returning F3s
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Hornets Nest
Obvioulsy touched a raw nerve there! 
If I'd spent numerous hours patrolling sausage side without a huge amout to do I'd be pretty annoyed!
As for carrying ALARMS.....I'm afraid it was a case of too little to late. Besides your if performance in Resinate was anything to go by (Jettisioning all your stores and trying to OLF in southern Iraq for 20 minutes ring any bells?) I wouldn't trust you to carry them! I'm assured they were good fun to poop off though!
As I cast my line into the water waiting for a nibble............
If I'd spent numerous hours patrolling sausage side without a huge amout to do I'd be pretty annoyed!
As for carrying ALARMS.....I'm afraid it was a case of too little to late. Besides your if performance in Resinate was anything to go by (Jettisioning all your stores and trying to OLF in southern Iraq for 20 minutes ring any bells?) I wouldn't trust you to carry them! I'm assured they were good fun to poop off though!
As I cast my line into the water waiting for a nibble............
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Lets face it F3 boys, your boss did you no favours with that self important, supremist attitude e-mail that he sent to the rest of the det here at secret air base no1. If you didn't spend most of your time looking down your nose at the rest of the aircrew, you wouldn't get so much stick.
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This all very entertaning and redolent of the flak flying around between the Vs and the fighters after Musketeer (Suez). At least all the FJs semed to get into theatre OK - to contradict the idiot journo in the Torygraph who said that they were stuck in Cyprus and could not get overflight clearance to make it to Kuwait. That was seized on, of course, by sundry retired FAA codgers who wrote letters demanding a fleet of bloody great carriers and the takeover of the RAF by the RN. In fact I seem to remember a predictable thread along those lines appearing in this hallowed forum. 
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I heard they had to come home cos they need all the 5 star hotels in that part of the world for retired Iraqi generals.
Mind you, must have been hell, heard that some of them asked for the air con to be turned down cos it got too cold.
Mind you, must have been hell, heard that some of them asked for the air con to be turned down cos it got too cold.
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Impartial Observer
As an impartial observer I think the whole thread is degeneating into a 'my-plane's-better-than-yours' argument.
The GR4 is obviously the queen of the skies with the best aircrew the RAF has to offer (who weren't good enough to go AD and have a huge chip on their shoulder to show for it!) - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, they're obviously very very brave and will bore you with tales of daring-do should you have the misfortune to speak to one in the bar - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, their $hit-throwing operations are the pride of the RAF - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, their grammar and punctuation is second-to-none and an obvious example of somebody who's been on the jet for one Det and think they're the bees knees because they've dropped on a static target WITHOUT AN AIR THREAT- or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Just a question.
The GR4 is obviously the queen of the skies with the best aircrew the RAF has to offer (who weren't good enough to go AD and have a huge chip on their shoulder to show for it!) - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, they're obviously very very brave and will bore you with tales of daring-do should you have the misfortune to speak to one in the bar - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, their $hit-throwing operations are the pride of the RAF - or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Yes, their grammar and punctuation is second-to-none and an obvious example of somebody who's been on the jet for one Det and think they're the bees knees because they've dropped on a static target WITHOUT AN AIR THREAT- or is that just the GR4telicmate ****?
Just a question.
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Dude does the phrase glass houses ring any bells? Perhaps you should speak to some of your alledged compadres about accidently jettisoning Aim 9's when going for the tanks or deciding not to react too vigorously to a spike in case you spill your coffee only to watch two Goa's sail not so serenely past......
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Good banter chaps, however..........
Are you just jealous that we fired off the first AIM-9L in Iraq? Correct me if I'm wrong but the Tornado F3 has never fired a weapon at anyone in anger at anytime!
If I spent my entire career flogging around the skies "playing pretend" and had nothing to show for it I'd be off to the airlines.
Did anyone mention the fact that one of the returning jets to Leuchars ran out of fuel and diverted into Marham? (Can't wait for a response to that one!)
At the end of the day it's just a laugh and anyone that has taken this banter to heart needs to have a serious word with themselves!!!
See you in OTA C when we bring the Swing Winged Messenger of Death home.
Are you just jealous that we fired off the first AIM-9L in Iraq? Correct me if I'm wrong but the Tornado F3 has never fired a weapon at anyone in anger at anytime!
If I spent my entire career flogging around the skies "playing pretend" and had nothing to show for it I'd be off to the airlines.
Did anyone mention the fact that one of the returning jets to Leuchars ran out of fuel and diverted into Marham? (Can't wait for a response to that one!)
At the end of the day it's just a laugh and anyone that has taken this banter to heart needs to have a serious word with themselves!!!
See you in OTA C when we bring the Swing Winged Messenger of Death home.
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What's your point?
GR4telicc*nt wrote
'...Did anyone mention the fact that one of the returning jets to Leuchars ran out of fuel and diverted into Marham?...'
SHOCK HORROR, HOLD THE FRONT PAGE. Tornado F3 burns more gas with flap failure from Akrotiri and needs more gas. What would you have done then? Continued till you flamed out then ejected? Get the facts straight before you sling $hit or you'll look like a complete **** (it might be too late already!)
Anyway, let's not forget you started this rant because the GR4 wasn't getting enough publicity and the F3 got some good press. Good to see Tony Blair up at Leuchars today meeting the brave AD boys who helped keep Saddam's fighters off your sorry a$$es. Much as I wouldn't like to see you guys get to meet one for real, I'd like to see your best gameplan against a Mirage F1 or Mig21 when it mattered. How would a fully laden underpowered 'Swing Winged Messenger of Death' rate against a Mig29?
. Meat on the street!
'...Did anyone mention the fact that one of the returning jets to Leuchars ran out of fuel and diverted into Marham?...'
SHOCK HORROR, HOLD THE FRONT PAGE. Tornado F3 burns more gas with flap failure from Akrotiri and needs more gas. What would you have done then? Continued till you flamed out then ejected? Get the facts straight before you sling $hit or you'll look like a complete **** (it might be too late already!)
Anyway, let's not forget you started this rant because the GR4 wasn't getting enough publicity and the F3 got some good press. Good to see Tony Blair up at Leuchars today meeting the brave AD boys who helped keep Saddam's fighters off your sorry a$$es. Much as I wouldn't like to see you guys get to meet one for real, I'd like to see your best gameplan against a Mirage F1 or Mig21 when it mattered. How would a fully laden underpowered 'Swing Winged Messenger of Death' rate against a Mig29?
. Meat on the street!
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ftrplt
you're right about the F3, but I think a Mig29 would be fairly easy to defeat BVR with its poor radar, the point is the GR4 doesn't have a BVR capability.
MarkD
I think the 9L was fired at the mystical 'SWITCH PIGS' that seem to haunt the GR1s/4s over the desert!!!
you're right about the F3, but I think a Mig29 would be fairly easy to defeat BVR with its poor radar, the point is the GR4 doesn't have a BVR capability.
MarkD
I think the 9L was fired at the mystical 'SWITCH PIGS' that seem to haunt the GR1s/4s over the desert!!!
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F3 RTB
Please accept an apology on behalf of the GR4 fleet in situ. I think all players did a fine job, especially the CJ that shot back at a Patriot. However, the sooner they fit RAPTOR to the F3 the better!
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Sure the GR4 doesn't have a BVR capability (it's a BOMBER) but the F3 one is hardly credible! The Yanks would certainly wouldn't let it be used in Iraq because it lacks the necessary interrogation equipment. And why would they use the F3 with it's Sky SLUG or an AMRAAM with only a limited capability?
As for performance, I think that a GR4 in the same configuration as an F3 would be fairly even. Granted it does have slightly less thrust but it weighs less.
You boys do a good job making a fighter out of a bomber when history has shown that it only works the other way round e.g. F1-11, F-4, F-15. Who are you going to beat in ACM when the Italians retire the Starfighter?
As for performance, I think that a GR4 in the same configuration as an F3 would be fairly even. Granted it does have slightly less thrust but it weighs less.
You boys do a good job making a fighter out of a bomber when history has shown that it only works the other way round e.g. F1-11, F-4, F-15. Who are you going to beat in ACM when the Italians retire the Starfighter?
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gr4telicmate - maybe the F3 is not the world's greatest fighter but I have no doubt that you would not take it on live armed in your bomber. If you cannot walk the walk I suggest you stop the talk.
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I agree TC27. In the meantime no doubt the F3 crews will continue to do an outstanding job with the kit they have - kit that is by no means outstanding but enables well trained professionals to hold their own in most scenarios. It would be nice to have the benefit of better engine and airframe performance but until Typhoon arrives in service the F3 crews will have to rely on their ability.
