Amount of Military pilots with degrees.
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Amount of Military pilots with degrees.
I was wondering because I am in the process of deciding my university course, how many military pilots actually hold a degree?
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
It's well known that all the best pilots took degrees in Underwater Basket Weaving. This left them with more time for drinking and fornication. 
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Well that all depends upon which Air Force you might be refering to. In the US all Air Force and Navy pilots will have a degree as it is a requirement in order to be an officer. Canada used to not be a requirement but has now said that it is a must. Australia, NZ and the UK I believe is not a must. My experience has been about half will have a degree and out of those half only 1/4 will actually have one which could be applied to aviation.
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In the Army Air Corps almost all Direct Entrey Officers will be graduates, almost all NCO pilots and most Late Entry Officers will not have degrees, most not having any formal non-professional qualifications below A Levels.
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That's about the size of it, Flygunz. To get anywhere in the USAF you need a "Master's", which equates roughly to a 2/2 from a UK "plateglass". Even I, with a very ordinary class in PPE, was offered a lecturership in Economic History at the University of Nebraska!
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I suspect that my collegues are being unfair both to the US educational system and to those dedicated officers that work all day then study hard at home for many years to attain the Masters needed to advance beyond Major.
In the 80s the RAF was attempting to recruit about 1/3 of it's officers from the graduate population. Don't know it it achieved this. What you actually need to consider are the pros and cons of having a degree in the RAF, not whether all your mates will have one. On the plus side you will probably join as a more rounded individual and so increase your chances of surviving the training; it also gives you a fall back career if you don't. On the downside, you are a more rounded individual mainly because you are three years older than non-grads. This is not a problem in training, but those extra years will work to your disadvantage downstream if you intend to run the joint; the military can become quite ageist when it comes to promotion and command tours.
If you are tempted by the "In Service Degree" (an OU course), think very carefully about whether you will actually have the time and opportunity to study once in productive service.
In the 80s the RAF was attempting to recruit about 1/3 of it's officers from the graduate population. Don't know it it achieved this. What you actually need to consider are the pros and cons of having a degree in the RAF, not whether all your mates will have one. On the plus side you will probably join as a more rounded individual and so increase your chances of surviving the training; it also gives you a fall back career if you don't. On the downside, you are a more rounded individual mainly because you are three years older than non-grads. This is not a problem in training, but those extra years will work to your disadvantage downstream if you intend to run the joint; the military can become quite ageist when it comes to promotion and command tours.
If you are tempted by the "In Service Degree" (an OU course), think very carefully about whether you will actually have the time and opportunity to study once in productive service.
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I reckon about half to two-thirds of the current RAF pilot intake have degrees. Rumour control has it that the top brass are looking to reduce this proportion, because they want people to reach the front line aged 21 instead of 24. However, given that Tony apparently wants universal higher education, the pool of suitable non-graduates will surely reduce over the next few years (with the honourable exception, of course, of cadets who are so committed to a flying career that they decide to skip uni). As an aside, it's funny how often policy changes on this matter - six years ago a friend of mine applied to the RAF straight from sixth form and was told to go to uni first (without even being OASC'd)!
As regards your choice of subject, I would say it has absolutely no bearing at all on your career. Specialist knowledge from (e.g.) aerodynamic engineering or avionics degrees is not required - RAF training courses are designed to cater for the lowest common denominator. Some of your future colleagues may not have done maths or physics since GCSE! So go ahead and pick the course that you will enjoy the most...
As for choice of university, that's a different matter, and one that would prompt an eternity of bickering.... so I won't even go there!!
As regards your choice of subject, I would say it has absolutely no bearing at all on your career. Specialist knowledge from (e.g.) aerodynamic engineering or avionics degrees is not required - RAF training courses are designed to cater for the lowest common denominator. Some of your future colleagues may not have done maths or physics since GCSE! So go ahead and pick the course that you will enjoy the most...
As for choice of university, that's a different matter, and one that would prompt an eternity of bickering.... so I won't even go there!!
And the wheels on the bus go round and round......
Im 1968 the 'traditional' Cranwell course stopped being the preferred entry method (there was also some secondary modern place in Bedfordshire) and we were urged to become 'aerocrats' (yuk!). This meant going to university as an APO, paid about twice a standard student allowance, automatic membership of the UAS and then preferential 'Green Shield' promotion whilst going through the Cranwell Graduate Entry course. This was quite gentlemanly; some basic foot drill (no rifles, just standards and swords) basic Officer Training, a bit of PT (no running about in cabbage kit like a brain dead grunt), 3 training exercises and then basic flying training to wings standard. The whole Cranwell phase took about a year.
It was a very good deal for the average person - and the pay was very good at university. The promotion aspect occasionally led to some strange quirks - such as the student who went straight from Plt Off to Flt Lt thanks to seniority gained from previous apprentoid time and a year as a Flt Cdt. Another chap who'd done a 4 year course actually outranked his ex-DE blunty Flt Cdr......
But it was expensive. Now there are some who would like young pilots to join without the benefit of 3 years sponsored alcoholism and applied fornication at University (and they've done there best to discourage this by binning the 'real' cadetship scheme for pilots, making UAS life far more difficult and cutting the pay down to virtually nothing - even for 'bursers') - because they allege that TypHoon needs younger, more agile minds than mellow, cynical graduates. Or perhaps it's just that they can get away with paying people rather less if they arrive straight from school.....
So unless you want 3 years of hard sums, the stress of UAS assessment and the same Cranwell regime as the schoolkids, there ain't much point in getting a degree just to win any significant advantages towards your time in the RAF (as we all did!). However, it's an invaluable insurance policy to fall back upon if you are unsuccessful during RAF training and subsequently choose to go elsewhere. Then, if you only intend to stay in for sufficient time to win the 2000hrs-to-ATPL concessions after 10 years or so of excellent flying, you will be highly likely to need a degree on your CV to further your chances of airline employment.
If I were you? Go to University, but choose a pleasant part of the country and do a degree like Geography (it's in English, lots of babes, lots of field trips....). Cetainly not something like Aero Eng at Impossible College in expensive Larndin! Do NOT join the UAS in your 1st or 2nd year, join the OTC or URNU. Then, in your final year, apply to join the RAF. Time it so that you go to DORIS after a post-finals freedom break. Tell them that the reason you didn't join earlier was that you needed to devote as much time as possible to your academic work - and didn't feel that that would leave you sufficient time to do as well at the UAS as you needed to.....a shame, but that's down to the current policies.
You will then go to Cranwell, do the running around and saluting course, then probably go to a UAS 'DE' flight to do nothing but learn to fly and enjoy life! So you'll have a much better chance of making it to FJ training.... It seems that the UASs are going down to the 'Regional EFTS' status which I first suggested in 1990 - looks like I was right again.
It's a tragedy that you'll never enjoy the terrific deal we all had in the 70s - and I really regret that I can no longer recommend that you join the RAF whilst at university. But they've brought that on themselves through thoughtless bean-counting policies, I'm afraid.
Im 1968 the 'traditional' Cranwell course stopped being the preferred entry method (there was also some secondary modern place in Bedfordshire) and we were urged to become 'aerocrats' (yuk!). This meant going to university as an APO, paid about twice a standard student allowance, automatic membership of the UAS and then preferential 'Green Shield' promotion whilst going through the Cranwell Graduate Entry course. This was quite gentlemanly; some basic foot drill (no rifles, just standards and swords) basic Officer Training, a bit of PT (no running about in cabbage kit like a brain dead grunt), 3 training exercises and then basic flying training to wings standard. The whole Cranwell phase took about a year.
It was a very good deal for the average person - and the pay was very good at university. The promotion aspect occasionally led to some strange quirks - such as the student who went straight from Plt Off to Flt Lt thanks to seniority gained from previous apprentoid time and a year as a Flt Cdt. Another chap who'd done a 4 year course actually outranked his ex-DE blunty Flt Cdr......
But it was expensive. Now there are some who would like young pilots to join without the benefit of 3 years sponsored alcoholism and applied fornication at University (and they've done there best to discourage this by binning the 'real' cadetship scheme for pilots, making UAS life far more difficult and cutting the pay down to virtually nothing - even for 'bursers') - because they allege that TypHoon needs younger, more agile minds than mellow, cynical graduates. Or perhaps it's just that they can get away with paying people rather less if they arrive straight from school.....
So unless you want 3 years of hard sums, the stress of UAS assessment and the same Cranwell regime as the schoolkids, there ain't much point in getting a degree just to win any significant advantages towards your time in the RAF (as we all did!). However, it's an invaluable insurance policy to fall back upon if you are unsuccessful during RAF training and subsequently choose to go elsewhere. Then, if you only intend to stay in for sufficient time to win the 2000hrs-to-ATPL concessions after 10 years or so of excellent flying, you will be highly likely to need a degree on your CV to further your chances of airline employment.
If I were you? Go to University, but choose a pleasant part of the country and do a degree like Geography (it's in English, lots of babes, lots of field trips....). Cetainly not something like Aero Eng at Impossible College in expensive Larndin! Do NOT join the UAS in your 1st or 2nd year, join the OTC or URNU. Then, in your final year, apply to join the RAF. Time it so that you go to DORIS after a post-finals freedom break. Tell them that the reason you didn't join earlier was that you needed to devote as much time as possible to your academic work - and didn't feel that that would leave you sufficient time to do as well at the UAS as you needed to.....a shame, but that's down to the current policies.
You will then go to Cranwell, do the running around and saluting course, then probably go to a UAS 'DE' flight to do nothing but learn to fly and enjoy life! So you'll have a much better chance of making it to FJ training.... It seems that the UASs are going down to the 'Regional EFTS' status which I first suggested in 1990 - looks like I was right again.
It's a tragedy that you'll never enjoy the terrific deal we all had in the 70s - and I really regret that I can no longer recommend that you join the RAF whilst at university. But they've brought that on themselves through thoughtless bean-counting policies, I'm afraid.
Gentleman Aviator
I go along with BEags (who appears a close-ish contemporary), but the in-service degree also sounds a good bet, particularly as the RAF training will give contributory "credits". There are details on the OU website, but basically professional aircrew training gets you nearly halfway to a degree. (First degree at OU is 180 points - with no time limit) Staff studies (ISS etc) also attract credits, if you can be @rsed to do them. I've managed to do OU courses while in busy flying jobs, and that's after several decades killing braincells at happy hours......
BTW, El Presidente's idea that all should go to Uni compares to 7% who went when I joined the RAF (and I turned down Uni offers and a Cranwell cadetship [sorry BEags - but I wasn't in Bedfordshire either!] to get into a cockpit asap).
We must get people onto sqns younger; if you're going to work back from an Air Marshal in his 50s (and they were all fg offs once!), you inevitably finish up with a 28 yr old sqn ldr - which you ain't going to get if he's a 26 yr old first tourist!
I'm sure I'd have sh*gg*d and drunk myself into being sent down from Uni anyway, whereas such behaviour was more acceptable (almost compulsory) in a JP - and better paid too - and overseas - and I was flying real aeroplanes!
BTW, El Presidente's idea that all should go to Uni compares to 7% who went when I joined the RAF (and I turned down Uni offers and a Cranwell cadetship [sorry BEags - but I wasn't in Bedfordshire either!] to get into a cockpit asap).
We must get people onto sqns younger; if you're going to work back from an Air Marshal in his 50s (and they were all fg offs once!), you inevitably finish up with a 28 yr old sqn ldr - which you ain't going to get if he's a 26 yr old first tourist!
I'm sure I'd have sh*gg*d and drunk myself into being sent down from Uni anyway, whereas such behaviour was more acceptable (almost compulsory) in a JP - and better paid too - and overseas - and I was flying real aeroplanes!
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There used to be....
In days that are not that far back in the good old days FOLA and FLAG had a real and positive effect on the enlisting and moral of the Greensheilders.........where are they all now? IRA, INLA all perfectly legal and useful organisations seemingly now defunct, is this all we can expect with the influx of graduates?
Just a numbered other
I know some airlines think that pilots come by the pound or kilo..... But until they do, should the thread not be entitled 'Number of pilots' rather than 'Amount'?
And I only made it to 'O' Level.
And I only made it to 'O' Level.
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Thanks guys!
I'm going for uni for the pure fact of going to uni and all the fun that goes with it! For the BSc after my name, accelerated pay and extra chips in the mess
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So its impossible for a university graduate to become an Airship? That explains a lot...
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