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So did you ever get lost ?

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So did you ever get lost ?

Old 15th Aug 2017, 16:08
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: S W France
Age: 75
Posts: 189
Not so much as lost, but unable to update the DR position for a long time. For example, in the 60s on a "weather recce" sortie in the Far East, I was able to get a Top of Climb fix but no update to the Air Position Indicator for over three hours. Operating with Met forecast winds of "Variable/20 kts" from Sea Level to FL500. Search pattern was within 30 miles of an unfriendly coast. Eventually it was light enough to get a Pinpoint on a reef. Only 10 miles in error, Lucky!

Another example in the 70s was on transit from UK to Porto out of VOR and Decca coverage. The API decided to run away west at 400kts and the Radio Compass failed.We went as low as we dared to try to get below cloud to use the Drift Sight but cloudbase too low. We then climbed as high as we could to try to get a Sun Shot, but did not break cloud. So it was Manual Airplot and calling the aircraft ahead for the wind. The Station Commander, who was along for the ride, was somewhat puzzled to see the Radio Compass Receiver in bits on the Nav Table as I vainly cleaned the contacts on the valves to try to get it to work and get a Consol Line.

Even into the 80s you could be in trouble if the Doppler failed on the Atlantic after leaving the coast en route to Goose Bay. After leaving TACAN range you could not
get a longitude check until south of Iceland. Twice ,when this happened to me, the Met forecast was 270/40 which turned out to be 270/120. Fortunately on both occasions I was accompanied by either Buccaneers or Harriers who could update me to the actual winds, saving a potential 100 mile error.
Tengah Type is offline  
Old 15th Aug 2017, 23:30
  #102 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,532
Fortunately Tengah Type was a very skilled navigator of the 'old school' and knew all the esoteric tricks of his trade.

Unlike this chap, who managed to get some 510nm off track in a VC10:

From A Little VC10derness:

Incidents and Accidents
BEagle is offline  
Old 16th Aug 2017, 00:14
  #103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: S W France
Age: 75
Posts: 189
BEagle thank you for your kind words. I will buy you a beer when we next meet at TBs.
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Old 16th Aug 2017, 08:37
  #104 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: west midlands
Age: 61
Posts: 50
Lost??

Surely only ever temporarily unsure of current position ??
Q-SKI is offline  
Old 16th Aug 2017, 09:11
  #105 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,532
TT, no snags, mate. Some of the newer navigators on our fleet surprised me by having less knowledge of 'traditional' subjects such as astro than did typical V-force navigators. Probably due to a change in emphasis in the syllabus at Finningley to suit the Buccaneer / Phantom / Tornado force?

Haven't been to TBs for a few months - are you likely to be over for the next one?
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Old 30th Aug 2017, 14:25
  #106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Eastbourne
Age: 81
Posts: 56
Lost??

Early days on Canberras my much more experienced Nav never got lost. He just 'found an MPP using the Gibson method'. Later on I realised it was the same thing!
Four Turbo is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2017, 17:19
  #107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 4,673
'traditional' subjects such as astro than did typical V-force navigators.
On boring night navexs my navigators would let me down the back to try some astro fixs.

My cocked hats where next month's navexs.
Fareastdriver is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2017, 22:14
  #108 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,622
Four Turbo, and a force balance dangleometer
Pontius Navigator is offline  
Old 30th Aug 2017, 22:36
  #109 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 626
A cocked hat made up of an isogonal, an FIR boundary and a position line found in the bottom of a nav. bag left over from a previous trip.
oxenos is offline  
Old 31st Aug 2017, 14:25
  #110 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: the middle of everywhere
Posts: 145
Apologies to those who know what they are talking about but herewith an anecdote from my late father (my memory is foggy and my terminology is more than likely incorrect):
Overheard a middle eastern exchange pilot requesting a bearing from the tower. Duly given by tower.
Repeated request for bearing. Duly given, same as previous.
Repeated request for bearing. Duly given, same as previous.
Tower asks if he has any visual references. Replies that there is a haystack on left wing. Transpires was lost on taxiway............
son of brommers is offline  
Old 1st Sep 2017, 07:47
  #111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,532
At RAFC, one student returns from his FNT (he passed it) and briefs his mates on the low level section:

"This railway line is very hard to make out, but I was just able to do so"

"Err, Phil - that's the England/Wales border!"
BEagle is offline  
Old 1st Sep 2017, 12:38
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: South East of Penge
Age: 70
Posts: 1,400
Beags a mutual mate of ours ( N..... Sp.....) was flying a dual navex in a Towers J.P. when his instructor pointed out:

"And if you look down to your left Sp..... ,you will see we are paralleling a disused railway line".

This he duly did and also spotted a locomotive and trucks in progress.

"Oh, yes Sir -and look! There's a disused train going along it!

N.S. resigned shortly afterward and went to sea instead.
Haraka is offline  

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