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New French SSBN Fleet

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New French SSBN Fleet

Old 23rd Feb 2021, 07:46
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New French SSBN Fleet

Seems a lot faster than the UK Trident replacement programme - assuming it sticks to schedule of course....

https://www.defensenews.com/naval/20...-missile-subs/

France to begin building new ballistic missile subs

PARIS — France has launched the program for its Navy’s third-generation nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarines, which will see four vessels eventually delivered to the service.

The Navy is expected to received the first submarine in 2035, with the other three following at a schedule of one every five years.

These four boats, known in France as SNLE (sous-marin nucléaire lanceur d’engin) “will replace the current [ones] without a break,” Armed Forces Minister Florence Parly announced last week. She said the subs will sail until 2090. “The last sailors to patrol on this SNLE third generation have not yet been born.”

The contracting authorities are the DGA procurement agency and the Alternative Energies and Atomic Energy Commission. The project management will lie with Naval Group and TechnicAtome, the latter being the prime contractor for the nuclear boiler room.

Thales announced it signed a memorandum of understanding with the DGA for the development of a complete sonar suite for the boats “based on disruptive technologies that represent a significant break from the systems in service today.”

The company will provide new-generation flank arrays and bow-mounted sonars; a towed linear array based on optical technology; as well as intercept arrays, echo sounder technology and underwater telephones. The company said the new sonar suite will be incrementally deployed, with the first versions installed on the current SNLEs.

Parly said the new submarines will be “slightly longer and heavier” than the current Le Triomphant class, which first sailed in 1995 and will continue to do so until 2050. She added that the vessels will “hear better and defend themselves better whilst at the same time being more silent: They will not make more noise than a school of shrimp.”

Parly noted that given the extreme length of this program, France will “maintain a margin for evolutions [in the design], indispensable to take account of technological breakthroughs that we cannot forecast today — I’m thinking notably of cyber defense, improvements in acoustic stealth and the development of better-performing sensors.”......
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 08:39
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Since when have submarines been classed as aircraft,this forum is military AVIATION.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 09:11
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If you look around the thread is more accurately "military"

and, after all, these vessels are designed to fire a ballistic missile - which is "aviation" I believe
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 09:13
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"Seems a lot faster than the UK Trident replacement programme - assuming it sticks to schedule of course...."

What struck me was that they intend to keep the current SSBM's in service to 2050 - that's 55 years - a lot longer than the shelf life of either the USN or UK boats
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 09:35
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Since when have submarines been classed as aircraft,this forum is military AVIATION.
And a lot of military pilots hunt and track such boats....
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 10:06
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Originally Posted by spitfirek5054 View Post
Since when have submarines been classed as aircraft,this forum is military AVIATION.
Aspects of naval aviation with the then Aeronavale Super Frelon helicopter protecting the SSBN Fleet when they set sail from their base. I imagine that role is probably taken over by the NH90 NFH Caiman.

Also the cough cough C-160 Transalls act as TACAMO

cheers
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 11:28
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If you can have a thread about bloody BBQ's, I am sure you can have a thread about subs.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 13:28
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Seems a lot faster than the UK Trident replacement programme - assuming it sticks to schedule of course....
If the French can avoid scope creep (customers demanding changes and/or extra features during development and even during building) in such a long project, they may succeed in sticking to schedule and the project may be unique in the annals of defense procurement.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 15:02
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Seems a lot faster than the UK Trident replacement programme - assuming it sticks to schedule of course....

.
I suspect the UK timescale is also strongly affected by the size of the annual funding alongside other UK military spending.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 16:22
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Originally Posted by Asturias56 View Post
"Seems a lot faster than the UK Trident replacement programme - assuming it sticks to schedule of course...."

What struck me was that they intend to keep the current SSBM's in service to 2050 - that's 55 years - a lot longer than the shelf life of either the USN or UK boats
Afaik, US carriers are in service for 50 years and of course the youngest B-52 is coming up to its 60th anniversary, so 55 years does not seem out of line.
More broadly, these subs operate on sustained long patrols, so very predictable stress patterns. Combined with their well above average maintenance and support, I'd see no reason they could not go on for much longer..
Probably system obsolescence is an economic issue, although I've not seen any solid information on that. The report some years back that the Minuteman silos use computers working with 8" floppy disks does give a little perspective though.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 16:38
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There was a discussion on here a while back - I think the Vanguards had a design shelf life of around 25 years (which was at least 5 years shorter than the USN "Ohio's") but that was stretched by overhauls to a target date of around 2028 for the first "Dreadnaught" - which would mean around 35 years in service.

God knows at what rate they can be produced
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 18:27
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A Mark 54 torpedo can be dropped from a Poseiden....That's aviation-related...
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 21:12
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Originally Posted by etudiant View Post
Afaik, US carriers are in service for 50 years and of course the youngest B-52 is coming up to its 60th anniversary, so 55 years does not seem out of line.
More broadly, these subs operate on sustained long patrols, so very predictable stress patterns. Combined with their well above average maintenance and support, I'd see no reason they could not go on for much longer..
Probably system obsolescence is an economic issue, although I've not seen any solid information on that. The report some years back that the Minuteman silos use computers working with 8" floppy disks does give a little perspective though.
If it works why change?
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 22:19
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No harm in posting about subs here.
Gotta know what you're hunting...
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 22:44
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In the French language the airplane elevator is called « la gouverne de profondeur », litterally "the depth control surface". I think it is inherited from submarines, too
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 22:50
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Originally Posted by air pig View Post
If it works why change?
Even better, obsolete systems provide significant security advantages. They don't have internet links and are correspondingly very difficult to hack.
I believe the Kremlin went back to fully mechanical typewriters as a security measure, so the concept is well understood.
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Old 23rd Feb 2021, 23:23
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Originally Posted by air pig View Post
If it works why change?

Often simply parts are no longer available or the manufacturer has long gone. Remember original manufacturers will only support a product up until a certain point then will cease spares manufacture, after all its in their own interest, why keep supporting a thirty year old product If there is money to be made flogging them a brand new sub and the spares for that.
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Old 24th Feb 2021, 02:08
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It could be said that subs fly when submerged.

https://www.stirling-dynamics.com/wo...arine-control/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics...ing/hydroplane
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Old 26th Feb 2021, 21:35
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
And a lot of military pilots hunt and track such boats....
Correct, all submarines are targets until identified as friend or foe.
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Old 27th Feb 2021, 10:49
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Originally Posted by Geordie_Expat View Post
If you can have a thread about bloody BBQ's, I am sure you can have a thread about subs.
Winner of the PPRuNe post of the week.
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