USA Seeks Right to Bomb terrorists in Kenya

[t43562]

Originally Posted by Easy Street

That is quite the straw man argument. Where did I say 'no outside support'? Foreign aid (I'm against the cut from 0.7%) and UN-backed military activity both have a role to play, but both have their limits in effectiveness. 19 years of Western involvement in Afghanistan haven’t dampened the influence of the religious zealots biding their time for eventual resumption of power, and many would say the countries doing the intervening now bear the greatest moral responsibility for supporting the migrants and refugees displaced by that extended conflict. That pattern is likely to be repeated anywhere that society lacks the ability to resist 'terrorists' - who ultimately are simply using force to achieve political ends with which you disagree. Things don't look great in Mali either from what I can gather. As for birth control, those in control of developing countries have no incentive whatsoever to implement it as long as emigration and aid allow them to ignore the consequences of overpopulation. Change in Western societies has always been generated from within, largely in response to privations suffered by sections of the population. As long as regimes abroad can insulate themselves from such internal pressures then why should we expect anything to change? Continually intervening in non-decisive ways (realistically, the only ways possible within the legal, ethical, societal and resource constraints under which Western militaries operate) prolongs instability and drives population movement while delivering no sustainable outcome.

Sorry for that. Perhaps I misunderstood and fired off a response too quickly. I am a colonial from one of the bits that fell apart so I take it all too personally. The UK's civilisation fell apart when the Romans left - a Roman would have considered the situation hopeless but it wasn't in the long run and they had a huge impact on the outcome. I just think that these changes that are needed work in terms of generations.

I think there is a sort of "minimum energy" solution to the problem of governing in a society that has a tiny middle class which is despotism. In other words every other type of government requires too much artificial support to be able to function continuously. So it's a natural state that everything tends to return to. If some lucky situation occurs - like great wealth by conquest or trade or being invaded by someone more organised or whatever then the "fire" might get started that will allow other better forms of government to become the minimum energy state. One the whole though, people seem to get fixed ideas and only when they die off can the next lot really act on the change so it takes generations. That's my unscientific viewpoint.