View Poll Results: Who was the most hopeless Defence Sec?
Duncan \"Manned aircraft are obsolete\" Sandys
14
13.86%
Denis \"TSR2\" Healey
31
30.69%
John \"CVS\" Nott
14
13.86%
Michael \"Ranting Nutter\" Portillo
13
12.87%
Geoff \"Of course we don\'t need FA2\" Hoon
29
28.71%
Voters: 101. This poll is closed
Which Defence Secretary was the worst?
Join Date: May 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's always a flaw in the plan 
More seriously I agree that pilots didn't join the RAF to go to sea - but how serious is this as a morale issue. I spent some time last year on a course with some groundcrew who were going to be at sea on a carrier during Saif Sareea and they were dreading it. I suppose that this is one strong argument in favour of scrapping SHAR - we don't need to send RAF pilots to sea as a matter of routine as we can just send a navy squadron with the same plane.
Incidentally does anyone know if the current 2 x RN squadrons will be exclusively assigned to carrier ops or will there be moves afoot for a truly joint organistion? Eg while 801 squadron are flying from Italy bombing Serbs (for example) an RAF squadron will be at sea doing their thing?
PS - Archimedes - you wouldn't happen to hail from the same purple establishment campus outside Watchfield as I do would you? (I'm not at the purple place but the academic place but I am spending insane amounts of time there at the moment)
More seriously I agree that pilots didn't join the RAF to go to sea - but how serious is this as a morale issue. I spent some time last year on a course with some groundcrew who were going to be at sea on a carrier during Saif Sareea and they were dreading it. I suppose that this is one strong argument in favour of scrapping SHAR - we don't need to send RAF pilots to sea as a matter of routine as we can just send a navy squadron with the same plane.
Incidentally does anyone know if the current 2 x RN squadrons will be exclusively assigned to carrier ops or will there be moves afoot for a truly joint organistion? Eg while 801 squadron are flying from Italy bombing Serbs (for example) an RAF squadron will be at sea doing their thing?
PS - Archimedes - you wouldn't happen to hail from the same purple establishment campus outside Watchfield as I do would you? (I'm not at the purple place but the academic place but I am spending insane amounts of time there at the moment)
Last edited by Jimlad; 29th May 2002 at 20:59.
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: A PC!
Posts: 594
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I see one early poster saying that "Healey was just doing what he was told to by the Americans".
If you believe Peter Wright (author of "Spycatcher") then Healey was actually doing what the USSR told him to! Healey and Wilson were both "ex" communist party members.
OK, so if TSR2 was not the way ahead, why cut up the jigs and prototypes and shred the plans? My mother in law actually had to shred the plans as she was working at MoD at the time (claim to fame?). The only reason for this would be to ensure that the project could not be ressurected.
So we order F111 - then cancel - just in case that gives us an edge over the Warsaw Pact?
Conspiracy theory or fact - I tend to go with fact, myself.
If you believe Peter Wright (author of "Spycatcher") then Healey was actually doing what the USSR told him to! Healey and Wilson were both "ex" communist party members.
OK, so if TSR2 was not the way ahead, why cut up the jigs and prototypes and shred the plans? My mother in law actually had to shred the plans as she was working at MoD at the time (claim to fame?). The only reason for this would be to ensure that the project could not be ressurected.
So we order F111 - then cancel - just in case that gives us an edge over the Warsaw Pact?
Conspiracy theory or fact - I tend to go with fact, myself.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: preston
Posts: 433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
worst defence secretary
this post has become a slanging match between the 3 services maybe the canadians had the right idea after all in amalgamating all 3 services! but i digress, in my opinion the worst one i thought in my short time in the raf(23 years 3 months 2 weeks) was tom king, reason? well when i saw him on the tv during the gulf war, you know the one it was in all the papers i believe john wayne won it single handed, sorry back to the real world, king had no prescence or charisma when i saw him ont telly with sir david craig(he was cds at the time) i thought what a pair of muppetts!
Dear 'canberra'
Please learn some basic English grammar if you're going to post on PPRuNe! Most people will ignore the txt msg style which lazy children think that they can get away with in this day and age. I (that's 'I', not 'i' incidentally) don't wish to appear too much of a pompous old git, but people simply won't take you seriously if you can't write in English.
Please learn some basic English grammar if you're going to post on PPRuNe! Most people will ignore the txt msg style which lazy children think that they can get away with in this day and age. I (that's 'I', not 'i' incidentally) don't wish to appear too much of a pompous old git, but people simply won't take you seriously if you can't write in English.
Last edited by BEagle; 18th Jun 2002 at 05:46.
but beagul yoo shud kno that he was being delishusly ironic and was also making a very fair stab at composing and writing the longest PPRUNE post ever which was all in one sentence as it were and you didn't get it which leads me to conclude that i must be kleverer than what you are cos i notissed that there were spellong mastiks as well as the ironically orientified grammer and have decided that anything what he can do i can do better (bolloks! i almost writed i with a capitul letter just then but i noticed just in time) blimey i have renewed respeckt for canberra cos its actually quite exhausting writifiying in this manner and style and you are a pompus old gitt wotever that mean and a muppet too also what r u doing up at 5.46 editing your post you are sposed 2 b a glamorous jet pilot and shouldnt you be shagging birds and recuvring from mega drinking sesh with flaming drambuey snortters and gorrilasnots and other posh drinks
Last edited by Jackonicko; 18th Jun 2002 at 09:19.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: preston
Posts: 433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
punctuation
srry 4 the punctuation, only got 2 o levels. u must be ether an x or serving fast jet (is there a slow jet and why is it that only uk uses the term?) cos u sure are arrogant, or are u a bitter and twisted failed fj jockey, get a life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
Good point about the silly 'fast jet' appellation used by the RAF.
It came in when aircraft like the Jaguar, Harrier, Buccaneer and Tornado came into service. The fighter pilot ego simply couldn't come to terms with flying 'bombers', so a new description was introduced to keep the little dears happy.
At one point in the '70s, 208 Sqn at Honington used to say they were going to practise 'DFGA' tactics - Day Fighter Ground Attack! In Buccaneers?
I fly a jet which is pretty fast. It's a fast jet, but not a Fast Jet, 'twould seem................
It came in when aircraft like the Jaguar, Harrier, Buccaneer and Tornado came into service. The fighter pilot ego simply couldn't come to terms with flying 'bombers', so a new description was introduced to keep the little dears happy.
At one point in the '70s, 208 Sqn at Honington used to say they were going to practise 'DFGA' tactics - Day Fighter Ground Attack! In Buccaneers?
I fly a jet which is pretty fast. It's a fast jet, but not a Fast Jet, 'twould seem................
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,242
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tarzan
Come on chaps, aren't we missing somethig? The reason that MH stormed out of a cabinet meeting and generally set himself against the leadership of the day was nothing more than him setting up his stall for a run at becoming the next PM, yes?
