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The Warship: Tour of Duty

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The Warship: Tour of Duty

Old 27th Feb 2023, 17:28
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The question I would like to see addressed is why we built two huge aircraft carriers and prepared to send them East although we lacked the ships to screen them. Being then in production myself I cannot say I remember the last time we sent two capital ships to the Far East without any screening, but I read that it did not end happily. Maybe it's as well that one seems to have been crowned Dockyard Queen.
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Old 27th Feb 2023, 19:36
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Originally Posted by Geriaviator
The question I would like to see addressed is why we built two huge aircraft carriers and prepared to send them East although we lacked the ships to screen them. Being then in production myself I cannot say I remember the last time we sent two capital ships to the Far East without any screening, but I read that it did not end happily. Maybe it's as well that one seems to have been crowned Dockyard Queen.
Not sure what you mean about a lack of escorts to shield the capital ship that deployed on Op Fortis? I do acknowledge the incident you are referring to but as that was in WW2, I’m not sure that is a viable comparison?

This multinational force was escorted by:
2x Type 45 destroyers (Defender & Diamond)
2x Type 23 frigates (Richmond and Kent)
1x US Arleigh-Burke class destroyer (The Sullivans)
1x NL De Zeven Provincien class frigate/destroyer (Evertsen)
Plus support from RFA Fort Victoria and RFA Tidespring (which were both CIWS equipped) and most likely an Astute class SSN which is rarely talked about.

Before anyone comments about the US and Dutch ships being there, it is commonplace for UK and European warships to be part of U.S. Carrier Battle Groups in this way, so that is just not an issue for the RN.

Yes PoW has admittedly got technical defects to resolve, but does the decision to build two ships not make complete sense now? When defects on Charles de Gaulle occur, that leaves France without an aircraft carrier completely.
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Old 27th Feb 2023, 21:05
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Originally Posted by stevef
Ronnie 'know wot I mean' Lambert... I found him more and more annoying as the series went on. I've worked alongside a couple of similar guys in the past but at least it was only for five-day eight-hour shifts. I can't imagine being cooped up in the same mess with his like for months on end.
I assume he'd have been weeded out of any submarine posting?
My favourite character was the unflappable radar screen analyst (or whatever they're called). The sort of guy who gives the vibe of being utterly dependable in action.
Too true. When the ****e's hitting the fan you want a good Yorkshireman on the RADAR. They don't get flapped by anything.



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Old 27th Feb 2023, 21:10
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by stevef
Ronnie 'know wot I mean' Lambert... I found him more and more annoying as the series went on. I've worked alongside a couple of similar guys in the past but at least it was only for five-day eight-hour shifts. I can't imagine being cooped up in the same mess with his like for months on end.
I assume he'd have been weeded out of any submarine posting?
My favourite character was the unflappable radar screen analyst (or whatever they're called). The sort of guy who gives the vibe of being utterly dependable in action.


Hear! Hear!

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Old 28th Feb 2023, 07:42
  #125 (permalink)  
 
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This multinational force was escorted by:
2x Type 45 destroyers (Defender & Diamond)
2x Type 23 frigates (Richmond and Kent)

Plus an SSN for sure

And what does that leave elsewhere - its 30% of the RN's total active surface fleet in one spot
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 08:05
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Originally Posted by Asturias56
This multinational force was escorted by:
2x Type 45 destroyers (Defender & Diamond)
2x Type 23 frigates (Richmond and Kent)

Plus an SSN for sure

And what does that leave elsewhere - its 30% of the RN's total active surface fleet in one spot
Still - at the same time, the RN managed to have five patrol ships deployed overseas, three more in UK waters, Montrose in the Gulf along with four tupperware tubs and an RFA - and IIRC, an LSG pootling around as well. Plus the FRE, CASD and duty SSN. This - during a period when the T45s are undergoing a major upgrade and several T23 are in various stages of Lifex refits.

As ever, you seem utterly unable to express what you think the RN isn't doing "because carriers bad, innit?".
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 08:09
  #127 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by stevef
My favourite character was the unflappable radar screen analyst (or whatever they're called). The sort of guy who gives the vibe of being utterly dependable in action.
The gent in question was the Principal Warfare Officer. One of his brethren may be along shortly to remind folk of their god-like qualities.
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 09:23
  #128 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Not_a_boffin
The gent in question was the Principal Warfare Officer. One of his brethren may be along shortly to remind folk of their god-like qualities.
Presumably *a* Principal Warfare Officer (role), rather than *the* Principal Warfare Officer (main man). I would assume the head honcho was a head of department and Lt Cdr...

Last edited by Underbolt; 28th Feb 2023 at 11:56.
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 09:40
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Originally Posted by Underbolt
Presumably *a* Principal Warfare Officer, (role), rather than *the* Principal Warfare Officer (main man). I would assume the head honcho was a head of department and Lt Cdr...
Which the gent in question is (or was).
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 11:55
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I thought we were talking about this chap (who I agree exuded an air of confident professionalism at all times):


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Old 28th Feb 2023, 13:04
  #131 (permalink)  
 
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My mistake. I thought I'd seen him as a two and a half.
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 13:05
  #132 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Geriaviator
The question I would like to see addressed is why we built two huge aircraft carriers and prepared to send them East although we lacked the ships to screen them. Being then in production myself I cannot say I remember the last time we sent two capital ships to the Far East without any screening, but I read that it did not end happily. Maybe it's as well that one seems to have been crowned Dockyard Queen.
Never mind the ships to screen them, we built them without the sailors to man them nor the jets to equip them.
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Old 28th Feb 2023, 13:25
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Originally Posted by Underbolt
Presumably *a* Principal Warfare Officer (role), rather than *the* Principal Warfare Officer (main man). I would assume the head honcho was a head of department and Lt Cdr...
The Head of the Warfare Department was always the XO when I was at sea.

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Old 28th Feb 2023, 13:38
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Originally Posted by Not_a_boffin
Still - at the same time, the RN managed to have five patrol ships deployed overseas, three more in UK waters, Montrose in the Gulf along with four tupperware tubs and an RFA - and IIRC, an LSG pootling around as well. Plus the FRE, CASD and duty SSN. This - during a period when the T45s are undergoing a major upgrade and several T23 are in various stages of Lifex refits.

As ever, you seem utterly unable to express what you think the RN isn't doing "because carriers bad, innit?".
A bit harsh perhaps - he generally doesn't do too badly for an allegedly Italian based civilian.

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Old 1st Mar 2023, 07:59
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"As ever, you seem utterly unable to express what you think the RN isn't doing "because carriers bad, innit?"."

Not bad - just unaffordable and not what we need


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Old 1st Mar 2023, 09:19
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Originally Posted by Asturias56
"As ever, you seem utterly unable to express what you think the RN isn't doing "because carriers bad, innit?"."

Not bad - just unaffordable and not what we need
Still waiting for your definition of what we need - and most importantly why.

I note that having whinged about "what was left elsewhere", you've not responded to what the RN was actually doing over that period.
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Old 1st Mar 2023, 09:20
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Something I found interesting were the remarks about people moving on.

On average (if it can be as basic as that), what percentage of the crew are changed for each sailing?
I appreciate sailings may be months apart so they have to do something in between... but that must mean that fresh learning curve is present at the start of every voyage and is it the same for all vessels?

.
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Old 1st Mar 2023, 09:51
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Originally Posted by Not_a_boffin
Still waiting for your definition of what we need - and most importantly why.

I note that having whinged about "what was left elsewhere", you've not responded to what the RN was actually doing over that period.
We're never going to agree on this NAB - you believe one thing I believe another. And nothing either of say will change our respective minds. Any point I make you disagree, any point you make I disagree.

Let's just avoid it descending into one of those "he said, she said" arguments that happen all too often on bulletin boards





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Old 1st Mar 2023, 09:56
  #139 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 622
Something I found interesting were the remarks about people moving on.

On average (if it can be as basic as that), what percentage of the crew are changed for each sailing?
I appreciate sailings may be months apart so they have to do something in between... but that must mean that fresh learning curve is present at the start of every voyage and is it the same for all vessels?.
I think it was ever thus. Every military unit has a constant turnover of people for many reasons.
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Old 1st Mar 2023, 10:01
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Originally Posted by Asturias56
We're never going to agree on this NAB - you believe one thing I believe another. And nothing either of say will change our respective minds. Any point I make you disagree, any point you make I disagree.

Let's just avoid it descending into one of those "he said, she said" arguments that happen all too often on bulletin boards
The difference is NAB talks about things that actually happen. You talk about things that only exist in your head.
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