RAAF Pilot Pay.. .what the??
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RAAF Pilot Pay.. .what the??
Anyone noticed how RAAF junior pilots are almost the lowest paid of all officers given that Air Traffic, Logistics, Engineers etc all receive bonuses because of recruiting problems.
Just curious of the thoughts out there on the topic??
$15,000 extra for a tower rating at an airfield with one runway and one taxiway???
Just curious of the thoughts out there on the topic??
$15,000 extra for a tower rating at an airfield with one runway and one taxiway???
Last edited by Pass-A-Frozo; 3rd Jun 2003 at 21:51.
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Pass-a
"$15,000 extra for a tower rating at an airfield with one runway and one taxiway???
A pilot only has to land on one runway and taxi on one taxiway at a time so whats your problem....
Reroll to ATC and get your $15,000...and of course your free copy of "Pushing Tin"!
A pilot only has to land on one runway and taxi on one taxiway at a time so whats your problem....
Reroll to ATC and get your $15,000...and of course your free copy of "Pushing Tin"!
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I'm sure the bonus has been awarded in the same vein as the RAF has awarded some aircrew. I assume that if there is a retention or recruitment problem, it doesn't matter what branch or trade is involved.
It might also make some realise that the ground trades are just as valuable as the aircrew.
It might also make some realise that the ground trades are just as valuable as the aircrew.
ATC & Pilot similarities
Surditas - You've just highlighted the similarities between Air Trafficers & Pilots...
Pilots "cannot fly ten aircraft at once" just as Air Trafficers cannot control ten aircraft at once!!!
Pilots "cannot fly ten aircraft at once" just as Air Trafficers cannot control ten aircraft at once!!!
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No need to pay them heaps when they have a ROSO that reaches into the next decade...
Save the money on the boggies and put it into obscene salaries for those in the post-ROSO stage of their career I say!
Save the money on the boggies and put it into obscene salaries for those in the post-ROSO stage of their career I say!
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How about get rid of the Air Trafficers and give us a Mandatory Broadcast Zone. It would be safer. 
Pilots can't fly ten aircraft at once? Well the failed pilots who are now ATC's couldn't fly one ...
Pilots can't fly ten aircraft at once? Well the failed pilots who are now ATC's couldn't fly one ...
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Didn't the RAAF give their pilots (only?) a big bonus about 12 years ago when they were all leaving in droves? I recall it had some bizarre rules attached, like you had to spend it all in the one year to avoid paying tax on it.
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Yeah... some of us do.. if your not at Willytown between 0934 to 0936 (and the ATC officer isn't out smoking during that time) it's an MBZ 
The ATC officers are out spending there bonus.
Pilot retention is solved with ROSO. Every other cat is resolved with $$$. They got rid of the retention bonus as far as I know.
The ATC officers are out spending there bonus.Pilot retention is solved with ROSO. Every other cat is resolved with $$$. They got rid of the retention bonus as far as I know.
Sign of the times?
The traditional poachers of RAAF pilots in disarray.
So great the surplus many airlines now require type ratings and have little regard for traditional military multi-engine experience-Hercs, Orions etc.
737 a good rating and the new tanker 767/330 would be handy too.
ATC Contracts in the Middle East now exceed those of First Officers. Again signs of the times.
The traditional poachers of RAAF pilots in disarray.
So great the surplus many airlines now require type ratings and have little regard for traditional military multi-engine experience-Hercs, Orions etc.
737 a good rating and the new tanker 767/330 would be handy too.
ATC Contracts in the Middle East now exceed those of First Officers. Again signs of the times.
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Pass-A-Frozo
Did you get dumped by an ATC babe recently or are you just one of those GD types that hasn't realized the importance of the ATC fraternity?
If you really want to grizzle, pull the pin on taxi driving and come and join me here in the Middle East on $85,000 US (tax free of course!) with house supplied and lotsa beaches.....hey and I don't even control one runway!!
If you aren't happy with the service conditions you should have worked harder at school and got a job as an Air Traffic Controller.
If you really want to grizzle, pull the pin on taxi driving and come and join me here in the Middle East on $85,000 US (tax free of course!) with house supplied and lotsa beaches.....hey and I don't even control one runway!!
If you aren't happy with the service conditions you should have worked harder at school and got a job as an Air Traffic Controller.
Last edited by Fox3snapshot; 5th Jun 2003 at 15:44.
F3 We all know how important ATC is, its just that they are never there anymore. Unless you are grey and have an 18 in your name, no ATC for you!
And who hasn't been dumped by an ATC babe!!
Give them a ROSO I say!!!
And who hasn't been dumped by an ATC babe!!
Give them a ROSO I say!!!
Isn't this just market forces?
Just because ATCs can't control their bowel movements doesn't mean they're not in demand. Therefore the RAAF or whoever has to pay. Pilots on the other hand are currently on the wrong part of the peak/trough cycle that the RAAF/airline industry goes through every 5 (insert number of choice) years or so. They're never 'poached', just attracted by a better lifestyle. If the RAAF sorted out all the lifestyle issues, it wouldn't have to match airline salaries.
In any event would a $15K bonus make you want to watch pilots having fun all day?
CS.
Just because ATCs can't control their bowel movements doesn't mean they're not in demand. Therefore the RAAF or whoever has to pay. Pilots on the other hand are currently on the wrong part of the peak/trough cycle that the RAAF/airline industry goes through every 5 (insert number of choice) years or so. They're never 'poached', just attracted by a better lifestyle. If the RAAF sorted out all the lifestyle issues, it wouldn't have to match airline salaries.
In any event would a $15K bonus make you want to watch pilots having fun all day?
CS.
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I took the bonus and still left!
Unfortunately had to pay ALL the bonus PLUS TAX back.
Luckily my accountant managed to get some overpaid tax back.
what a sham
Pity the man managers have their head in the sand.
They could have easily kept some 'experienced' individuals if they wanted to.
Retention in RAAF was (IS) a joke!!
.
Unfortunately had to pay ALL the bonus PLUS TAX back.
Luckily my accountant managed to get some overpaid tax back.
what a sham
Pity the man managers have their head in the sand.
They could have easily kept some 'experienced' individuals if they wanted to.
Retention in RAAF was (IS) a joke!!
.
PPRuNe's favourite BABE!!
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ATCs can't control their bowel movements
Promise I am house trained but I dont bring slippers to the front door, it's not in the job discription!!
And who hasn't been dumped by an ATC babe!!
As I'm the only official one on pprune can I just say it wasn't me....Innocent until proven guilty..
I'll slope off to my civvie forums now, sorry for the intrusion.
Speaking of RAAF pilot retention....
Does anyone know how the Pilot Sustainability Project is going at the moment? Did that 2 hour survey we did last year actually make any difference? You know the one:
Would you stay if
a) flying pay was in superannuation and
b) you were paid an extra $180,000 every three years and
c) you could keep flying no matter what and
d) any other pipe dream you can think of.....
In answer to that ATC bonus gripe, who cares. I'll be quite happy with my 30K flying pay every year. Besides, pilots aren't the highest paid aircrew anyway. Flight Test Engineers get the engineer bonus as well as flying pay.
What really bugs me is that there are pilots out there with stuff all captain time and no postgraduate quals who still rake in max flying pay while better guys who are TP's, QFI's, FCI's or Check Captains (happy Fishhead?) get nothing for their extra responsibility or effort. Bring on captain/QFI/TP/FCI allowance....
ruprecht.
Does anyone know how the Pilot Sustainability Project is going at the moment? Did that 2 hour survey we did last year actually make any difference? You know the one:
Would you stay if
a) flying pay was in superannuation and
b) you were paid an extra $180,000 every three years and
c) you could keep flying no matter what and
d) any other pipe dream you can think of.....
In answer to that ATC bonus gripe, who cares. I'll be quite happy with my 30K flying pay every year. Besides, pilots aren't the highest paid aircrew anyway. Flight Test Engineers get the engineer bonus as well as flying pay.
What really bugs me is that there are pilots out there with stuff all captain time and no postgraduate quals who still rake in max flying pay while better guys who are TP's, QFI's, FCI's or Check Captains (happy Fishhead?) get nothing for their extra responsibility or effort. Bring on captain/QFI/TP/FCI allowance....
ruprecht.
Pilot sustainability project = "no longer required"...!!!
From a very reliable source (ie someone with lots of stripes on those epaulette thingies) the PSP basically wheezed and died along with post-RAAF aviation employment opportunities!
It seems that like most bureaucratic endeavours, this one was all show and no substance - as the external employment options disappeared so did management's interest in retaining aircrew. Shortsightedness is an artform to these people: who wants to wager that in 3-4 years the RAAF will be out of the 'trough' and back at the 'peak' of personnel loss, to once again watch a stampede of B-cats/FCIs/TPs et al exit stage right.
I shudder to think what a cross-section of a RAAF operational squadron will reveal in terms of experience levels post 2007.
I guess we can consign the PSP to the "Nunn review" box and set our sights a bit lower: Does anyone have any info on the "class action" being taken to roll in flying pay to our wage for super purposes? Who is coordinating it (ArFFA?) and where do I send my contributions?!?
It seems that like most bureaucratic endeavours, this one was all show and no substance - as the external employment options disappeared so did management's interest in retaining aircrew. Shortsightedness is an artform to these people: who wants to wager that in 3-4 years the RAAF will be out of the 'trough' and back at the 'peak' of personnel loss, to once again watch a stampede of B-cats/FCIs/TPs et al exit stage right.
I shudder to think what a cross-section of a RAAF operational squadron will reveal in terms of experience levels post 2007.
I guess we can consign the PSP to the "Nunn review" box and set our sights a bit lower: Does anyone have any info on the "class action" being taken to roll in flying pay to our wage for super purposes? Who is coordinating it (ArFFA?) and where do I send my contributions?!?
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Booger,
hope you're finding the office comfortable! Who wants to go to Perth anyway - fantastic weather, 8-til-4 office hours, three sorties a day with no prep...actually....now that I think of it...LOSER!
I mention the flying pay into super issue to the boss as often as I think I can get away with it. Unfortunately (but understandably), in his mind, it gets lumped in with all the redresses from boxpackers who think that their $200 a day tax free allowances for fighting the warehouse war in Qatar should also be rolled into their super!
I'm making the point to him that we need to separate "skill based" allowances from "environmental" allowances to get some clarity on the issue. Unfortunately, then you have to deal with field allowance, seagoing allowance, parachuting allowance etc. Unfortunately, you end up with phone-book sized numbers down the track, all of which will have to be ponied up by the taxpayer at some point.
anyway, at least it's still being considered, although it's not always as simple as we might hope (my god, aren't I starting to sound like a company man!)
enjoy the queensland wx - -1 and foggy here this morning.
SW
hope you're finding the office comfortable! Who wants to go to Perth anyway - fantastic weather, 8-til-4 office hours, three sorties a day with no prep...actually....now that I think of it...LOSER!
I mention the flying pay into super issue to the boss as often as I think I can get away with it. Unfortunately (but understandably), in his mind, it gets lumped in with all the redresses from boxpackers who think that their $200 a day tax free allowances for fighting the warehouse war in Qatar should also be rolled into their super!
I'm making the point to him that we need to separate "skill based" allowances from "environmental" allowances to get some clarity on the issue. Unfortunately, then you have to deal with field allowance, seagoing allowance, parachuting allowance etc. Unfortunately, you end up with phone-book sized numbers down the track, all of which will have to be ponied up by the taxpayer at some point.
anyway, at least it's still being considered, although it's not always as simple as we might hope (my god, aren't I starting to sound like a company man!)
enjoy the queensland wx - -1 and foggy here this morning.
SW
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You don't get the full $15K for a Tower Rating anyway...........
It's an incremental thing - to get the full $15K you need to be Approach Rated/Supervisor/Training Officer, have been to at least two bases, one of which has to be "busy" like Williamtown or Darwin.
I get it, but then again I'm as old as the hills...........
Keep your mouth shut Fox3!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's an incremental thing - to get the full $15K you need to be Approach Rated/Supervisor/Training Officer, have been to at least two bases, one of which has to be "busy" like Williamtown or Darwin.
I get it, but then again I'm as old as the hills...........
Keep your mouth shut Fox3!!!!!!!!!!!!!