Pprune and military security
Thread Starter
Pprune and military security
I thought I might drop the puck on the ice and see what happens...
How close to the wind do you believe some posts here on Pprune sail with respect to sensitive material? As professionals we are all cognizant of the need to be restrained in our debate on a public forum with, at the end of the day, people who's identity can't be verified. Whilst I appreciate that this is the norm, we have all seen from Day 1 of service life the security videos (that horrid snake with the lisp?) about collection etc and how a suprisingly accurate picture can be built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info. In isolation, things mentioned on these forums probably aren't worth a pinch of value, but together, do you think a bigger picture can be assembled...flying rates/squadron morale/overstretched resources etc; even more specific things like "well when we put this pod here blah we carry one less blah missile here blah..."
I know a standard response would be "yes but it is already in the public domain" to which I would reply "fine, let people trot off and hunt it down themselves rather that simpy log on here and get it from the horse's mouth".
No, I'm not paranoid, just been ticking over in the back of my mind, that's all!
Thoughts?
How close to the wind do you believe some posts here on Pprune sail with respect to sensitive material? As professionals we are all cognizant of the need to be restrained in our debate on a public forum with, at the end of the day, people who's identity can't be verified. Whilst I appreciate that this is the norm, we have all seen from Day 1 of service life the security videos (that horrid snake with the lisp?) about collection etc and how a suprisingly accurate picture can be built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info. In isolation, things mentioned on these forums probably aren't worth a pinch of value, but together, do you think a bigger picture can be assembled...flying rates/squadron morale/overstretched resources etc; even more specific things like "well when we put this pod here blah we carry one less blah missile here blah..."
I know a standard response would be "yes but it is already in the public domain" to which I would reply "fine, let people trot off and hunt it down themselves rather that simpy log on here and get it from the horse's mouth".
No, I'm not paranoid, just been ticking over in the back of my mind, that's all!
Thoughts?
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Indeed there is a difference between trade press saying/guessing something about a piece of kit and it being confirmed by someone who actually uses it everyday thus giving it pseudo-official confirmation.
Common sense is the key I believe! There are not many posts here that "sail close to the wind". After all we all signed up to the same Act that David Shayler was prosecuted under. Therefore it would not be wise to post sensative stuff on here.
I have it on good authority though, that the UK spooks have ways and means of easily finding out who is who, so prudence is the key too !!
I have it on good authority though, that the UK spooks have ways and means of easily finding out who is who, so prudence is the key too !!
Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair.
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The US spooks spy on the UK and the UK spooks spy on the US, the information is then swapped so that the governments can honestly deny that they monitor their citizens email. Simple really!
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Double Asymmetric
How right you are
"we have all seen from Day 1 of service life the security videos (that horrid snake with the lisp?) about collection etc and how a suprisingly accurate picture can be built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info."
Next time I want to improve my 'security' credentials to somebody in a pub that I am trying to elicit information out of I'll mention the snake and the lisp. With a bit of luck he might spill more of the beans than he would of done as he will assume I am in the know talking about a bit of trivia like the snake. *
"... built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info."
* = I wouldn't really
How right you are
"we have all seen from Day 1 of service life the security videos (that horrid snake with the lisp?) about collection etc and how a suprisingly accurate picture can be built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info."
Next time I want to improve my 'security' credentials to somebody in a pub that I am trying to elicit information out of I'll mention the snake and the lisp. With a bit of luck he might spill more of the beans than he would of done as he will assume I am in the know talking about a bit of trivia like the snake. *
"... built up from many seemingly harmless bits of trivial info."
* = I wouldn't really
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Totally understand the concerns, but if the ill-founded rumour (exactly what this site is for
), uninformed gossip, and blatant bu££$h!t that has been written on here about my a/c type over the past 2 years is anything to go by, then we've got very little to worry about.
), uninformed gossip, and blatant bu££$h!t that has been written on here about my a/c type over the past 2 years is anything to go by, then we've got very little to worry about.
It's a concern that's expressed every now and again, and bearing in mind that I am a journo, and that I may be using this post to deliberately trying to provoke everyone to suddenly divulge all there is to know about Nimrod R, WE177 etc...
I have to say that people's common sense is such that nothing leaks here, and those known to be (and credible as) frontline aircrew are very successful in keeping their lips zipped on what should rightly be sensitive.
Where PPRuNe probably does stray too close to the line is in revealing what may be politically embarrassing, and which the OSA is often used to protect.
But keeping procurement cock-ups, man management failures and the like under wraps will merely ensure that they recur.
I have to say that people's common sense is such that nothing leaks here, and those known to be (and credible as) frontline aircrew are very successful in keeping their lips zipped on what should rightly be sensitive.
Where PPRuNe probably does stray too close to the line is in revealing what may be politically embarrassing, and which the OSA is often used to protect.
But keeping procurement cock-ups, man management failures and the like under wraps will merely ensure that they recur.
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DA
"I know a standard response would be "yes but it is already in the public domain" to which I would reply "fine, let people trot off and hunt it down themselves rather that simpy log on here and get it from the horse's mouth".
Which horse is that then? These are anonymous forums, and the posts on them carry no weight of credibility whatsoever. Bootscooter has hit the nail on the head: there's as much rubbish published here as there is in the tabloids.
"I know a standard response would be "yes but it is already in the public domain" to which I would reply "fine, let people trot off and hunt it down themselves rather that simpy log on here and get it from the horse's mouth".
Which horse is that then? These are anonymous forums, and the posts on them carry no weight of credibility whatsoever. Bootscooter has hit the nail on the head: there's as much rubbish published here as there is in the tabloids.
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Bovine excrement
There is a lot of BS posted on this board, but there is also an awful lot of information which should not be there. As usual with situations like these, the right thing to do is somewhere in between the two. Be careful.
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I thought that Dr FOD and the wayward body was a better film and that one with Richard O'Sulivan as a Harrier pilot who almost crashed because he didn't get his egg on time in the mess. They don't make SSKC films like that any more, or perhaps they do but they don't make it up the A9.
Ahhhhhhh - Dr Fod and that lovely girl in the tight cheesecloth blouse (wasn't she Lesley Dunlop, Julie Dawn Cole or somesuch 70's honey?)! Remember her squirming around the Lightning intake and radome? Bug.gered if I can remember what that wonderfully non-PC FS video was all about - but she was a real babe!
Oh - and commenting on something found elsewhere in the public domain 'lends credence', I understand.....
Usual disclaimer - these comments are my own and are not intended to represent official comment, undermine morale, cause insurrection, plagues of frogs or lunar eclipses........
Oh - and commenting on something found elsewhere in the public domain 'lends credence', I understand.....
Usual disclaimer - these comments are my own and are not intended to represent official comment, undermine morale, cause insurrection, plagues of frogs or lunar eclipses........
That may not have been your intent, BEagle, but as the disembowelled amphibians splatter down from my ceiling, getting jammed between the keyboard keys, you'll forgive me if I lecture you about the road to Hull being paved with good intentions....
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I think the majority on this forum abide by the common sense security rules. Danny will instantly pull a topic if he is advised that the comments are sailing very close to the wind.
After all, the last thing we need is to have Pprune embroiled in a fight brought on by the Official Secrets Act. I'm quite sure that this and any other mil site is being monitored by the Feds; so far, therefore, self-policing seems to be working.
Oh, and Jacko - if you mention 51 Sqn or WE177 again, I'll send the hit squad round to break your legs!!
After all, the last thing we need is to have Pprune embroiled in a fight brought on by the Official Secrets Act. I'm quite sure that this and any other mil site is being monitored by the Feds; so far, therefore, self-policing seems to be working.
Oh, and Jacko - if you mention 51 Sqn or WE177 again, I'll send the hit squad round to break your legs!!
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BEagle
Prescott's A**e...isn't that El Presidente Tone??
Seriously, (ish), in the last few years that I've been reading and posting on PPRuNe - even before there was a Military Forum...BEagle, Jacko and Stopstart can remember it - I've only even seen a few contentious threads or posts. Some have been told to get back in their box by the more sensible contributors, while others have been removed either by Danny or another moderator to avoid any snags. On the whole I think we are a fairly responsible 'self policing' forum that tends to keep the important stuff for discussions in the crewroom rather than in public, hence the reason that we have no formal moderator.
Personally I think PPRuNe is much more valuable as a means to wind up some Crabs than as an intelligence asset!
Pulls on helmet and ducks, "Incoming!!"
Prescott's A**e...isn't that El Presidente Tone??
Seriously, (ish), in the last few years that I've been reading and posting on PPRuNe - even before there was a Military Forum...BEagle, Jacko and Stopstart can remember it - I've only even seen a few contentious threads or posts. Some have been told to get back in their box by the more sensible contributors, while others have been removed either by Danny or another moderator to avoid any snags. On the whole I think we are a fairly responsible 'self policing' forum that tends to keep the important stuff for discussions in the crewroom rather than in public, hence the reason that we have no formal moderator.
Personally I think PPRuNe is much more valuable as a means to wind up some Crabs than as an intelligence asset!
Pulls on helmet and ducks, "Incoming!!"
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Nothing to do with Woopert, but when you put a Jungly in the field, we've got to keep some reminder of the sea!!
Anyway, "Pulls on helmet and sea gulls.." doesn't have the same ring to it!
Anyway, "Pulls on helmet and sea gulls.." doesn't have the same ring to it!
