was at, and it was explained that, at a cost of £1 a call, it was cheaper to give most people outside line (0 level) access from the desktop. Of course this was done before the databases (Def Dir etc) were actually in place, so chaos ensued until we worked out that you could actually get to defence directories by dialing the 95xxx of a station that had it then 0 for the operator. I've done the same from outside the system (dialing Coltishall from home and then getting mod operator to connect me to a specific post at another station.

I also recall pointing out that all we needed was access to the same database that the BT numpties were using, but of course that too went against the contract.

The best piece of work ever done by an engineer (IMHO) was the production a couple of years ago of a sheet which gave all the access codes to get between the different systems (including secure). Particularly useful during Joint exercises and ops.

STH

It doesn't cost the MoD, x213a, it costs you.

It's not the Government's money but the taxpayers' money they waste on a part-time SoS, PFI, cr*p IT systems, unsuitable or non-existent kit, new kitchens, Sky subscriptions, taxis for shopping, grocery bills at Tesco, eating their way through the menu at the best Chinese in Hull (who ate all the fortune cookies?), employing family members, etc., etc., etc... :ugh:

£15K for William and Harry to attend a p*ss-up on the Island? A mere bagatelle. :E

So much easier to simply look at each Station's on-line telephone directory via the intranet. Or is that too simple and obvious? :confused:

Er actually yes, it is too simple.

How many messes have a convenient computer terminal in reception that you can use to access the intranet?

Have you tried to access the intranet from a PC that is not your workstation? On Dii/c it takes me about 2 hours to log on as it loads my profile. If the connection is down, forget it.

etc etc

yes, it is fine office to office but that is all.

Pontious, RAF_SARGE,

That's also bearing in mind that you can navigate the wretched intranet once you get on line. As Comic Book Guy would say: "Worst search engine ever."

STH - after much hunting around and finally getting hold of the DATO (having wasted an hour trying to find him as the number was wrong in the DDirectory / Stn phone book), it turns out the bean counters have nobbled us again.

RAF_SARGE .... erm yes tried that and wasted an hour of my time looking for the phone number of someone on my own station. The Station phone book and DDirectory is great - assuming it isn't topping the fiction list in all major bookstores as ours is. So cancelling MOD Operator calls is a bit of a problem if all the other options you're expected to use are about as accurate as a 100-1 punt on the first race at Newmarket.

Rather than wait until you are in the mess to realise that you need a no. you could always plan ahead? :ugh:

For the technophobes among you here's the plan.....enter the name you require into Outlook and then hit Ctrl + K. A nice convenient list of surnames will then appear. Simply scoll down to your mate and right click onto properties. Hey presto the telephone number will appear before your eyes! The shock being, the GPTN number will also appear....... Now that's MAGIC

With me so far, good. Here's the clever bit, when you are chatting with your mate / mates, ask them for their mobile number. Hang on I'll repeat that as it is quite advanced for some, mobile number, and then simply store it in your phone. Coo blimey guvnor, the man's a genious.

Give me stength...............:ugh:

p.s, if you mate doesn't give you his / her no. take the hint. :rolleyes:

I have never and I do mean never been given a correct number from the MOD OP...

Only a couple of weeks ago, was driving from Scampton to Cranditz was running a little late so thought I would let Tutor Sqn know... Obviously on a hands free.


I called MODOP and was told Tutor sqn didnt exist... I explained it did and what it did... Was then asked who did I want to speak with only to be told xx didnt work there. Anyone else I thought, Ops desk, quiet room etc.... was told that number not listed.

Ok I thought, go for Ops instead to pass the message on... Ops didnt exist!

Go for ATC I thought...

Them 'Who In Headquarters Air Cadets did I wish to speak to?'

When I explained not that sort of ATC I was told 'well there isnt another one unless you mean the Army cadets... and we dont have a number for them'.

'Air Traffic Control at Cranwell those fellows who... oh never mind....'

Them 'Who in Air Traffic?'

Me 'I dont know who is working today..... Lets go for the admin section... I dont know anyone in admins name though... '

Them 'well with out a name I cant put you through goodbye!'

Phoned again asking to speak to a supervisor and was cut off...

I was actually in the car park outside Tutors and I still hadnt been given a number! 50 minutes later!


And this wasnt the first time they have been obstructive either!

What a waste of money they really are!! :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Ah, come on fellas, where would the sport be if you didn't have the useless MOD operators to fill your hours on the ground, think of all the other stuff you could do if you weren't wasting time with individuals who wouldn't be employed stacking shelves for Tescos as they couldn't recognise the items correct location!

No the bad old days of having station operators who new everything about thier environment, and those who worked there, could never catch on again, I mean imagine someone actually knowing what they were talking about! Lord forbid!

Of course we should really count our bleeings with the useless fools we have, the next cost cuting step will be to outsorce to an Indian call centre based in Mumbai, not that really will be interesting! My frustration is even more pointed as I do not have access to the MOD intranet whilst being posted overseas and I rely heavily on the MOD operator for (a lack of) assistance! :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Thankyou Pontius, I thought better to be brief than boring, however some people have to have the alphabet laid out every time....

I phoned the MoD operator to check what contact details they had against my name and post because a colleague, who couldn't remember my ext no, had been unable to get in touch from off-site. She was told I didn't exist in their little world and I rang to find out why. The reasons are the same as for DII, JPA and numerous other out-sourced, so called "services" that cost money that was better spent by FLCs; lousy contracting.:ugh::*

Hopefully, Mac, you will realise now that we don't phone ourselves to see if we're in; we Dd ourselves (a bit like googling but you should only get one hit);)

RAF_SARGE,

Your explanation re Outlook is correct yet fatally flawed in the way so many ideas are which come from people with nothing to declare but their genius.

The primary thrust of this thread was about getting sense from the MoD operator when off site ie on a train, in a car, in a desert even! Accessing Outlook assumes you are near a DII terminal. If I was near such a terminal I wouldn't need to ring the operator!:ugh:

Now here's a plan - check understanding, check again, then shoot from lip:=

I am not sure if you realise that the information the MOD Operators have is only as good as the information that's been supplied by the Station and how often it is updated. I know there are problems and I am not sticking up for them but there needs to be more education at unit level about the system.

Me: 202 Sqn Ops Leconfield please

Op: Leconsbeale?

Me: Leconsfield... I spell L E C O N S F I E L D, it's in Beverly, East Yorks

Op: I'm sorry it doesn't exist...

Me: :ugh::ugh::ugh: It does, trust me... I spell again.......

Eventually got through to the mess, which was better than nothing. :rolleyes:

Perhaps the poor dear was confused by the unnecessary S. An easy mistake I guess, along with the missing E From Beverley.:}

I all worked fine when we had a comcen. You could even phone a station and they would quite often know posts as well as the names of people in said posts. The new way is another classic example of how privatisation looks good on paper and is actually a retrograde step.

Now what about the Single Point of Contact. I phone the SPOC and leave a message for someone sitting on my station. I go flying and then a message is left by the person on my base telling me to phone the SPOC. I phone the SPOC and leave a message for someone sitting on my station. I go flying............ result = it is all fine if you are a rubber desk johnny but if you do a flying job (which I think is the aim of the Royal AIR Force) your computer never seems to get seen to.........

It is a question of scale and manning, oh and change.

Scale = if there are 2000 personnel on a unit (remember both service and civilian) then may be a quarter change every year. Therefore there are 2 personnel changes per day. "It is the individual's responsibility." This may be true but it also follows that there is a huge education bill. Many people do not change in the 4 years but when they do, telling DD of their move is likely to be low down on their priority list. Far more logical for the process to be part of HRMS and the Joke Pers Admin system.

Manning = who would do the education?

Change = units are changing long established names for new forward thinking based on change being agile and adaptable and, they hope, capable. :)

Unfortunately people being people have not got a change module they can plug in to their brains. How many people talking of BSA mean CEA? How many people ask the operator for Base Support Wing or Admin Wing? A local unit renamed PSF and PMS; cleverly they retained the initials. Don't ask me what the new names were as they used the old ones in orders the other day.

Change is endemic but almost impossible to learn if you are outside the system.

Acronyms are another minefield. My colonel said that we could continue to get Defence Accomodation Stores from the same source; we thanked him but said we actually meant Directorate of Airspace Services. A contractor in Dumbarton? No chance.

Rang the help desk.

How does your search engine work as it keeps telling me Nul Points?

She told me.

How come it can't find a document that I have on the Intranet and is displayed on my screen at the moment?

You are using the wrong search button.

Doh!

~~~~~~~

Get a spelling wrong and Google gives you the right answer and at the same time asks you if your incorrect spelling was really what you want.

If they switched to Google there would propably be a 10 year delay as the security hounds checked to make sure there were no leaks. You have to admit the intranet search engine is very secure.

Oh yes, can't argue that it's so secure that it keeps documents to itself!

HI ALL...
cant believe you all think bad of us when we try our best to provide a good service, i admit sometimes we dont know what some abreviations mean etc...but its not worth crying about it, and thanks to whoever it was sayin we only work there coz we failed our exam to get into woolworths...its a good job we did otherwise we'd all be out of jobs now!!

anyhows, we hope you continue to use us and be extra nice to us lol ;);)

Natalie here is a tip for you:

Try harder.










A lot harder:}